9/11-investigator explains the Holocaust

[lionking]

But before I call you Americans winners of WW2, then I think I should add that I consider your participation in the war to be so late, that's it's more like "kick em while their down".. The prize goes to Russia, England and the resistance movements, in my book.

This post demonstrates that your knowledge of WWII is as sadly deficient as your knowledge of the Holocaust.

 

[Thomas]

But lion king knows.

 

[Trojan]

The point is simply that evidence isn't everything in the investigation phase, but that you also have to rely on inductive evidence in many cases. You're not judges in here, but qualify as investigators at best (and patriots at worst).

I'm not an expert on WW2, but I have read enough history to know that winners of wars always exaggerate the wrong-doings of the opposition to justify their murder and mayhem.

But before I call you Americans winners of WW2, then I think I should add that I consider your participation in the war to be so late, that's it's more like "kick em while their down".. The prize goes to Russia, England and the resistance movements, in my book.

So entering in June 1941 is on time, but December 1941 is too late?

 

[NoZed Avenger]

So entering in June 1941 is on time, but December 1941 is too late?

It's just a way to shift the topic.

 

[Thomas]

So entering in June 1941 is on time, but December 1941 is too late?

Entering after the big boys, and after being attacked (Pearl Harbor) doesn't give any medals no.

 

[Jontg]

You know, I find myself defending the Russian contribution so often that it truly disturbs me to meet somebody who completely ignores America's role. Do you really think that the Axis would have lost if they weren't waging a two-front war in Europe? Not even Russian manpower could have stopped that.

 

[bigjelmapro]

You want to maintain that these people died all over sudden from typhys? They tickled each other to death? They laughed themselves to death after seeing a Borat movie? Of course not. They died because they were bombed to death. Even a child can understand that after getting a treatment like this that many people will die:

http://www.ns-archiv.de/krieg/deutschland/dresden/dresden.jpg

Now I am asking you to provide similar evidence (pictures, authopsies, whatever) that people in the concentration camps died, not from hunger, shooting, typhys or other forms of illness but from gassings.

You provide a picture of a bombed out Dresden as definitive proof plus a bit of rhetoric. So similarly we can provide photos of the victims, plans of the gas chambers (which there are plenty) and the materials used for gassings, admission by Nazi guards, etc. etc. etc. and prove definitively that prisoners were gassed. Pretty simple.

Here is a telling number of pictures from the guards of Auschwitz. These pictures were recently released. Look at the faces:

http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-25000-2.html

These are normal people on a day of from work. And you want to maintain that the next day these relaxed looking people will return to their jobs and morph into monsters killing thousands of people a day?

You do realize that the picture you linked is of Karl Hoecker and the story behind that. And no, those women didn't 'work' at the camp.

Or perhaps you're going to portray Josef Mengele as an angel? To what ends are you going to whitewash Nazis?

 

[bigjelmapro]

You know, I find myself defending the Russian contribution so often that it truly disturbs me to meet somebody who completely ignores America's role. Do you really think that the Axis would have lost if they weren't waging a two-front war in Europe? Not even Russian manpower could have stopped that.

Operation Barbarossa anyone? Nazis did that all by themselves. No Americans there, sorry.

Yes, the Americans contributed to the defeat of the Nazis, but yet, at the same time contributed to strengthening of the Nazi party in the beginning. Can't look at it with one eye open, sorry. This portrayal of the US being the white knight saving Europe is but a pipe dream.

 

[lionking]

Operation Barbarossa anyone? Nazis did that all by themselves. No Americans there, sorry.

Yes, the Americans contributed to the defeat of the Nazis, but yet, at the same time contributed to strengthening of the Nazi party in the beginning. Can't look at it with one eye open, sorry. This portrayal of the US being the white knight saving Europe is but a pipe dream.

Wow. WWII was only about Europe? We in Australia would be speaking Japanese now it it wasn't for the US.

But this is a derail caused by Thomas who is ignoring the substance of this thread.

 

[marksman]

The point is simply that evidence isn't everything in the investigation phase

Investigative phase of what? Why, sixty years after the events would any historical inquiry still be in the "investigative phase"? At what point do you leave the investigative phase and begin to examine the evidence?

