Continuation Part Six: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Bill Williams]

To be fair, though, the early drafts of the script that I saw didn't require much juggling skill from that character at all - I reasoned that even Madison could handle the quick three-sponge-balls juggle that was scripted to take place in the middle of her harrowing discussion with the protagonist about his strict adherence to the rules laid out in the Tirthankara of Jainism.....

As it turned out, by the time Madison had arrived to audition, the script had changed such that her character was now required to perform an entire solo singing number - "Heaven is a Place on Earth" by Belinda Carlisle - while riding a unicycle and juggling five flaming torches. As you can imagine, I felt like a total mug putting her forward for the role under these changed circumstances, but she already had a non-refundable airline ticket and confirmed reservations at the Earls Court Premier Inn, so we decided it was worth a shot anyhow.

So I don't think that Marriott can justly feel aggrieved at my actions in regard to Madison's audition, under the circumstances. On the other hand, it was I who persuaded Marriott to sink $400,000 of his own money into the project - so maybe he's decided to recoup this total loss through withholding my wages......

Listen, chump, we have that report of yours on file. We read it in the Marriott lunch room for laughs.

Look, you're talking to the guy who spirited an international fugitive across a border frontier, and personally interceded with three criminal jurisdictions to subvert justice. Just ask Grinder. I don't know how, but he's obviously seen the file.

ETA: When I showed my FOA credentials to one senior investigator, he meekly asked if I knew the nuclear codes that The President carries around. I assured him I did, and further suggested that if the local flat foots didn't play ball, I'd personally reduce their puny border town to cinders.

And what have YOU done for Marriott lately? If I were you I'd bone up on torch juggling yourself. The Man is not amused, and you think you can weasel out of this with a fake story of early drafts!!???

Who do you think wrote the thing? Go see "Argo" chump before we take away your decoder ring.

 

[Rolfe]

The really sad thing is, there are people on PMF who probably believe you lot are being deadly serious.

Rolfe.

 

[Bill Williams]

The really sad thing is, there are people on PMF who probably believe you lot are being deadly serious.

Rolfe.

Reality is to be endured.

Comedy; now that's hard!

 

[LondonJohn]

Listen, chump, we have that report of yours on file. We read it in the Marriott lunch room for laughs.

Look, you're talking to the guy who spirited an international fugitive across a border frontier, and personally interceded with three criminal jurisdictions to subvert justice. Just ask Grinder. I don't know how, but he's obviously seen the file.

ETA: When I showed my FOA credentials to one senior investigator, he meekly asked if I knew the nuclear codes that The President carries around. I assured him I did, and further suggested that if the local flat foots didn't play ball, I'd personally reduce their puny border town to cinders.

And what have YOU done for Marriott lately? If I were you I'd bone up on torch juggling yourself. The Man is not amused, and you think you can weasel out of this with a fake story of early drafts!!???

Who do you think wrote the thing? Go see "Argo" chump before we take away your decoder ring.

Shut up: my financial situation is now so dire (owing to the lack of income from Marriott) that I've had to go global in my search for work. For the past few weeks I've been masterminding the PR strategy for Toronto Mayor Rob Ford.

 

[Diocletus]

So she has no relevance whatsoever to the case, ok thanks.

That's appropriate, since Amanda Knox has no relevance whatsoever to Meredith Kercher's murder. Well, except for he fact that she's been persecuted by scumbags in the name of Meredith Kercher.

 

[Diocletus]

Is the next court date the 16th of December and if so what's the agenda ? To review the report on the knife or are we moving on to other disputes/evidence ? I have it down as closing arguments ?

What is going to be interesting is how to make a closing argument before a jury that has heard almost no live evidence. What a dumb system.

 

[LondonJohn]

What is going to be interesting is how to make a closing argument before a jury that has heard almost no live evidence. What a dumb system.

Well, they're supposed to have read all of it and assimilated it. Not the same as hearing/seeing it in open court, it's true (especially in the Italian system where the court itself has the right to interrogate and examine during the evidence phase), but still probably sufficient to understand the arguments made in reference to the evidence.

