Latest NSA claims, now you can hack a computer that's turned off

Graham2001

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Graham2001
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Intel has apparently turned up one of the holiest of holy grails in the tech sector, accidentally creating an zero-power-consumption on-chip 3G communications platform as an NSA backdoor.

The scoop comes courtesy of tinfoil socialist site Popular Resistance, in this piece written by freelance truther Jim Stone, who has just discovered the wake-on-LAN capabilities in vPro processors.
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http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/23/intel_stuns_world_with_wakeon3g/


Interestingly all of the above relies on an 'undocumented feature' for which no evidence exists and 'truther' now seems to be a catch all word for CTs...
 
Dumbest thing I've ever read. Makes Alex Jones' carp sound plausible.

Why can't these ******** put some thought into their BS ?

Edited by jhunter1163: 
Edited for Rule 10.
 
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Other than the 3g thing its not as impractical as you might think. Computers have some onboard power to do things like power their clock. With some cleaver engineering you could use that power to turn the power supply on and with some really clever engineering run some basic functions without generating enough heat to need to turn the fans on.
 
geni said:
Other than the 3g thing its not as impractical as you might think. Computers have some onboard power to do things like power their clock. With some cleaver engineering you could use that power to turn the power supply on and with some really clever engineering run some basic functions without generating enough heat to need to turn the fans on.
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I find machete engineering much more efficient.
 
Dibs!

More specifically, dibs on being the first to go to some 9/11 board and try to convince readers that the NSA thing doesn't work if you wrap your computer in aluminum foil

(always remember: shiny side out)
 
Dibs again!

I claim the right to go there and assert that the NSA is using a type of witchcraft in their latest surveillance program - which is code-named Voldemort.

(does Alex Jones ever hire free-lance writers?)
 
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geni said:
Other than the 3g thing its not as impractical as you might think. Computers have some onboard power to do things like power their clock. With some cleaver engineering you could use that power to turn the power supply on and with some really clever engineering run some basic functions without generating enough heat to need to turn the fans on.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, no. Wake on LAN is real and has been around for a long time, but in order to actually do anything of note on any computing device, you have to power up the processor and run an operating system on it. Powering up a CPU is an all-or-nothing proposition; and on a machine that has a CPU fan, that means generating enough heat to engage the fan (if it isn't hard-wired to power up when the CPU receives power, which I think the majority are). On a phone or tablet, silent backdooring is a more plausible proposition because they don't have fans and are asleep for the vast majority of their existence, but again, you can't just suck data directly from wherever it lives on the device through the network. You have to power up the machine's circuitry and address it, and at some point, someone would notice. Us geeks get a little paranoid about power usage in our devices.
 
Wow, the nutters have finally discovered WoL, only 16 years late.............
:rolleyes:
 
geni said:
Other than the 3g thing its not as impractical as you might think.
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Oh yes it is.

geni said:
Computers have some onboard power to do things like power their clock.
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Yes, it's called a battery. Typically a good old CR2032 button cell.

geni said:
With some cleaver engineering you could use that power to turn the power supply on and with some really clever engineering run some basic functions without generating enough heat to need to turn the fans on.
Click to expand...
With a battery designed to supply ~90 microwatts for long term use and maxing out at ~30 milliwatts? Please describe how your idea would work.
 
thedopefishlives said:
Unfortunately, no. Wake on LAN is real and has been around for a long time, but in order to actually do anything of note on any computing device, you have to power up the processor and run an operating system on it. Powering up a CPU is an all-or-nothing proposition;
Click to expand...

If that was the case then case dynamic frequency scaling wouldn't work. If you can run the thing slow enough it won't need a fan and thats a solvable problem. Not that I've heard of anyone doing it with a PC CPU. GPUs yes CPUs no.

On a phone or tablet, silent backdooring is a more plausible proposition because they don't have fans and are asleep for the vast majority of their existence, but again, you can't just suck data directly from wherever it lives on the device through the network. You have to power up the machine's circuitry and address it, and at some point, someone would notice. Us geeks get a little paranoid about power usage in our devices.
Click to expand...

Evidence suggests that people didn't notice until a court released some details:

"Judge Jones
granted the application, authorizing continued interception at the
four restaurants and the installation of a listening device in
Ardito's cellular telephone. The device functioned whether the phone
was powered on or off, intercepting conversations within its range
wherever it happened to be."

http://www.politechbot.com/docs/fbi.ardito.roving.bug.opinion.120106.txt
 
thedopefishlives said:
Computers, how the :rule10 do they work?!
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Should I start at the doped semi-conductors, logic gates, or the OSI model? :)

Seriously, When I see stuff like this or claims of the level of internet surveillance propounded by people who don't understand technology I'm reminded of Ambrose's Law: Any technology, no matter how primitive, appears magical to those who don't understand it.
 
catsmate1 said:
With a battery designed to supply ~90 microwatts for long term use and maxing out at ~30 milliwatts? Please describe how your idea would work.
Click to expand...

You've basicaly got 3 options:

1)off means some form of standby
2)off means off but the switch can be operated with very little power (the switch probably being some kind of transistor)
3)You use a capacitor to drive a slightly harder to turn on switch.
 
is someone seriosuly suggesting you can run a PC from the power held in the CMOS battery to a sufficent level to get the HD working????
 
Dcdrac said:
is someone seriosuly suggesting you can run a PC from the power held in the CMOS battery to a sufficent level to get the HD working????
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No you can run it to the level where you can turn on the power supply (its the next bit thats difficult). The initial claim talked about the think being turned off not unplugged.
 
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