A Dozen Questions For I.D. Creationists

[MrFrankZito]

12 Questions For I.D. Creationists – ideas, inspiration and some verbiage from “Why Darwin Matters” by Michael Shermer.

1. Why do males have nipples?

2. Why did the intelligent designer design the male uterus? (the remnant of an undeveloped female reproductive organ hanging from the prostate gland)

3. Why do humans get goose bumps? (which are a physiological method by which to puff-up fur)

4. Why do some humans get wisdom teeth?

5. Why do 8% of humans have a thirteenth set of ribs, just as is the case with chimpanzees and gorillas?

6. Why does the human genome contain junk DNA, repeated copies of useless DNA, orphan genes, gene fragments, tandem repeats and pseudogenes?

7. Why do the geological strata indicate an evolutionary history to life? For example, why does no geological stratum simultaneously contain a trilobite and a fossil horse?

8. A bat’s wing has exactly the same set of bones as a whale’s flipper and a human arm. Why? Additionally, why does a bat’s wing not have such similarity to either an insect’s wing or a bird’s wing?

9. How, precisely, is “intelligent design” accomplished. As an example, how did the designer design vertebrates?

10. How much microevolution is allowed? Can species only evolve to subspecies? Or, does the intelligent designer get involved at the level of genus, from which species then can evolve naturally?

11. If you reject Young Earth Creationism, this question is for you: At what stages, specifically, did the intelligent designer intervene? Additionally, did the intelligent designer modify the DNA of an entire population, or only a single creature, from which an entirely new population was born?

12. Who designed the intelligent designer? (no theology allowed; remember, intelligent design is science)

 

[Bob Klase]

12. Who designed the intelligent designer? (no theology allowed; remember, intelligent design is science)

One problem with at least some questions like that is that science doesn't have all the answers either. #12 in particular has no answer from science, so I'd expect IDer's/creationists to respond with "how did life start" since they ask that already and science doesn't have the answer (yet).

 

[Loss Leader]

I don't actually know the answer to any of those but I can tell you that with respect to #3, humans have more hair folicles than apes.

And women have more hair folicles than men.

 

[Earthborn]

Questions 1 and 2 are about embryonic development and are therefore not relevant to ID or creationism.

Question 7, 8 and 10 are only relevant to Creationism, not to Intelligent Design which just shows that one should not carelessly confuse the two. Just because two paradigms have similar silliness quotients does not make them the same thing. Intelligent Design does not exclude the possibility of evolutionary change over millions of years, it just claims that it isn't enough to explain some mechanisms.

Question 9 demands too much detail that can reasonably given. You also can't answer "precisely" how the Petronas Towers were designed, but we know they were.

Too many "why" questions. Too many questions that have no answer at all, even from evolutionary science.

 

[Soapy Sam]

Well, evolution very largely is about embryonic development, but I suspect ID/Creationists would answer q 1 and 2 with some dismissive hand waving.

8% of humans have spare ribs? Really? I had no idea it was so common.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Questions 1 and 2 are about embryonic development and are therefore not relevant to ID or creationism.

Question 7, 8 and 10 are only relevant to Creationism, not to Intelligent Design which just shows that one should not carelessly confuse the two. Just because two paradigms have similar silliness quotients does not make them the same thing. Intelligent Design does not exclude the possibility of evolutionary change over millions of years, it just claims that it isn't enough to explain some mechanisms.

Question 9 demands too much detail that can reasonably given. You also can't answer "precisely" how the Petronas Towers were designed, but we know they were.

Too many "why" questions. Too many questions that have no answer at all, even from evolutionary science.

The point is that if something was designed, why all these left over traits that serve no purpose in humans? The theory should account for the design flaws as well as its strengths.

 

[Katana]

I also think that it's fascinating that human embryos have gill slits and a tail during early development.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

You're posting these questions here where 99% of the members support evolution?

 

[MrFrankZito]

I was aiming for a higher-brain-power creationist audience.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

You could try www.christianforums.com but you might not get any responses apart from flaming since these questions have been asked and answered and their answeres refuted over and over on that forum.