 

[Bill Williams]

Shut up: my financial situation is now so dire (owing to the lack of income from Marriott) that I've had to go global in my search for work. For the past few weeks I've been masterminding the PR strategy for Toronto Mayor Rob Ford.

Ouch!!!!!!!!! Jesus, Mary, and Joseph....

Remember when we were in basic-FOA training together on Hell Island in the South Pacific? We were on the third night of a sleep-deprived, Navy Seal 6 team training mission, and were surrounded by the Ku Klux Klan in pick-ups and with shot guns - the Navy had imported them to simulate mock battle with PMF??

That night, you showed promise. You sold them Israel bonds. They buckled and told us what we already knew.

Whatever happened to this "LondonJohn", the skinny kid in glasses straight from the mathematics program at Cambridge, brought in for cypher training because you'd decoded Srinivasa Ramanujan's complicated pi series....

You were so young. So skinny. You wore a right-proper cardigan all the way through Hell Week, while we were sweating in t-shirts. Now that I remember, you didn't even sweat, claiming that proper Brits don't do such things like that.

Now you're slumming with Rob Ford? The horror, the horror.

 

[LondonJohn]

We don't even use the word "sweat". If we do anything in this area at all, it's "perspiring".

And working for Ford's not all that bad actually. Some of the "non-cash" remuneration is a damn site more enjoyable than Marriott's days out kayaking in North Cascades National Park.......

 

[Grinder]

Listen, chump, we have that report of yours on file. We read it in the Marriott lunch room for laughs.

Look, you're talking to the guy who spirited an international fugitive across a border frontier, and personally interceded with three criminal jurisdictions to subvert justice. Just ask Grinder. I don't know how, but he's obviously seen the file.

I read the coverage of your caper. You clearly wish to keep your relationship secret for some reason and think that these snarky responses fool some people. I never called Frank an international fugitive but perhaps you know more about that than I do.

ETA: When I showed my FOA credentials to one senior investigator, he meekly asked if I knew the nuclear codes that The President carries around. I assured him I did, and further suggested that if the local flat foots didn't play ball, I'd personally reduce their puny border town to cinders.

You are so silly and you don't capitalize "the president" unless you use his name.

Knowing Gogerty Marriott, I'm sure they would never hire you.

 

[Diocletus]

Well, they're supposed to have read all of it and assimilated it. Not the same as hearing/seeing it in open court, it's true (especially in the Italian system where the court itself has the right to interrogate and examine during the evidence phase), but still probably sufficient to understand the arguments made in reference to the evidence.

Might as well file a brief and have the "lay judges" vote on it. Kind of defeats much of the purpose of calling witnesses, engaging in cross-examination and pretending to have a real jury trial.

The "real" trial in this case turns out to be a re-examination of 2 worthless and certainly not incriminating pieces of evidence, and a review of the record upon which the preceding court acquitted.

I don't think much of their criminal procedure. Would be unconstitutional in the US, where we have a right to a real jury trial and double jeopardy protection after the jury has decided.

 

[Bill Williams]

Knowing Gogerty Marriott, I'm sure they would never hire you.

Now that's just cruel. It's clear I won't be asking you for a reference for my next super secret job!

 

[Bill Williams]

We don't even use the word "sweat". If we do anything in this area at all, it's "perspiring".

And working for Ford's not all that bad actually. Some of the "non-cash" remuneration is a damn site more enjoyable than Marriott's days out kayaking in North Cascades National Park.......

I've told you a thousand times.... don't bring up North Cascades.... now you're just being vindictive.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

"She didn't do it"

So she has no relevance whatsoever to the case, ok thanks.

False. Madison wrote a defense of Amanda that appeared in The Stranger. She was also the subject of a story in the Daily Mail and an article by Candace Dempsey.

 

[Matthew Best]

Mathew how do you know where I have posted? Is there a feature on JREF that lists every place someone has posted or does one need to review every post by going back page by page to my first post? Creepy.

I just guessed. Looks like I was right!

 

[Samson]

So she has no relevance whatsoever to the case, ok thanks.

