Continuation Part Seven: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Kaosium]

Why wouldn't the Kerchers' have trust in the Italian system, or their lawyer Maresca? They've had three of four Italian trials/appeals go in favour of guilt towards Knox/Sollecito?

The fact that Rudy Guede is eligible to walk the streets despite leaving his DNA inside Meredith (and everywhere else) might be cause for greater skepticism.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

I like and respect you too, Coulsdon.

However, lemme put it this way:

Remember a while back when the issue which was called the 'greatest miscarriage of justice in Canadian history' was being aired? The Guy Paul Morin case? It wasn't John Douglas who initially put those Canadian police onto Morin, it was the mother of the victim. Now she not only has to live with knowing her darling daughter was murdered, and that her son and friends used to molest her, but also that she helped implicate an entirely innocent man and destroy his life. She's come to terms with the fact he wasn't involved and has accepted it; I can't help but imagine that just made it worse.

K I don’t know the case, I have seen the name mentioned here. If you have the time can you or anyone else provide a link(s) and I’ll have a read, thanks in advance.

 

[Strozzi]

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9832297&postcount=8738

Mary, I saw that comment. It illustrated to me the Kercher family's inability to raise their voices against the light sentence given their daughter's killer and his probable work release coming up.

John Kercher has devoted more ink giving lip service to Mignini's "Foxy Knoxy" cult myth than condeming the real murderer of his daughter.

Has not one Kercher studied enough science to understand that the digestive evidence proves that their daughter/sister was irrefutably murdered by about 9:30 pm (when the defendants could not have been present). Does not one Kercher recognized how foul and fraudulent is the forensic investigation in this case? Do they not see the police and prosecution withholding scientific evidence or trotting out a chronic heroin addict/serial witness as their star fabricator? Nobody in the Kercher family has any comprehension of or respect for scientific evidence? Come on - they can't all be tabloids writers!

Is John Kercher so thankful to Mignini fdroids continuing his initial speculative theories about Kercher's daughter hooking up that John Kercher keeps silent about the horrible way Mignini, the police, and Stefanoni trashed the investigation?

Did he not see the photos of Mignini's investigators standing around smoking under the possible break-in point while not really investigating the break-in?

 

[Grinder]

You know this isn’t TJMK, PMF .org/.net or injustice anywhere etc etc; is it?

I may live roughly 20 minute walk from where Meredith’s mother lives but I did not know the family before or since Meredith’s murder. That being said, either this thread has become a PIP echo chamber whereby there is no pretence of trying to win the hearts and minds of the great “don’t cares” through discussion verses making crass jokes or comments about the murder victim.

We are as one with regards to Guede.

You've made it clear that the only place that counts is in a Italian court. You've made it clear that what people here think doesn't matter one iota and that our efforts to get to the truth are a waste of time. You come here occasionally to remind us and ask a question like you just did.

The vast, vast majority of posts do not involve the Kerchers at all. Occasionally a remark is made that is offensive and sometimes a remark offends you that really shouldn't.

You never address the issue of why the family's and victims' lawyers are allowed to make statements in court including calling Amanda and Raf names. What sort of a advanced court system lets people call the defendant a lucerfina or worse but PROSECUTES the defendant for saying she was treated inappropriately when questioned.

Why don't you return to answering why the police believed Patrick was involved before she made her statements.

 

[AmyStrange]

How about that 90 day thing?

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You know this isn’t TJMK, PMF .org/.net or injustice anywhere etc etc; is it?

I may live roughly 20 minute walk from where Meredith’s mother lives but I did not know the family before or since Meredith’s murder. That being said, either this thread has become a PIP echo chamber whereby there is no pretence of trying to win the hearts and minds of the great “don’t cares” through discussion verses making crass jokes or comments about the murder victim.

We are as one with regards to Guede.

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Thank you for that.

I don't know what your first sentence means? Sorry.

Although I like the fact that it's an echo chamber for innocence, but yeah sometimes people jump on people a little too fast here. HotNostril is a good example. I mean she actually left here thinking about digestion and I think she was having dinner with someone her husband knows who knows more about it. Should be interesting dinner conversation.