 

[Loss Leader]

I also think that it's fascinating that human embryos have gill slits and a tail during early development.

Hey, what's that word for the theory that embryonic development follows the path of evolution?

 

[Cuddles]

[ID mode]

12 Questions For I.D. Creationists – ideas, inspiration and some verbiage from “Why Darwin Matters” by Michael Shermer.

1. Why do males have nipples?

Because they were designed before the seperate genders were.

2. Why did the intelligent designer design the male uterus? (the remnant of an undeveloped female reproductive organ hanging from the prostate gland)

Same as 1

3. Why do humans get goose bumps? (which are a physiological method by which to puff-up fur)

To keep us warm. Was that a serious question?

4. Why do some humans get wisdom teeth?

They're all supposed to. Those that don't are mutants and will be corrected for at a later stage.

5. Why do 8% of humans have a thirteenth set of ribs, just as is the case with chimpanzees and gorillas?

Same as 4.

6. Why does the human genome contain junk DNA, repeated copies of useless DNA, orphan genes, gene fragments, tandem repeats and pseudogenes?

It's not junk, we just don't know what it does yet.

7. Why do the geological strata indicate an evolutionary history to life? For example, why does no geological stratum simultaneously contain a trilobite and a fossil horse?

Because life does have an evolutionary history.

8. A bat’s wing has exactly the same set of bones as a whale’s flipper and a human arm. Why? Additionally, why does a bat’s wing not have such similarity to either an insect’s wing or a bird’s wing?

Because there was space for another type of flying creature and the Designer decided to make a new one starting from mammals instead of just using an old design in case this one worked better.

9. How, precisely, is “intelligent design” accomplished. As an example, how did the designer design vertebrates?

We cannot know the ways of the designer, but it probably involves adjusting DNA each generation according to what he wants it to do.

10. How much microevolution is allowed? Can species only evolve to subspecies? Or, does the intelligent designer get involved at the level of genus, from which species then can evolve naturally?

Any organism can do evolve as much as it likes, as long as the designer makes it do so.

11. If you reject Young Earth Creationism, this question is for you: At what stages, specifically, did the intelligent designer intervene? Additionally, did the intelligent designer modify the DNA of an entire population, or only a single creature, from which an entirely new population was born?

From the start. Each creature is designed at every stage, building on how well their design worked in the past.

12. Who designed the intelligent designer? (no theology allowed; remember, intelligent design is science)

The same question can be asked about any scientific question on origins. Where did the big bang come from? What happened before time started? What is north of the north pole?

[/ID mode]

I should point out that numbers 1-8,10 are irrelevant to ID since this says that evolution happens, just that it is guided by a designer, so all the same similarities and leftover parts will be seen. 9 and 11 are interesting questions on how IDists believe ID actually works, but since they are postulating a supernatural entity they don't pose any additional problems to it that aren't covered by questioning this. Point 12 is the only question you have asked that actually challenges ID, and the answer I have given is all you will ever get from any religious person when asking them where god came from.

 

[Cuddles]

Hey, what's that word for the theory that embryonic development follows the path of evolution?

Wrong?

On a more serious note - "Ontogeny recapitulates Phylogeny"

 

[Roboramma]

13. What does ID suggest about the natural world that isn't true without it?

14. What does ID explain that isn't explained by evolution?

As to embryonic development, it is certainly subject to selection, and to design, if there were a designer - he'd have to have designed the process of embryonic development that leads to the finished product, otherwise he wouldn't have designed anything.*

*I say "he" because we all know who the ID supporters really mean when they say "designer".

 

[DeviousB]

12. Who designed the intelligent designer? (no theology allowed; remember, intelligent design is science)

Hypothetically, no-one.

The supposed evidence for Intelligent Design is the presence of irreducibly complex structures in the biochemistry of terrestrial life. In the absence of any evidence of irreducibly complex structures in the biochemistry of the designer (whoever he/she/they/it/twoign turn out to be), it remains entirely possible that the designer is a product of Evolution, possibly even by Natural Selection.

 

[Anacoluthon64]

Hey, what's that word for the theory that embryonic development follows the path of evolution?

I think you might mean "Ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny."

ETA: Too eager, me - Cuddles wins, albeit with a different link.

'Luthon64

 

[Loss Leader]

"Ontogeny recapitulates Phylogeny"

Thanks to both of you.

 

[Dragonrock]

15. Why do humans, gorillas, chimpanzees, and orangutans all have the gene for creating vitamin C turned off? The gene is still there, it just isn't activated.

 

[RenaissanceBiker]

0. Are you really that stupid?

 

[Iamme]

12 Questions For I.D. Creationists – ideas, inspiration and some verbiage from “Why Darwin Matters” by Michael Shermer.

1. Why do males have nipples? A: If man didn't have nipples the woman couldn't..because Eve came from Adam; not the other way around.

2. Why did the intelligent designer design the male uterus? (the remnant of an undeveloped female reproductive organ hanging from the prostate gland) A: See 1.

3. Why do humans get goose bumps? (which are a physiological method by which to puff-up fur) A: It heightens sensitivity..fur or no fur...and because fo this, the body acknowledges the cold and then will shiver to get warmer.

4. Why do some humans get wisdom teeth? A: Or why do some people have many moles? Tell me more what you know about wisdom teeth, as to why this is significant.

5. Why do 8% of humans have a thirteenth set of ribs, just as is the case with chimpanzees and gorillas? A: Tell me why 8% of frying pans have the same type handles as do kettles...each made separately by it's creator man, rather than simply evolving on the stovetop

6. Why does the human genome contain junk DNA, repeated copies of useless DNA, orphan genes, gene fragments, tandem repeats and pseudogenes? A: Or what good is Venus?...insinuating God made a mistake rather than JUST creating Earth. Maybe someday we'll learn this answer, just like how medical scholars NOW have learned that tonsils and the appendix really ARE good for something.

7. Why do the geological strata indicate an evolutionary history to life? For example, why does no geological stratum simultaneously contain a trilobite and a fossil horse? A: This doesn't prove evolution. All it proves is a time frame. The Bible says that man was created last. Grasses came. Then animals. Then man, last. So what is the problem?

8. A bat’s wing has exactly the same set of bones as a whale’s flipper and a human arm. Why? Additionally, why does a bat’s wing not have such similarity to either an insect’s wing or a bird’s wing? A: So? What are you trying to say? What does how a creature is made have anything to do if it evolved or not? WE humans can create all kinds of separate distinct things that share many of the characteristics of something else. Yet we purposely formed each one, separately.

9. How, precisely, is “intelligent design” accomplished. As an example, how did the designer design vertebrates? A:Well?,... cell by planned cell, the creator did just that...just as man can make a framed skeletal object and cover it with an outer layer.

10. How much microevolution is allowed? A: Well, after 50 years of breeding tomatoes and replanting the best seed of the most robust and flavorful tomato, the genetisist still wound up with a tomato. Any grade school kid can also tell you a yellow apple is still an apple, or that a poodle and Greast Dane are dogs.

(10b.)Can species only evolve to subspecies? Or, does the intelligent designer get involved at the level of genus, from which species then can evolve naturally? A: I'll have to ask him.

11. If you reject Young Earth Creationism, this question is for you: At what stages, specifically, did the intelligent designer intervene? A: Young Earth Creationism? First time I hear that term. Anyway...do you know the Jehovah's Witnesses do not believe in the young Earth theory? It never says in the Bible when the Earth was created.

(11b.)Additionally, did the intelligent designer modify the DNA of an entire population, or only a single creature, from which an entirely new population was born? A: Remember my kettles and frying pan argument. I am not basing my entire faith on some notion that just because certain parts of certain organisms resemble certain parts of other organisms, that that automatically proves that the one organism branched off somewhere from some other organism.

12. Who designed the intelligent designer? (no theology allowed; remember, intelligent design is science)

A: That is like asking what CEO allowed the current CEO to exist. All that is relavent is that the CEO is top banana, and came from no other CEO.