A Soldier On Obama

Brainster

Penultimate Amazing
Brainster
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
21,987


That's effective; I'd love to see the McCain campaign pick it up and use it as an official campaign ad. Stick around to the end; he's not just talking the talk.
 
Brainster said:


That's effective.
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Brainster, good link, and I don't want to sound like a downer, but I'm not so sure it is effective.

McCain's been riding the IRAQ pony pretty hard. He has repeatedly made clear the differences between Obama and himself on this issue, and I think that the American people understand the difference, as well.

What would be more effective is a discussion of what he is going to do to help that young man prosper in today's economic climate.

Just an opinion from a helpful McCain supporter.................
 
So freaking what? How are the Iraqi people the least bit more free now with their infrastructure blown to bits and foreign human trafficers crowding them out of their jobs and trying to suck out their natural resources at a bargain price?

It was a mistake going in, regardless what the troops on the ground are seeing now. The troops are doing what they see needs to be done, for the most part, but they are seeing the tactical situation and no more.

Suppose this fool can tell us what the threat was that we had to destroy the country in the first palce? Can he tell us how many cultrues have had democracy imposed on them at the end of a bayonet by a country they had never threatened?

Argumentum ad populum. Nothing more.

Strategicly, it was a mistake. You can't change that by the heroism of those paying for the mistake.

That's part of the problem with Republicans. They can't grasp the difference between strategy and tactics.

Tacticly, we are doing reasonably well inIraq because there are still NCOs and officers trained up under Clinton and Shinseki on active duty to babysit the rejects that the Bush policies have forced the services to start accepting.

Strategicly, we screwed the pooch by appointing a brain-damaged airplane driver with no military expertise to designate the targets.
 
Brainster said:


That's effective; I'd love to see the McCain campaign pick it up and use it as an official campaign ad. Stick around to the end; he's not just talking the talk.
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Stick around until the end, simply because he has a missing leg? I didn't know you were swayed by such appalling appeals to emotion. He could be missing every important organ in his body, and that still wouldn't change the fact of whether the Iraq War was a terrible mistake or not. This is just as pathetic as when Michael Moore follows around the grieving mother of a dead soldier, seemingly oblivious to the fact that for every anti-war mother there is a pro-war one. Disgraceful.

The Skeptic bus must come to a halt at the same time as the straight-talk express.
 
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leftysergeant said:
That's part of the problem with Republicans. They can't grasp the difference between strategy and tactics.
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Looking at some of the ridiculous threads in this sub-forum, you could say the same thing about Democrats.

leftysergeant said:
Tacticly, we are doing reasonably well inIraq because there are still NCOs and officers trained up under Clinton and Shinseki on active duty to babysit the rejects that the Bush policies have forced the services to start accepting.
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Shame on you sir, for shame.

Denigrating the men and women in uniform currently fighting in Iraq, just to further your selfish political agena.

What a disgrace to the Democratic cause.

:nope:
 
I'm a retired NCO myself. I am saying that the standards in the military have deteriorated badly since I was on active duty, starting wirth the brain-dead move that GHWB made when he started reducing the number of active-duty troops. Dummy decided that the best place to make the cuts was in the ranks of mid-career NCOs. We're still paying for that.

Does the name David Mortari ring a bell?
 
Max Cleland is walking the walk 300% more. Let's ask him his opinion of the Iraq War.
 
leftysergeant said:
So freaking what?
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There you have it, folks. The view of the left.

leftysergeant said:
How are the Iraqi people the least bit more free now with their infrastructure blown to bits and foreign human trafficers crowding them out of their jobs and trying to suck out their natural resources at a bargain price?
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:rolleyes: Don't you think you overplayed the hyperbole a bit? :D

leftysergeant said:
Suppose this fool can tell us what the threat was that we had to destroy the country in the first palce?
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So when does the spitting begin?

leftysergeant said:
Argumentum ad populum. Nothing more.
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Argumentum ad ignorance. Nothing more. :D

leftysergeant said:
You can't change that by the heroism of those paying for the mistake.
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Come on lefty. Be honest. You don't actually believe they are heroic. Nor does your candidate Obama. Afterall, he willing accepts large campaign contributions from people (like Jodie Evans of CODEPINK) who called the terrorists in Iraq "freedom fighters" and say vile things about our troops.

