Split Thread Scorpion's Spiritualism

[Scorpion]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

 

[Slowvehicle]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

May I take it that's "NO" WRT the OP?

 

[DuvalHMFIC]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into magic matters. I watched as David Copperfield made the statue of liberty disappear. I watched as Penn & Teller caught actual bullets in their mouth. Sure, some people say they are just "tricks", but I know what I saw. These claims of "tricks" are just an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of these incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here.

 

[rayheno]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

For myself I see no reason to boast that 'no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind'. In that case what is your purpose here? To preach? To educate? Because it seems you have excluded to learn.

 

[Resume]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

Us, who?

 

[tsig]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

Your personal experience sweeps aside all of physics?

The divine purpose and meaning to life always seem to come down to telling god how wonderful he is.

 

[dlorde]

... no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind.

There's your problem

 

[Scorpion]

For myself I see no reason to boast that 'no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind'. In that case what is your purpose here? To preach? To educate? Because it seems you have excluded to learn.

I think it unlikely that anyone else here has as much experience of psychic mediums as I have. I have been looking into it since the 1960's and I attended many trance lectures at the spiritualist association in London throughout the 1970's. My conclusions were that some mediums are genuine, and they do not just do cold reading, as James Randi says. They do tell you facts and names, and details that it would be difficult for them to know unless they are doing what they say they are doing. Which is talking to the spirits of the departed. I conclude that most people here have little or no experience of psychics, and they write them off because of a preconception that they must all be fakes. Or it would entirely change the scientific paradigm. We would have to accept life after death, and higher realms of experience. Therefore I guess I am trying to preach a belief system.

 

[superfreddy]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

Some years ago, my views were not that dissimilar to yours. This site has helped me a lot. Stick around and keep an open mind, you will learn new things form many intelligent people around here. I know I did (still do)

 

[Resume]

Therefore I guess I am trying to preach a belief system.

Yes.

Good luck.

 

[Scorpion]

Your personal experience sweeps aside all of physics?

The laws of physics are not incompatible with the possible existence of higher undetectable realms. The spirit world says the higher worlds are vibrating at a far higher rate than physical atoms, and the realms inter-penetrate. So they can exist in the same place without being perceptible by any other means than psychic development. Using the senses of the astral and mental bodies to see into higher dimensions. Using the chakras in the etheric body as channels.

The divine purpose and meaning to life always seem to come down to telling god how wonderful he is.

There may be a purpose in all experience, no matter how harsh it seems from a human point of view. Hard experience strengthens the soul in the same way that the struggle between predators and pray forces evolution in both.
The spirit world says that God remains above all this and we ultimately evolve spiritually toward reuniting with him in a state of grace, at which time our sufferings will seem a small price to pay. This takes place over many, many incarnations, not just one human lifetime.

 

[Garrette]

I realize I am not the smartest kid on the block, and that I am out of my depth in many debates. But this does not take away from me the life experience of delving into psychic matters. I have had very evidential messages from mediums, and they told me facts that they could not have known. James Randi says they are just cold reading but my experience teaches me otherwise, and no amount of reasoning will be likely to change my mind. I was told here that human memory is flawed and that is why I think I remember some things, but for me that is just flim flam, and an attempt to sweep my experiences aside. I am confident my memory of some incidents is fairly accurate. Therefore my conclusions about them remain the same in spite of dismissive arguments I have read here. I conclude there probably is a God, and the human mind survives death , and consciousness is stored in a higher vessel than the brain. I think there is not enough evidence either way to prove or disprove this, so it does not matter how clever some of the people here are, all they have done is outsmart themselves. They have closed their minds to the possibility there is a divine purpose and meaning to life and experience because they have no evidence. Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

So your answer to the OP is that you haven't changed your mind based on participation on the JREF. That's cool. Stick around anyway.

 

[anglolawyer]

Your personal experience sweeps aside all of physics?

The divine purpose and meaning to life always seem to come down to telling god how wonderful he is.

Hey tsig! Did I change your mind about whether the estate of a deceased person could maintain an action for damages for assault on that person? You deserted the discussion rather than reply to my post (and those of others) having told me that I did not understand the term 'estate'.

 

[Slowvehicle]

I think it unlikely that anyone else here has as much experience of psychic mediums as I have. I have been looking into it since the 1960's and I attended many trance lectures at the spiritualist association in London throughout the 1970's. My conclusions were that some mediums are genuine, and they do not just do cold reading, as James Randi says. They do tell you facts and names, and details that it would be difficult for them to know unless they are doing what they say they are doing. Which is talking to the spirits of the departed. I conclude that most people here have little or no experience of psychics, and they write them off because of a preconception that they must all be fakes. Or it would entirely change the scientific paradigm. We would have to accept life after death, and higher realms of experience. Therefore I guess I am trying to preach a belief system.

I will be fascinated to see your evidence of, for instance, "talking" to the "spirits" of the "departed". Not, I hope, about appliances...

 

[Slowvehicle]

The laws of physics are not incompatible with the possible existence of higher undetectable realms. The spirit world says the higher worlds are vibrating at a far higher rate than physical atoms,

...and you know this...how? What is your source of what the "spirit world" says?

...and the realms inter-penetrate. {/quote]

...and this has been demonstrated...how?

So they can exist in the same place without being perceptible by any other means than psychic development. Using the senses of the astral and mental bodies to see into higher dimensions. Using the chakras in the etheric body as channels.

Ah. You can only "perceive" them if you believe that you can perceive them in ways that those who do not believe cannot perceive.

Cool story

There may be a purpose in all experience, no matter how harsh it seems from a human point of view. Hard experience strengthens the soul in the same way that the struggle between predators and pray forces evolution in both.

Odd typo, or...NEW REVELATION?

"Oh, Mighty Chatterjee, please don't let this leopard get me...I will offer up 70 bananas and a mango if you preserve me..."

The spirit world says that God remains above all this...

...and you know this...how? What is your source for what the "spirit world" says?

...and we ultimately evolve spiritually toward reuniting with him in a state of grace, at which time our sufferings will seem a small price to pay. This takes place over many, many incarnations, not just one human lifetime.

Don't suppose you plan to offer anything resembling evidence for any of this, do you?

 

[John Jones]

The laws of physics are not incompatible with the possible existence of higher undetectable realms. The spirit world says the higher worlds are vibrating at a far higher rate than physical atoms, and the realms inter-penetrate. [...]

Woo-woo new age nonsense. Who is this 'spirit world' you cite, and what are his/her credentials to spout such silliness?

 

[I Ratant]

... Which leaves us with faith as the only road to belief in God.

.
And that IS correct!
Faith tosses out reality for a wish.
When reality is finally recognized as reality, and faith and belief do not affect reality ever, one can confidently abandon faith with no qualms.

 

[I Ratant]

... This takes place over many, many incarnations, not just one human lifetime.

.
The problem with incarnations is there's more people alive than have died.
Whereat do those souls come from?
Humanity began with just a handful of homo sapiens, who bred and fruitfully multiplied the number of us.
A "handful" of souls is now several billion?
How's that compute?

 

[TofuFighter]

.
The problem with incarnations is there's more people alive than have died.
Whereat do those souls come from?
Humanity began with just a handful of homo sapiens, who bred and fruitfully multiplied the number of us.
A "handful" of souls is now several billion?
How's that compute?

People like repeating this 70's-born phrase, (i think) because it sounds good, but almost any reasonable and even conservative calculations arrive at a 'total-deceased' figure of between 80 and 100 billion.

 

[anglolawyer]

People like repeating this 70's-born phrase, (i think) because it sounds good, but almost any reasonable and even conservative calculations arrive at a 'total-deceased' figure of between 80 and 100 billion.

Well, in that case, where are all the missing 73-93 billion unreincarnated dead people? Hmmm? Let's see you answer that smart aleck!