Continuation Part Six: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Chris_Halkides]

Erasmus support

While Meredith had earned a Erasmus scholarship and Amanda hadn't, Amanda had earned admittance to a much higher rated institution.

I thought that LondonJohn posted a quotation to the effect that while Erasmus supported Meredith, it was not exactly an Erasmus scholarship. I am not sure that the distinction is terribly important, but maybe it is of modest significance.

 

[Bill Williams]

This is rumour, so please treat it as such.... I am trying to find a cite for it....

One of the present Corte di Cassazione judges is Paolo Micheli, the judge who passed judgement on Rudy Guede's fast track. He also at the same time sent Raffaele and Amanda to trial when he was working at that level in the Italian system.

The rumour is that when Micheli was hearing the case brought by Mignini over the 21 people charged in the Narducci case, Micheli confided that he should never have sent Knox and Sollecito to trial.

If true, please remember the "if" part of this, it is rather stunning.

 

[Grinder]

I thought that LondonJohn posted a quotation to the effect that while Erasmus supported Meredith, it was not exactly an Erasmus scholarship. I am not sure that the distinction is terribly important, but maybe it is of modest significance.

Okay! Just more of Meredith not being vastly superior to Amanda. I think it unfortunate that the PGP have spent so much time trying to make Amanda into everything bad while making Meredith into everything good.

They were both pretty average college students.

 

[Supernaut]

Just so we're clear;

does EVERYONE understand that the climber filmed in the C5 "documentary" broadcast a couple of months ago, who ascended to the window-ledge and then sat on it, did so without using, and in fact DESPITE, the bars installed since 2007?

Thanks.

 

[Supernaut]

Jaysus.

What's so difficult about my questions?

 

[acbytesla]

Okay! Just more of Meredith not being vastly superior to Amanda. I think it unfortunate that the PGP have spent so much time trying to make Amanda into everything bad while making Meredith into everything good.

They were both pretty average college students.

yea and average college students don't murder their roommates.

 

[toto]

Just so we're clear;

does EVERYONE understand that the climber filmed in the C5 "documentary" broadcast a couple of months ago, who ascended to the window-ledge and then sat on it, did so without using, and in fact DESPITE, the bars installed since 2007?

Thanks.

To be honest, as far as I can see, in the first part of the sequence, he does use the bars. The key sequence, when he doesn't, is from about a minute in from the link to the youtube clip that Grinder provided, that was taken exactly from the C5 documentary, when he explains how it is just as easy with the shutters closed. You then see him sitting on the ledge holding the bars in a later edit. But I would not be prepared to argue the point since anyone can see the sequence for themselves.

What I do understand is that the climb is clearly highly manageable for a young athletic person like Guede. (I think the bar discussion is a bit of a distraction actually, since it is clearly of zero relevance except for the obvious fact that they were subsequently seen to be needed)

 

[Planigale]

I agree except I don't understand the last sentence. All the stories about their relationship seem to be hearsay unless Meredith wrote somebody.



That is PGP standard fodder. Amanda was easily as accomplished as Meredith and mores o in sport and musically. While Meredith had earned a Erasmus scholarship and Amanda hadn't, Amanda had earned admittance to a much higher rated institution. Meredith was dating a guy growing pot and going for a BA (Dr. in Italy) while Amanda was dating a grad student from a wealthy family. Amanda had a job, Meredith didn't.

Meredith was no prude.

As a Yorkshire lass I have to point out according to Times world rankings Leeds U is 139 and Washington U 300 - 350 too low to even get an individual ranking.

 

[Supernaut]

To be honest, as far as I can see, in the first part of the sequence, he does use the bars. The key sequence, when he doesn't, is from about a minute in from the link to the youtube clip that Grinder provided, that was taken exactly from the C5 documentary, when he explains how it is just as easy with the shutters closed. You then see him sitting on the ledge holding the bars in a later edit. But I would not be prepared to argue the point since anyone can see the sequence for themselves.

What I do understand is that the climb is clearly highly manageable for a young athletic person like Guede. (I think the bar discussion is a bit of a distraction actually, since it is clearly of zero relevance except for the obvious fact that they were subsequently seen to be needed)

I watched the doco in its entirety.

If you haven't, I'm here to tell you; the guy hangs off the bars and then lowers himself and then re-ascends using only the ledge.

it appears that he was instructed to do so.

Why wasn't he instructed that he was NOT to use the bars as hand-holds in the first place.....?

Human stupidity - it seems to have no bounds.

 

[codyjuneau]

Just so we're clear;

does EVERYONE understand that the climber filmed in the C5 "documentary" broadcast a couple of months ago, who ascended to the window-ledge and then sat on it, did so without using, and in fact DESPITE, the bars installed since 2007?

Thanks.

.
Probably not, but I certainly do.

As you say it was despite the bars being installed.

It was also despite the window not being broken which would have allowed Rudy to reach in, unclasp the window, push it open, and have a totally unobstructed opening and ledge to clamber on and through.

And, if Rudy was wearing gloves, the broken window could have also assisted the first part of the climb by allowing him to grasp the frame of the window where the glass was broken out.

I still do not understand why it took 5 or 6 years for someone to properly test this, and that it was not even someone involved in either the defense or prosecution. The same with Nara's ability to hear a scream, or Curatola's ability to (not) hear the same scream. It seems much of this case is based on thought experiments rather than testing what is possible and what is not.