leftysergeant said:
That's part of the problem with Republicans. They can't grasp the difference between strategy and tactics.
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The problem with Obama supporters is they can't grasp reality and THINK they understand strategy and tactics. :D
 
Brainster said:


That's effective; I'd love to see the McCain campaign pick it up and use it as an official campaign ad. Stick around to the end; he's not just talking the talk.
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I like the way his eyes are strolling as if he's reading a teleprompter or
something. "Good Soldier", indeed. :)
 
leftysergeant said:
Strategicly, it was a mistake. You can't change that by the heroism of those paying for the mistake.
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No, the problem is that people on the left decided that Iraq was a certain failure and a huge mistake before we even went in, and ranted and chanted this mantra for so long that it became "fact" in their minds, despite reality. Now you guys exist in a world where "of course it was a huge mistake! Duh?" is just common sense to you, and you don't even consider that anyone could or should feel otherwise without being morons.

The term ivory towers comes to mind again and again with regards to these forums, and lefties in general. You talked down the invasion of IRAQ from day one and until it became undeniable fact in your minds and since then all your arguments are built on that foundation. You all are surrounded by simliar minded sycophants who agree and you are sheltered from reality. I often come to this group to read the latest news and opinions, and leave wondering just what the hell planet some of you live on, where your sides "opinions" are the "reality" of the day. All of them. And anyone who disagrees is a moron to be ridiculed.
 
Whiplash said:
No, the problem is that people on the left decided that Iraq was a certain failure and a huge mistake before we even went in, and ranted and chanted this mantra for so long that it became "fact" in their minds, despite reality. Now you guys exist in a world where "of course it was a huge mistake! Duh?" is just common sense to you, and you don't even consider that anyone could or should feel otherwise without being morons.
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If someone thought the war in Iraq was a mistake from the start, why should they change their minds? Even if everything went perfectly, and Iraq became a model representative government, it doesn't change that, to them, the initial reasons for the war were still a mistake.
 
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Yet another "No, I have the biggest dick... I mean, machine gun!" thread.
 
elbe said:
If someone thought the war in Iraq was a mistake from the start, why should they change their minds? Even if everything went perfectly, and Iraq became a model representative government, it doesn't change that, to them, the initial reasons for the war were still a mistake.
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Is that argument sort of like Obama saying that even knowing everything we know today about how well the surge and change in tactics worked in altering the situation in Iraq from apparent defeat to utter victory, he'd still have been against the surge and change in tactics back in January 2007? Sorry, but that just sounds like Stuck On Stupid. :D
 
WildCat said:
What infrastructure was blown to bits?
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Water treatment, electrical generation, sewers, hospitals, roads, bridges. you know, the stuff that makes the difference between a functioning modern nation and a Third world disaster zone.

All that stuff the the right wing says we are building for the iraqis? Guess who broke it in the first place.

Guess who shut down all the state industries, including the country's only cewment factory.

Think about it. What good did we really do them?
 
BeAChooser said:
Is that argument sort of like Obama saying that even knowing everything we know today about how well the surge and change in tactics worked in altering the situation in Iraq from apparent defeat to utter victory, he'd still have been against the surge and change in tactics back in January 2007? Sorry, but that just sounds like Stuck On Stupid. :D
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I feel like this may very well be a masochistic post on my part, but I think that's the trend I've been following lately.

Without actually getting into the politics of it: If, hypothetically, Obama was morally opposed to the war in Iraq (I have no idea if he was opposed "Morally", hence hypothetically) wouldn't a change after just because it turned out well be ethically questionable? Must the ends always justify the means? If, instead, the government took a police route and never started the "war on terror", but managed to capture and try Bin Laden, would that make everyone who believed war was the answer automatically wrong and "stupid"?
 
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BeAChooser said:
There you have it, folks.
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Yup, a Republican lecturing a soldier on strategy while he believes that Rummy had an occassional rational thought during trhe six years he diddle around with the defense structures.

The problem with Obama supporters is they can't grasp reality and THINK they understand strategy and tactics. :D
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Wouldn't hurt you to learn something about military strategy. Trey reading Vom Kriege. I don't think Clausewitz would give W or Gates very high marks right about now.

I doubt McSame ever read Clausewitz, either. He says some dumb stuff about the Vietnam war having been winable. That is stuck on stupid.
 
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