2020 Democratic Candidates Tracker - Part II

[Skeptic Ginger]

Moderator to Sanders: "What's the difference between your views and those implemented in Venezuala, Cuba and Nicaragua?"

FFS!

And then the crowd goes, "ooooowww" like Sanders got served. Not the best image for a POTUS debate.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Moderator to Booker: (paraphrased) "cutting down the Amazon for meat is supposed to be bad, but you're a weirdo vegan! That can't be good for the Brazilian economy! Do you expect Americans to follow your weirdo diet?"

That's an odd interpretation.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I don't know if Yang has just been very savvy at getting his supporters to the debates but he seems to get a lot of enthusiastic applause to his points.

Yeah right, register for the contest, win $1000/month like the Reader's Digest contests.

 

[angrysoba]

Looks like one of the talking points will be an issue between Castro and Biden on healthcare where Castro says his healthcare plan involves automatic enrollment whereas Biden leaves it to a "buy-in". They argued about it and Castro asked if Biden even remembers what he had just said.

In the "spin room" it seems some of the commentators are giving Castro a hard time for his tone and suggesting he was mocking Biden because of his age.

It's weird how Biden is universally thought of as the old man in the race despite being younger than Sanders and only a bit older than Trump

 

[Venom]

Moderator to Sanders: "What's the difference between your views and those implemented in Venezuala, Cuba and Nicaragua?"

FFS!

smh.

 

[angrysoba]

Yeah right, register for the contest, win $1000/month like the Reader's Digest contests.

LOL!

I think Yang missed a trick in the "spin room" where he was asked how he can expand his base from a young male audience, and how he can attract the elderly and women.

He just said that his base is expanding beyond young men.

BUT, if he had listened to Claire Malone on 538, he might have heard her say that she wanted to hear more about how a 1000 dollars a month could make a change in the lives of women who stay at home and look after children. Malone said he had briefly mentioned it, but he needs to sketch out real details to make his vision more compelling.

It seems to me the question was on a plate for him. He could easily have said about how retirees could have their lives changed with the extra cash, or how women who might either stay at home or want to pursue different careers could use the cash.

 

[Cabbage]

And then the crowd goes, "ooooowww" like Sanders got served. Not the best image for a POTUS debate.

I heard the "oooowww" as meaning, "Jesus Christ, this BS question again???"

 

[kellyb]

JFC, Biden stood out as a necro-conservative weirdo.

Moderator said she was going to ask him about race, and he laughs, and then when she asks him the question about what he said 40 years ago, he goes on some tirade about having a social worker in every home to teach parents of poor children how to raise their kids, and about how poor kids aren't exposed to as many words per day as rich kids.

Castro stood out as doing well. Basically everyone did okay except for Biden. Harris did better than the last debate, but over-corrected, fake laughing way too much, in trying to come off less like a cop/prosecutor compared to the last debate when she bombed.

I'm personally quite thrilled to see the debate on healthcare narrow to a contest between the M4A "purists", and M4A + optional opt-out via keeping your insurance if you want to.

I was satisfied with Warren's answer on Afghanistan, especially her leaving out "our allies in the ME" when she was talking about strengthening relationships globally to help stabilize the ME. I got the sense that she's well aware of the massive, "everything-else-eclipsing" problem SA (our supposed "ally") poses over there, funding religious extremism, which is IMO the #1 true threat/problem with radical Islamic terrorism.

 

[kellyb]

It's weird how Biden is universally thought of as the old man in the race despite being younger than Sanders and only a bit older than Trump

I think it's because his positions reflect 1970's-1990's politics, and he comes across as an out-of-touch old man.

 

[angrysoba]

JFC, Biden stood out as a necro-conservative weirdo.

Moderator said she was going to ask him about race, and he laughs, and then when she asks him the question about what he said 40 years ago, he goes on some tirade about having a social worker in every home to teach parents of poor children how to raise their kids, and about how poor kids aren't exposed to as many words per day as rich kids.

]

Ha ha! Yeah, this was the bit I was talking about earlier where somehow he droned on and on making no sense as an answer to the question.

Even better he decided he wanted to talk more complaining that everyone else got to talk and then went on about Venezuela. Huh?

I felt a bit sorry for him. He seemed a bit lost and at one point when Castro was laying into him he seemed like he had to ask Bernie Sanders “wasse sayin”. When you have to rely on Bernie Sanders to tell you what people around you are saying you really do look out of touch.