Most of all I do not understand the defense not verifying the police explanation of the bomb threat phone call. Maybe it was done, but I have never seen any indication that it was. The reward to effort ratio is potentially enormous, in my opinionated opinion.
.

 

[acbytesla]

As a Yorkshire lass I have to point out according to Times world rankings Leeds U is 139 and Washington U 300 - 350 too low to even get an individual ranking.

With all respect Planigale, University of Washington is not the same as Washington University. U-DUB which Amanda attended is in Seattle. Washington University is in St. Louis. U-Dub is a huge school with about 40 thousand students. Great school for engineering, science, biotech and nano tech, business and law. How it compares to Leeds, I have no idea.

But I have always thought school rankings are bull. As if the people that do the rankings actually have a clue. As a UW grad who went to community college for one year first, I can attest to the fact, that the quality of my education as a freshman at the Jr. College was actually better than my sophomore year at the U. Substantially more attention. I went from classes of 30 to 40 students and professors actually teaching the course to classes with 200+ students and profs who were disinterested in their students. Where teachers assistants did almost all the work. It wasn't until I started attending the upper level courses that I really began to see a benefit to going to a major University.

While, you know that MIT and Cal Tech are going to be top notch for science and there is no doubt going to Harvard, Yale, Oxford, Cambridge are probably going to benefit the students attending, if for no other reason than the contacts you will develop at those schools.

It really doesn't matter. Comparing Amanda and Meredith scholastically is impossible. I'm sure, both were dedicated students.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

University of Washington vs. Washington University

Planigale,

The University of Washington is in Seattle. Washington University is in St. Louis. Which one did you look up? These rankings need to be taken with generous grains of salt. A university can have a marvelous graduate program from which it justly earns renown, yet not be a great place for an undergraduate education. Conversely, a wonderful place to get an undergraduate education, such as Carleton College or Williams College (just as examples), may not even have a graduate program (these two do not).

 

[Sonia]

As a Yorkshire lass I have to point out according to Times world rankings Leeds U is 139 and Washington U 300 - 350 too low to even get an individual ranking.

As a Seattle lass, I have to point out that, according to the Times World University Rankings 2013-2014, the University of Washington is ranked 25 and Leeds is ranked 139. Actually, Leeds is tied at #139 with the Colorado School of Mines.

-Sonia, UW Class of 2012

http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2013-14/world-ranking

ETA: UW is a top university. All my professors were incredible. My fellow students were sharp and extremely well prepared and motivated.

 

[Strozzi]

Jaysus.

What's so difficult about my questions?

Yes, I understand that. In fact the bars were in the way as they protruded a bit and limited the space for his hands and for seating.

I want to point out that accomplished basketball players are very adept at jumping, twisting, turning, ducking, stretching, reaching, etc. How could anyone imagine that a semi-pro basketball player standing near the top of the lower window grate could not lift himself up and in Filomena's window.

 

[kwill]

As a Yorkshire lass I have to point out according to Times world rankings Leeds U is 139 and Washington U 300 - 350 too low to even get an individual ranking.

Repeating what others have said . . . the school that will soon be Amanda Knox's alma mater is 25th on that list. Also repeating what others have said, it doesn't matter.

 

[acbytesla]

As a Seattle lass, I have to point out that, in the Times World University Rankings 2013-2014, the University of Washington is ranked 25 and Leeds is ranked 139.

-Sonia, UW Class of 2012

http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2013-14/world-ranking

ETA: UW is a top university. All my professors were incredible. My fellow students were sharp and extremely well prepared and motivated.

That's great to hear Sonia, back in the late 70s when I went there, I was not that impressed with those 100 to 300 level courses. I had one class with more than 300 students and the professor could barely speak English. Frankly, I didn't think it was worth my time or my money. But my Jr and Senior year there was much, much better.

 

[acbytesla]

Repeating what others have said . . . the school that will soon be Amanda Knox's alma mater is 25th on that list. Also repeating what others have said, it doesn't matter.

Interesting, this list has UW in Seattle at 25 and Washington U in St Louis at 41 and Leeds at 133.

But as I said before, these lists are so subjective. This is all about reputation. A good learning experience is very subjective. What's more, the quality of the learning experience varies greatly from department to department. Want to be an aerospace engineer? The UW would probably be in the top 5. Biotech top 10 as well. Literature? who the hell knows?

 

[Poppy1016]

. You are the one talking rubbish. The fight or flight response delays digestion reserving energy to escape..The sympathetic nervous system is affected here. Vomit yes due to nerves.. A high fat meal including Gorgonzola pizza and buttery crumble easily could have been delayed somewhat outside of the 2 hour norm. Taking us up to a little after nine when the unpleasant arrival of the defendants occurred. Easily halting digestion to a TOD just before 10:20,

So now you claim to be an expert in this field? You sir are quite talented.

 

[Skind]

Suggesting that MK could have had delayed digestion due to prolonged stress is useless unless there's indicators of prolonged stress.

 

[Sonia]

Interesting, this list has UW in Seattle at 25 and Washington U in St Louis at 41 and Leeds at 133.

But as I said before, these lists are so subjective. This is all about reputation. A good learning experience is very subjective. What's more, the quality of the learning experience varies greatly from department to department. Want to be an aerospace engineer? The UW would probably be in the top 5. Biotech top 10 as well. Literature? who the hell knows?

Kwill linked to the 2011-12 version of the Times World University Rankings. I was referring to the 2013-14 list.

http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2013-14/world-ranking