Some people (I think it's a reflex, knee jerk, kind of action in response to attacks because anyone can come here unlike TJMK et. al., but yeah it was rude), and I plead guilty to doing similar things too, some people here attacked her too quickly. She made a comment to my comment where she thought Amanda looked like she hadn't slept all night. My comment was that she looks creepy and she looked like she worried about something or still scared at whay she had heard last night behind Meredith's closed door.

I didn't see it the way Hot saw it, but I could understand what she was talking about.

Have you found out anything more about the 90 day deadline for the motivations?
d

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[RandyN]

The strangest thing about this upcoming documentary is the channel for which it has been commissioned. BBC Three is, very specifically, the BBC channel that is dedicated to providing "alternative" programming aimed squarely at a younger (16-34) audience. Most of its output is light entertainment and comedy, and where news or current affairs are featured (rarely), they are packaged in a way that's specifically designed to be accessible to (and appeal to) younger demographics.

Therefore it's hard to see how a documentary about Amanda Knox fits into the BBC Three remit. If this were a big-ticket, serious documentary, it would without doubt be carried on BBC One (the flagship channel) or BBC Two (the BBC's second channel, focussing more on factual/arts programming than the all-genres One). Or if it were more of a minority audience programme, but still with a serious bent, it would be on BBC Four, which is the BBC's smaller documentaries-only channel aimed squarely at the intelligentsia. Where it emphatically wouldn't be is BBC Three.

So something's definitely strange about this documentary, in terms of its genesis and the manner in which it was commissioned. I wonder what might have happened............

Stranger yet this is the same Paul Russell who was fired by ch 5 as he worked on an early docu for them about this case (back in 2007/2008 IIRC). The reason he was let go was because he was only presenting one side of the early story. Guess which side? So very early on Russell became Migninis mouthpiece. After his sacking he turned to writing the novel Darkness Depending.

He is currently partners directly with A Vogt and probably her Italian and somewhat less fluent English leading to speculation about husband....oh never mind.

I wonder when Yummi/Mach will be back?

For the Brits...since this case is not over and hearing rumors of severe slander laws there on the great Island...how is it that most reports seem tabloid and trashy in nature and Chan 3 can commission what will predictably be anything but a balanced report I would bet big money...?

Did Chan 3 not review P Russell record with docu's concerning this case? Will that make them liable for anything other than bad judgement?

This is the country where one still can not purchase a copy of "Waiting To Be Heard" correct? How is your little island different from Italy when it comes to free press do you suppose? Wait...I am unsure if Knox book is banned in Italy actually.

 

[Caper]

You know this isn’t TJMK, PMF .org/.net or injustice anywhere etc etc; is it?

I may live roughly 20 minute walk from where Meredith’s mother lives but I did not know the family before or since Meredith’s murder. That being said, either this thread has become a PIP echo chamber whereby there is no pretence of trying to win the hearts and minds of the great “don’t cares” through discussion verses making crass jokes or comments about the murder victim.

We are as one with regards to Guede.

That's kind of cool that you live that close actually. What do you mean by your last line?

 

[lionking]

Perhaps you can relate to us how Meredith's family responded to the news that the man that sexually assaulted and murdered their daughter will soon be out of prison on work release.

What's that? You don't actually have any comments related to the case but only jump in here to attack the posters that believe Amanda Knox and Raffaele are 100% innocent. If the Kerchers were really decent folks they would have pulled that dog of a lawyer off the case and sent in someone that was looking after their interests instead of propping up the prosecution and looking for the biggest personal gain. The Kerchers haven't got a moral ant hill as long as Maresca is representing them.


PS, what has Lionking ever done to try to find the Truth of what happened that night and through the ensuing prosecutions?

As I have said many times, I do not post in this thread in a manner to suit you or others. I made an on topic comment about an on topic, but incredibly crass, post of yours.

 

[Caper]

As I have said many times, I do not post in this thread in a manner to suit you or others. I made an on topic comment about an on topic, but incredibly crass, post of yours.

Translation: I couldn't be more wrong if my head was screwed on backwards... So rather then face reality... I'll just nit pik any point I can to make myself feel morally superior.... Because..you know... If I actually had to argue the facts of the case, the lies I would have to defend would not allow me to wash the scum of myself in the morning.