It seems the relevance of Madison Paxton has now been covered. What is troubling about this case is that relevance of different issues seems to vary so widely according to the belief of the author.
Here is Edward McCall on time of death from PMF yesterday.
Since he is praised widely for his wiki endeavour, it is important to discuss his observations.

"Cornwell is not familiar with the evidence given the quote they used. The only evidence discussed is Cornerll making some claims about a focus on digestion as a way to establish time of death. Time of death is not important to the investigation nor was digestion used to establish it. The defense did hope to bring up digestion but it was a very minor part even for the defense. The only reason I know about digestion is that the brother of that unstable lawyer is obsessed with it. Early on he kept tweeting at me about digestion and demanding that I debate him on the topic. It would appear that Cornwell is confusing FOAKer positions with the positions taken by the prosecution."

Time of death has been widely discussed on this forum, and is of course extremely relevant to the time line required by the one convicting judge, Massei.
How do you see this subject, or do you agree with McCall it is not important to the investigation (irrelevant)?

 

[Grinder]

I just guessed. Looks like I was right!

Right. You just guessed. Funny.

Actually, I made a very few comments a long time ago on other threads.

 

[Grinder]

False. Madison wrote a defense of Amanda that appeared in The Stranger. She was also the subject of a story in the Daily Mail and an article by Candace Dempsey.

Wow an article in the Stranger the paper that has the brilliant Mudede and the source of the prank story and to top it off the Candace "Amanda is Innocent" column.

Madison is/was a good friend of Amanda and that's about it.

 

[davefoc]

... seems that folks on the discussion sites either side of this case just love vilifying each other, yeah I know they started it etc etc.

I've noticed that, at least in this thread. Posters that have been the most erudite have engaged in junior high style bashing of people that they disagree with which surprised me a bit. In my world of stereotypes I had thought that the proclivity and ability to write a serious, almost academic post would tend to preclude that kind of bashing. It seems that I was wrong about that.

I haven't spent much time reading through the Knox is guilty forums, but the particular thread that I looked at most recently surprised me. Guede was compared favorably to Knox and Sollecito by several of the posters. Wow. Once again, I failed to predict the range of human behavior.

The nature of the Machiavelli bashing has been interesting to me as well because it often enters the gray area between a personal attack and an attack on the argument. Several of my own posts have entered this gray area and I have wondered what is driving me there. Part of it, I am sure is that I have been curious about the nature of Machiavelli and I attempted to get a rise out of him/her with the hope of gaining some insight into Machiavelli's thinking. Part of it is that he/she has succeeded in getting a rise out of me and I have responded to the bait with a post that is arguably a personal attack.

 

[Grinder]

It seems the relevance of Madison Paxton has now been covered. What is troubling about this case is that relevance of different issues seems to vary so widely according to the belief of the author.
Here is Edward McCall on time of death from PMF yesterday.
Since he is praised widely for his wiki endeavour, it is important to discuss his observations.

"Cornwell is not familiar with the evidence given the quote they used. The only evidence discussed is Cornerll making some claims about a focus on digestion as a way to establish time of death. Time of death is not important to the investigation nor was digestion used to establish it. The defense did hope to bring up digestion but it was a very minor part even for the defense. The only reason I know about digestion is that the brother of that unstable lawyer is obsessed with it. Early on he kept tweeting at me about digestion and demanding that I debate him on the topic. It would appear that Cornwell is confusing FOAKer positions with the positions taken by the prosecution."

Time of death has been widely discussed on this forum, and is of course extremely relevant to the time line required by the one convicting judge, Massei.
How do you see this subject, or do you agree with McCall it is not important to the investigation (irrelevant)?

It is very important and the only thing that would point to a TOD after 10 is the questionable testimony of Nara and the even later testimony of her apartment house mate. Antonella Monachia heard people arguing in Italian and really had no time to assign.

PGP don't want to undo Curatolo and Nara et al. I've told them from the beginning that they would be better off dropping all the eye and ear witnesses.

The digestive evidence is not needed to bracket the death between 9 and 10. I'm waiting for that assaulter to come up with Meredith's phone history to prove she often laid around mis-dialing numbers.