• Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more

Continuation Part Eight: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

Status
Not open for further replies.
A few weeks ago people were wondering about the watch Guede was caught with and that piece of information only came from Nina Burleigh.

It's in the Micheli Report p 11

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/2008-10-28_EngG.pdf

well the watch being in the back pack wasn't the issue - the issue was and is any connection to Rudy's neighbor, the break-in there and the fire that killed the cat.

wonder if the police took the break-in hammer
 
What specifically was done to disable the dialler? If the lawyers were using an old tech alarm, it's a simple matter of disconecting the telephone line where it enters the building.

Brand new in 2007 according to the testimony of the lawyer, you really need to get up to speed. ;) and he made the point that he wouldn't have been able to do it.

Be careful about a lawyers remark as we have at least one that could take it as a personal attack :p
 
I've been reading the various motivations reports which have come out of Rudy's fast-track process. Just to confess how slow I am on the uptake, up until about two weeks ago, I thought Rudy's fast-track process was completely irrelevant to the full-trial process Knox and Sollecito chose.

How naive can a guy be. I'm slow, but my spelling is also poor. Thank God for auto-connect.

So, Nencini will be writing a report which goes a long way to "harmonizing" Massei's report with Rudy's various reports. I thought that Nencini's court would have freedom to disagree with the March 2013 ISC ruling, which in essence says that the two tracks of prosecution in this case must match.

The main issue that Nencini has to deal with is that, in essence, Knox and Sollecito were convicted at Guede's fast-track process, at the very least that's what's in the motivations reports. Rudy's fast-track process contains various stipulations from both sides (note: the sides in that case are Mignini on one and Rudy and his lawyers on the other) - Amanda had to have let Rudy in, the break in had to have been faked..... Amanda was the only person in the known universe with a motive to fake a break-in....

..... to hell with the fact that this was settled at Rudy's fast-track process without a petition to the actual evidence. (A fast-track trial is, in essence, a normal criminal process but without the trial phase.)

It is my view that even Massei did not write a motivations report beholden to the various Rudy motivations report. Massei wrote a report where the motive for this crime was Rudy's and Rudy's alone, it was his lust which caused this crime to begin; which found inexplicable participation by Knox and Sollecito. Massei was nothing if not honest that he simply could not explain why AK and RS would have been involved, even as he found them guilty.

And the irony is, that the eventual ISC "sign-off" on Rudy's guilt agrees with Judge Hellmann, yes, Judge Hellmann, that it is not up to them to state an opinion on who the other attackers were in their acceptance of the multiple attacker scenario.

Please note: the ISC sign-off on multiple attackers was a sign-off on a process with the trial-phase missing - meaning that there was no real evidence presented or challenged as if there'd been an evidentiary trial!

Even with that, the conclusion of Rudy's did not specifically name AK and RS... but if one accepts multiple attackers, one finds plenty of assertions in previous motivations reports (written with no buttressing evidence) to accept it.

So:

Nencini will accept:

1) Multiple attackers
2) if multiple attackers it is only logical that AK and RS are those people
3) motive is unimportant
4) Amanda let Rudy in as the only key-holder
5) the break-in was an obvious fake (regardless that the judicial-factness of it was the result of stipulations at Rudy's trial, not actual fact-finding)
6) Raffaele's kitchen knife is the murder weapon because it is consistent with the bed-sheet outline (therefore they can be convicted of the charge with respect to the transport of the knife)​

#6 is a result of the RIS Carabinieri at Nencini's court finding that there is no Meredith DNA on the knife, so Nencini is stuck with somehow placing that knife in the cottage. The bedsheet outline will be substituted for the DNA.

Remember, you read it here first.

Science, physical laws, and logical process seem over, but we should battle on bravely.
 
Last edited:
Science, physical laws, and logical process seem over. but we should battle on bravely.

True. This as long since not been about evidence, DNA, extradition, or the prosecution putting together a believable time-line.

It is about haters and guilters being able to say slutty things about a person they do not know, in grand Internet troll fashion.

Machiavelli and Vogt try to defend Mignini, Harry Rag comments-bombs his same stuff about mixed blood, etc....

The Italian Judiciary wants to harmonize about 6 or 7 motiviations reports as if it were simply an academic exercise not connected to human events.

The Kerchers want justice and actually deserve justice for the horror inflicted upon their family.

The families of the wrongful accused/convicted deserve equal justice in what Italy is doing to them. AK and RS are no longer people, they are pawns in a semantic struggle to harmonize written documents.
 