 

[RandyN]

Science marches on:

A simple method to extract DNA from hair shafts was developed by using enzymatic laundry powder at the first step of the process. The whole extraction can be finished in less than 2 hours. The simple extraction reagent proposed here contains only two cheap components: ordinary enzymatic laundry powder and PCR buffer. After extraction, an ultra sensitive fluorescent nucleic acid stain, PicoGreen, was used for quantifying trace amount of double-stranded DNA in the solution extracted. For further validation of DNA extraction, four primers were employed to amplify DNA microsatellite loci. Both fluorescence spectroscopy and PCR results suggested that this method can extract DNA from hair shafts with good efficiency and repeatability. The study will greatly facilitate the use of hair shafts in future for DNA analyses on genome-wide scale.

Do you know ....is this science about a dead hair or a live one?

 

[js202]

As I have said many times, I do not post in this thread in a manner to suit you or others. I made an on topic comment about an on topic, but incredibly crass, post of yours.

It is more or less self-evident that this is the case. But to come in and post in a hit-and-run manner after a controversial verdict, whilst others have avidly and seriously followed the developments of this issue over the course of *years* may leave one's posts open to ridicule. Or even contempt.

Capisce?

 

[Kaosium]

As I have said many times, I do not post in this thread in a manner to suit you or others. I made an on topic comment about an on topic, but incredibly crass, post of yours.

Why was there no appeal to Guede's mitigation for 'remorse?'

Wasn't that even crasser if you consider the implications?

 

[Strozzi]

Early, unverified reports on Nencini is that he regards this as a "Boys night out" crime. I'm not sure what that means.

The Italian Supreme Court, which rules on something like 80,000 cases a year, has with clarity directed the Nencini court to examine and pursue the sex orgy theory. That is why Nencini may be determining it was a "boys night out" event, rather than the victim coming home to a burglar trapped in her flat, or a rent money robbery, or the Halloween blood ritual carried over to the next night, or a momentarily turn to evil, or pooh in the wrong toilet, et al.

Machiavelli, please note I don't believe Mignini ever really claimed Satan was actually involved. I'm not citing that one as a prosecution motive.

 

[Desert Fox]

I may live roughly 20 minute walk from where Meredith’s mother lives but I did not know the family before or since Meredith’s murder. That being said, either this thread has become a PIP echo chamber whereby there is no pretence of trying to win the hearts and minds of the great “don’t cares” through discussion verses making crass jokes or comments about the murder victim.

I feel sorry for them. I will argue that they are wrong.
Still, in the Norfolk Four Case, the parents of Michelle Moore-Bosko still think they are guilty as of the last interview I heard from them.
Best you can do in the end is work around them.

My problem here is that I am really bothered by the problem with false confessions.

 

[Grinder]

Do you know ....is this science about a dead hair or a live one?

Dead animal hairs.

Hair shafts as a potential source of DNA is valuable for noninvasive study of human and nonhuman populations. It can be used in genetic analysis to identify individuals and breed in animal husbandry traceability, wild animal germplasm resources protection, forensic medical study and paleontological research, etc. The characteristic of mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) extracted from hair shafts has already been well described previously [1]–[5]. In addition, James Robertson et al. [6] described that mtDNA has limited value because mtDNA profiles cannot be compared with national and international databases of Short Tandem Repeat (STR) genotypes. Furthermore, mtDNA cannot discriminate maternal relatives and lack the discriminating power of STR profiles. However, fragmentation of the nuclear DNA (nuDNA) in the hair shafts was considered as a result of the keratinisation process [7] and nuDNA seldom been successfully analyzed. Thus, a major concern in the hair shafts DNA extraction and amplification today is trying to find an efficient, stable and easy way to extract DNA and amplify nuDNA targets.

ETA - count down until an unreadable link is provided by one of our favorites

 

[AmyStrange]

one of the good guys

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That's kind of cool that you live that close actually. What do you mean by your last line?

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C was responding to my post when I said I was upset about Rudy being able to go out and about.

Don't be too hard on lionking. I think he/ she really is one of the good guys.

Pssst (don't tell him/ her I said that though)

d

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[Mary_H]

I like and respect you too, Coulsdon.