 

[Mumbles]

And from the dark side of campaigning (pun not intended) we have the bots and trolls stirring:

BOTS IN BLACKFACE – THE RISE OF FAKE BLACK PEOPLE ON SOCIAL MEDIA PROMOTING POLITICAL AGENDAS

And just like in 2016:

They're usually easy to spot - between the terrible imitations of AAVE, the general hostility towards dems, the use of stock photos, and the tendency to repeat other people's messages, they're typically pretty easy to spot. The folks that started #ADOS turned out to be actual black Americans - who typically had videos on YouTube yapping about how great Dolt 45 is.

 

[kellyb]

Ha ha! Yeah, this was the bit I was talking about earlier where somehow he droned on and on making no sense as an answer to the question.

That "stream of consciousness" non-answer in particular was so offensive I literally gasped.

But yeah, overall he went with this tactic repeatedly.

 

[kellyb]

Seriously, WTF kind of answer is this?
https://beta.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/09/13/transcript-third-democratic-debate/

Mr. Vice president, I want to come to you and talk to you about inequality in schools and race. In a conversation about how to deal with segregation in schools back in 1975, you told a reporter, "I don't feel responsible for the sins of my father and grandfather, I feel responsible for what the situation is today, for the sins of my own generation, and I'll be damned if I feel responsible to pay for what happened 300 years ago."

You said that some 40 years ago. But as you stand here tonight, what responsibility do you think that Americans need to take to repair the legacy of slavery in our country?

BIDEN: Well, they have to deal with the — look, there's institutional segregation in this country. And from the time I got involved, I started dealing with that. Red-lining banks, making sure that we are in a position where — look, you talk about education. I propose that what we take is those very poor schools, the Title I schools, triple the amount of money we spend from 15 to $45 billion a year. Give every single teacher a raise, the equal raise to getting out — the $60,000 level.

Number two, make sure that we bring in to help the teachers deal with the problems that come from home. The problems that come from home, we need — we have one school psychologist for every 1,500 kids in America today. It’s crazy.

The teachers are — I'm married to a teacher. My deceased wife is a teacher. They have every problem coming to them. We have — make sure that every single child does, in fact, have 3-, 4-, and 5-year-olds go to school. School. Not daycare. School. We bring social workers in to homes and parents to help them deal with how to raise their children.

It's not want they don't want to help. They don't — they don't know quite what to do. Play the radio, make sure the television — excuse me, make sure you have the record player on at night, the — the — make sure that kids hear words. A kid coming from a very poor school — a very poor background will hear 4 million words fewer spoken by the time they get there.
DAVIS: Thank you, Mr. Vice President.

 

[Travis]

And from the dark side of campaigning (pun not intended) we have the bots and trolls stirring:

BOTS IN BLACKFACE – THE RISE OF FAKE BLACK PEOPLE ON SOCIAL MEDIA PROMOTING POLITICAL AGENDAS

And just like in 2016:

These fake accounts have been all over Kamala pushing the whole "Kamala keeps slaves" or "Kamala is a cop that laughs about locking up non violent drug offenders" narratives.

 

[angrysoba]

Seriously, WTF kind of answer is this?
https://beta.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/09/13/transcript-third-democratic-debate/

“The record player...!” I love it. And at that point (“thank you Mr Vice President”) he should have shut up but looked even weirder when he started going on about Venezuela.

I mean, WTF does this have to do with the question?

BIDEN: There’s so much we — no, I’m going to go like the rest of them do, twice over, okay?

(APPLAUSE)

Because here's the deal. The deal is that we've got this a little backwards. And by the way, in Venezuela, we should be allowing people to come here from Venezuela. I know Maduro. I've confronted Maduro.

Number two, you talk about the need to do something in Latin America. I'm the guy that came up with $740 million to see to it those three countries, in fact, changed their system so people don't have to chance to leave. You're all acting like we just discovered this yesterday. Thank you very much.

 

[angrysoba]

Moderator to Booker: (paraphrased) "cutting down the Amazon for meat is supposed to be bad, but you're a weirdo vegan! That can't be good for the Brazilian economy! Do you expect Americans to follow your weirdo diet?"

That's an odd interpretation.

Here's what was said. Yes, I was exaggerating, but it was weird from the moderator:

RAMOS: Senator Booker, let me ask you about Brazil. After the recent fires in the Amazon, some experts suggested that eating less meat is one way to help the environment. You are a vegan since 2014. That's obviously a personal choice, but President Trump and Brazil's President Bolsonaro are concerned that climate change regulations could affect economic growth.

So should more Americans, including those here in Texas, and in Iowa...

(LAUGHTER)

... follow your diet?

 

[kellyb]

“The record player...!” I love it. And at that point (“thank you Mr Vice President”) he should have shut up but looked even weirder when he started going on about Venezuela.

Yeah, and looking at the latter part of his..mental noodling, or whatever you'd call it, he says:

"It's not want they don't want to help. They don't — they don't know quite what to do. Play the radio, make sure the television — excuse me, make sure you have the record player on at night, the — the — make sure that kids hear words. A kid coming from a very poor school — a very poor background will hear 4 million words fewer spoken by the time they get there. There’s so much we — no, I’m going to go like the rest of them do, twice over, okay? Because here's the deal. The deal is that we've got this a little backwards. And by the way, in Venezuela, we should be allowing people to come here from Venezuela. I know Maduro. I've confronted Maduro. Number two, you talk about the need to do something in Latin America. I'm the guy that came up with $740 million to see to it those three countries, in fact, changed their system so people don't have a chance to leave. You're all acting like we just discovered this yesterday. Thank you very much."

--------------------
Video here:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/09/joe-biden-debate-answer.html

Is he talking about the walls put up in Honduras, etc to keep people trying to escape the drug violence there? Or, ______?

ETA:
https://jacobinmag.com/2018/12/honduras-coup-lobo-human-rights-us-obama-trump

Like that of the Trump administration to today’s humanitarian crisis at the border, the Obama policy response was highly militarized. Championed by Joe Biden and General John Kelly, the plan was consolidated into the Plan Colombia–inspired “Alliance for Prosperity.” Like Plan Colombia, the project was couched in the language of development, but it promised to entrench the violent neoliberal model in the region through liberalization, mega-projects, and militarized border controls.

Frank notes how the White House’s language, together with that of mainstream media, “implied a giant flood was spilling over the lower part of the country, drowning it in dangerous brown children.” The United States diverted security aid to Mexico into the militarization of the country’s southern border with Guatemala, forcing migrants from well-worn corridors to make what was already a perilous journey more deadly. Honduran forces began intercepting migrants seeking to flee their own country. Indeed, the decision of Central Americans to travel together in large groups or caravans is a direct result of these reckless decisions.

 

[Delvo]

The thing about word count is based on an article that came out several years ago estimating that poor kids don't experience as much language use as rich kids, as reported in the form of words per day, and that this seemed to contribute to their inferior language skills observed later in life. It was pretty soon followed by a handful of other articles pointing out problems with it, or at least with inferring too much out of it, and then forgotten by most of the world, except Biden apparently. And the treatment he suggested was exactly the kind of inference from it that was already shot down right after its publication years ago, on the basis that not all words a kid hears are equal and a one-way delivery by a gadget had practically no value as a substitute for human interaction.

 

[kellyb]

The thing about word count is based on an article that came out several years ago estimating that poor kids don't experience as much language use as rich kids, as reported in the form of words per day, and that this seemed to contribute to their inferior language skills observed later in life. It was pretty soon followed by a handful of other articles pointing out problems with it, or at least with inferring too much out of it, and then forgotten by most of the world, except Biden apparently. And the treatment he suggested was exactly the kind of inference from it that was already shot down right after its publication years ago, on the basis that not all words a kid hears are equal and a one-way delivery by a gadget had practically no value as a substitute for human interaction.

Even if putting record players under the beds of children to play at night, Brave New World-style, was a scientifically solid idea, it would still be a terrible response to the question he was asked.

It's beyond surreal that he then transitioned into gloating about his role in the militarization of the borders between Mexico and neighboring countries.

 

[angrysoba]

The thing about word count is based on an article that came out several years ago estimating that poor kids don't experience as much language use as rich kids, as reported in the form of words per day, and that this seemed to contribute to their inferior language skills observed later in life. It was pretty soon followed by a handful of other articles pointing out problems with it, or at least with inferring too much out of it, and then forgotten by most of the world, except Biden apparently. And the treatment he suggested was exactly the kind of inference from it that was already shot down right after its publication years ago, on the basis that not all words a kid hears are equal and a one-way delivery by a gadget had practically no value as a substitute for human interaction.

I think the research into this contains certain elements of truth, but Biden showed no understanding of the nuances. I think the most likely explanation for the differences in language abilities are to do with how much attention and interaction a child and a parent get from looking at books and having the parents read to them. With picture books that have a lot of content, the parents can spend more time holding a conversation or even directing the language from the book towards the child. With very simple board books, there is likely to be less interaction. But ultimately the difference is how much language is directed towards the child.

The fact that Biden thinks that just sticking "the record player" on is the way to meet a quota of words shows he doesn't know what he is talking about, although frankly I think he was just on-tilt while trying to bat away the question about segregation and was free-associating to prevent himself having to directly address his old comments about segregation.