For various reasons I believe a new thread should be started on the break in. It is what AK and RS should employ as their primary focus, including temporarily buying the house.
The embedded glass shard precludes an inside job, and few PGP are aware of its existence.
Bill, you are empathetic to the family of the victim. Fair enough, but have they ever discussed the evidence? No. They grimly deplored Amanda and Raffaele's declaration of innocence and release by justice Hellmann, then jointly and severally put their names to the annulment and further prosecution. Their lawyer is a friend of Mignini, and they presumably owe him a poultice of money. Lyle Kercher has publicly called for Amanda's extradition and imprisonment.

From a distant place, I am stunned by the consideration accorded these people, because it is at variance with everything I consider sensible. However I enjoy this forum and your input.
 
Last edited:
Brand new in 2007 according to the testimony of the lawyer, you really need to get up to speed. ;) and he made the point that he wouldn't have been able to do it.

Be careful about a lawyers remark as we have at least one that could take it as a personal attack :p


Newly installed but not necessarily new technology. A modern alarm system would tie into the DSL with backup cellular modem. There would be active polling or heartbeat exchange so interrupting the circuit would itself set an alarm. This talk about the dialler being disabled is indicative of the system being an ancient design.

I remember several years back that a popular consumer advocate couldn't understand how a neighbor kid would be able to make phone calls on someone else's phone when they were on vacation with no sign of a breakin. How could he not know that every house has an external customer access point where the telephone companies line ends and the homeowners line begins. And for all modern homes built or improved in the last 30+ years this access point is a standard telephone jack that can be accessed with simple tools even if the homeowner added the optional lock which almost nobody does. What is really bad is that this same consumer advocate was the owner of a local phone company.

The lawyer can have a pass for not knowing about alarm systems and phones as long as that is something that would never come up in a case they were involved in. But the lawyers ignorance does not affect what would be standard street smarts for a low level thief.
 
Ah, pity, the rabble will never understand.

The saying is "a hole in the water, into which you throw money"

But it's the people who have had the pleasure and pain of owning boats who make up those jokes Grinder. I've never met a boat owner who didn't have a love/hate affair with his boat.
 
But it's the people who have had the pleasure and pain of owning boats who make up those jokes Grinder. I've never met a boat owner who didn't have a love/hate affair with his boat.

To focus one's mind, try sharing ownership. Bad joke could refer to a shared mythical crime.;)
 
For various reasons I believe a new thread should be started on the break in. It is what AK and RS should employ as their primary focus, including temporarily buying the house.
The embedded glass shard precludes an inside job, and few PGP are aware of its existence.
Bill, you are empathetic to the family of the victim. Fair enough, but have they ever discussed the evidence? No. They grimly deplored Amanda and Raffaele's declaration of innocence and release by justice Hellmann, then jointly and severally put their names to the annulment and further prosecution. Their lawyer is a friend of Mignini, and they presumably owe him a poultice of money. Lyle Kercher has publicly called for Amanda's extradition and imprisonment.
From a distant place, I am stunned by the consideration accorded these people, because it is at variance with everything I consider sensible. However I enjoy this forum and your input.
If I were in their shoes I would be doing all of this, and perhaps worse. I cannot at all criticize the Kerchers.

Until 3 Oct 2011 they had no reason whatsoever to doubt anything they were being told from Perugia. Everything up until that point went the prosecution's way, and the Kerchers could rightfully say, "Look, you may argue with a few details here and there, but c'mon, they were set over for trial and convicted. What else are we to believe?"

That's the way it was until 3 Oct 2011. And then they may have been confused, Lyle admitted, "Of course we do not want the wrong people to go to jail over this."

With all what you and I would claim are excuses for the acquittals, once again the Kerchers can reasonably claim that the March 2013 reversal of same and the Jan 2014 reconvictions simply bolster their confidence that they've been steered in the right direction all along by Maresca, et al.

Why wouldn't they?

The only "poser" for me is the occasional, "we just don't know what's going on in Perugia with the courts."

The Kerchers, in my view, are double victims here. Steve Moore was right on with his thesis that victims of crime get imprinted on those who commit the crime, and it is a Herculean task to move from that if and when those who they've been told are the perps turn out not to be.

As for me and my house, we will not judge the Kerchers. On anything.
 
Last edited:
If I were in their shoes I would be doing all of this, and perhaps worse. I cannot at all criticize the Kerchers.

Until 3 Oct 2011 they had no reason whatsoever to doubt anything they were being told from Perugia. Everything up until that point went the prosecution's way, and the Kerchers could rightfully say, "Look, you may argue with a few details here and there, but c'mon, they were set over for trial and convicted. What else are we to believe?"