However, lemme put it this way:

Remember a while back when the issue which was called the 'greatest miscarriage of justice in Canadian history' was being aired? The Guy Paul Morin case? It wasn't John Douglas who initially put those Canadian police onto Morin, it was the mother of the victim. Now she not only has to live with knowing her darling daughter was murdered, and that her son and friends used to molest her, but also that she helped implicate an entirely innocent man and destroy his life. She's come to terms with the fact he wasn't involved and has accepted it; I can't help but imagine that just made it worse.

I think they will regret to a certain extent the harm that came to Amanda and Raffaele, but I have even more feeling for them in terms of how embarrassed they are going to be when they find out how they were scammed by a bunch of sleazy shysters rubbing their hands together and drooling, "Trust me."

 

[Mary_H]

Mary, I saw that comment. It illustrated to me the Kercher family's inability to raise their voices against the light sentence given their daughter's killer and his probable work release coming up.

John Kercher has devoted more ink giving lip service to Mignini's "Foxy Knoxy" cult myth than condeming the real murderer of his daughter.

Has not one Kercher studied enough science to understand that the digestive evidence proves that their daughter/sister was irrefutably murdered by about 9:30 pm (when the defendants could not have been present). Does not one Kercher recognized how foul and fraudulent is the forensic investigation in this case? Do they not see the police and prosecution withholding scientific evidence or trotting out a chronic heroin addict/serial witness as their star fabricator? Nobody in the Kercher family has any comprehension of or respect for scientific evidence? Come on - they can't all be tabloids writers!

Is John Kercher so thankful to Mignini fdroids continuing his initial speculative theories about Kercher's daughter hooking up that John Kercher keeps silent about the horrible way Mignini, the police, and Stefanoni trashed the investigation?

It must be such a strange place for the Kerchers to be in, especially now when at least 75% of media coverage favors innocence. I can't imagine what it would be like to be told something by so-called legitimate authorities and then have the rest of the world tell me the authorities and my family are wrong. I think I would feel noble in resistance, too.

I can't help but speculate that the main issue that is keeping them committed to their point of view is the fact that Meredith died while Amanda lives. That's why they don't mention Rudy -- what they really want is another young woman's life in exchange for their daughter's. It's very sad. I don't see how they can break out of it.

 

[acbytesla]

You know this isn’t TJMK, PMF .org/.net or injustice anywhere etc etc; is it?

I may live roughly 20 minute walk from where Meredith’s mother lives but I did not know the family before or since Meredith’s murder. That being said, either this thread has become a PIP echo chamber whereby there is no pretence of trying to win the hearts and minds of the great “don’t cares” through discussion verses making crass jokes or comments about the murder victim.

We are as one with regards to Guede.

Frankly, I'm not sure what you're upset about Coulsdon. I virtually never see anyone on this forum say negative things about Meredith. I hardly ever see anyone make bad remarks about her elsewhere either. If it is just one remark, I'm far more likely to ignore it because addressing it only keeps that point in the conversation going. But if it becomes part of the the thread and the poster makes that type of comment on multiple occasions, I have no problem stomping on them. In fact, there was a PIP poster here that said negative things about the way Meredith looked and kept saying that the prosecution was pursuing Amanda because she is a NAZI and anti-semitic.

I sent that person multiple PMs and stomped on him regularly. I'm very sure he's been banned from this site as I haven't seen him post here in a long time.

This forum has become an echo chamber, but not because dissent is unwelcome, it just doesn't hold up to the scrutiny. Virtually none of PGP are ever interested in the actual evidence or logic in the case. Instead they focus on minutiae that is more like a Rorshach ink blot and say that proves that Amanda and Raffaele are guilty.

Coulsdon, I would like to think that if I was going condemn someone to more than 20 years in prison, that my reasons would be better than the ones than I've heard.
But hey, that's me.

 

[Diocletus]

Has not one Kercher studied enough science to understand that the digestive evidence proves that their daughter/sister was irrefutably murdered by about 9:30 pm (when the defendants could not have been present). Does not one Kercher recognized how foul and fraudulent is the forensic investigation in this case? Do they not see the police and prosecution withholding scientific evidence or trotting out a chronic heroin addict/serial witness as their star fabricator? Nobody in the Kercher family has any comprehension of or respect for scientific evidence? Come on - they can't all be tabloids writers!

I don't think that Kerchers are much for science.