I'm not an expert on WW2, but I have read enough history to know that winners of wars always exaggerate the wrong-doings of the opposition

Then perhaps you should go and examine the evidence that has been gathered, rather than stalling your inquiry at "the investigation phase". I find it astounding to think that six decades after the war people might actually claim that they should be able to make hypotheses on the war based on broad generalizations (like all victors exaggerate) alone.

The prize goes to Russia, England and the resistance movements, in my book.

Of course, as you admit, you're no expert on WW2, so I'm not sure what value that book of yours holds on anything related to WW2. Perhaps you should go upgrade your book, beginning with the evidence many of us have cited to in this prolonged thread, and when you're out of your investigative phase, you can come back and let us know whether you've moved beyond the "all victors exaggerate" belief concerning the Holocaust.

 

[twinstead]

Why would anybody start a discussion about something that would take an expert to be taken seriously by admitting he isn't an expert on the subject?

 

[Trojan]

Entering after the big boys, and after being attacked (Pearl Harbor) doesn't give any medals no.

Who are the big boys if you do not include the US, and Japan as well?

 

[Jontg]

Why would anybody start a discussion about something that would take an expert to be taken seriously by admitting he isn't an expert on the subject?

Because it's all they know. You always start with "I'm not very good at this, but..." and then you launch into an academy-award-winning monologue that shames the villain, converts the sheeple to your cause, and saves the day. This is how things are done on the planet they live on.

 

[bigjelmapro]

Wow. WWII was only about Europe? We in Australia would be speaking Japanese now it it wasn't for the US.

He said this? Not me. Gave an example, nothing more. And never denied the US involvement in the outcome of WWII against Axis powers...and no, not just in Europe. Pfft.

But this is a derail caused by Thomas who is ignoring the substance of this thread.

Yep, derailed. 50 pages, and this is somehow not expected? That's a joke and a dash of sarcasm. Don't take it too personally...

 

[dropzone]

Why would anybody start a discussion about something that would take an expert to be taken seriously by admitting he isn't an expert on the subject?

It's effing crazy, innit? But as a longtime user of the intratubes you should be (depressingly) used to it.


ETA: Population studies show that there is a steadily-increasing number of 17-year-old boys who think they know more than they do. We are fighting a messy defense of the truth, but none of them knows more than the ones who preceded him, so the pile of bodies just grows higher. I know that, as a human being, it is difficult, but imagine yourself as a German machine-gunner at the Battle of the Somme. (as a WWI historian, a is insufficiently accurate)

 

[Thomas]

Yes, very good patroits.. I guess I just had enough of jew-pity movies for now.. We're talking a pity movie a' year.. Get a grip.. The gypsies lost a far greater percentage than the jews if the story is true.. So let me see all you patriots pity the gypsies instead.. Staaaaaaaarting...


Now!

 

[Thomas]

Who are the big boys if you do not include the US, and Japan as well?

You're European henchmen - at best. Go figure, because I'm not gonna spell it out for you, but you know your history right, and that should be enough.

EDIT:

Tell me the story of Vietnam again. please...

On second thought, nvm

 

[Thomas]

Investigative phase of what? Why, sixty years after the events would any historical inquiry still be in the "investigative phase"? At what point do you leave the investigative phase and begin to examine the evidence?

Never. Me be doooofus.

patroitic blah blah blah

 

[marksman]

I didn't mention the US at all in my post, so how you glean "patiotic blah blah" from it is mystifying. I've been retricting myself to your bizarre thoughts as to hw historical inquiry operates and that, by your own admission (likely tongue-in-cheek) that one should never examine actual evidence, lest it contradict the broad generalizations youd like to have been true.

 

[Thomas]

I didn't mention the US at all in my post, so how you glean "patiotic blah blah" from it is mystifying. I've been retricting myself to your bizarre thoughts as to hw historical inquiry operates and that, by your own admission (likely tongue-in-cheek) that one should never examine actual evidence, lest it contradict the broad generalizations youd like to have been true.

Unless you can show where I said that evidence is irrlelevant, then you just produced a shining clear straw man. Good job, right on the mark.

I had almost forgotten how this patroit forum is a freaking straw man mill.. Poor randi.