That's the way it was until 3 Oct 2011. And then they may have been confused, Lyle admitted, "Of course we do not want the wrong people to go to jail over this."

With all what you and I would claim are excuses for the acquittals, once again the Kerchers can reasonably claim that the March 2013 reversal of same and the Jan 2014 reconvictions simply bolster their confidence that they've been steered in the right direction all along by Maresca, et al.

Why wouldn't they?

The only "poser" for me is the occasional, "we just don't know what's going on in Perugia with the courts."

The Kerchers, in my view, are double victims here. Steve Moore was right on with his thesis that victims of crime get imprinted on those who commit the crime, and it is a Herculean task to move from that if and when those who they've been told are the perps turn out not to be.

As for me and my house, we will not judge the Kerchers. On anything.
:eye-poppi :jaw-dropp :confused:
 
For various reasons I believe a new thread should be started on the break in. It is what AK and RS should employ as their primary focus, including temporarily buying the house.
The embedded glass shard precludes an inside job, and few PGP are aware of its existence.
Bill, you are empathetic to the family of the victim. Fair enough, but have they ever discussed the evidence? No. They grimly deplored Amanda and Raffaele's declaration of innocence and release by justice Hellmann, then jointly and severally put their names to the annulment and further prosecution. Their lawyer is a friend of Mignini, and they presumably owe him a poultice of money. Lyle Kercher has publicly called for Amanda's extradition and imprisonment.

From a distant place, I am stunned by the consideration accorded these people, because it is at variance with everything I consider sensible. However I enjoy this forum and your input.

Heads up, so are Amanda's defence team, they all know each other.
 
Last edited:
The Kerchers, in my view, are double victims here. Steve Moore was right on with his thesis that victims of crime get imprinted on those who commit the crime, and it is a Herculean task to move from that if and when those who they've been told are the perps turn out not to be.

As for me and my house, we will not judge the Kerchers. On anything.

I mostly feel sorry for them myself. That is still a judgement though.
 
But it's the people who have had the pleasure and pain of owning boats who make up those jokes Grinder. I've never met a boat owner who didn't have a love/hate affair with his boat.

I've never met anybody that didn't have it with a car, a home or a lawn mower. Spouses, kids, cabins, etc. etc.

I hated the day that my boat sold even if it cost me a few bucks every month.

I'm not so sure that the sayings are made up by boaters. Maybe my some schlep that bought a boat because he thought it would make him cool.

I've owned 4 boats and missed each one when I sold it.
 
I came across this CBS item from 2/7/14 that suggests yet another ground for Amanda to escape extradition -- that per Hellmann her prosecution is politically motivated -- it is a contest between two political parties in which her guilt or innocence are irrelevant.

There is a suggestion here that Hellmann's acquittal might have stood if actions had not been taken to discipline the prosecution for its conduct of this case.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/was-amanda-knox-a-political-pawn-in-italian-politics/
 
I've never met anybody that didn't have it with a car, a home or a lawn mower. Spouses, kids, cabins, etc. etc.

I hated the day that my boat sold even if it cost me a few bucks every month.

I'm not so sure that the sayings are made up by boaters. Maybe my some schlep that bought a boat because he thought it would make him cool.

I've owned 4 boats and missed each one when I sold it.

I had an 87 Mustang up until last year
Number three cylinder lost all compression.
Would like to have rebuilt the engine or replaced it but just cost as much as the nice used 2001 Mustang I ended up buying.
 
I came across this CBS item from 2/7/14 that suggests yet another ground for Amanda to escape extradition -- that per Hellmann her prosecution is politically motivated -- it is a contest between two political parties in which her guilt or innocence are irrelevant.

There is a suggestion here that Hellmann's acquittal might have stood if actions had not been taken to discipline the prosecution for its conduct of this case.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/was-amanda-knox-a-political-pawn-in-italian-politics/
The Hellmann appeal only exists on internet discussion sites, you won't find it mentioned in the Florence motivations, just a guess.
 
I've never met anybody that didn't have it with a car, a home or a lawn mower. Spouses, kids, cabins, etc. etc.

I hated the day that my boat sold even if it cost me a few bucks every month.

I'm not so sure that the sayings are made up by boaters. Maybe my some schlep that bought a boat because he thought it would make him cool.

I've owned 4 boats and missed each one when I sold it.

I wasn't trying to insult you Grinder. I too have spent a lot of time on the water. My Dad and I would do a a lot of fishing on Puget Sound and Lake Washington. He owned five different boats and he complained about the cost of his boats all time. It always annoyed him that the marine version of every part was always 3 times as expensive as the automotive version of the same item. In fact, it was from him that I heard most of those jokes.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom