Continuation Part 5: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Briars]

But he got the day of the murder wrong. If he saw bunny suits, he might have seen them on the day after the body was found, or the day after that, or the day after that.



Pretty good answer, except for the Jovana Popovic connection.

Yes they have an alibi up until her visit.

 

[Mary_H]

Yes they have an alibi up until her visit.

You have to wonder why they did not invite her to join them for the rest of the evening's festivities.

 

[RandyN]

I saw Steve Moore and his sound test in the apartment above Nara. Hardly scientific,though he did admit to hearing someone walking outside, Too bad he didn't ask them to scream loudly.

Too bad it wasnt Steve Moore. Hint it was PC.

 

[RandyN]

Randy.....................

I fully support equality for women...I hope you appreciate my efforts.

 

[RandyN]

What about the scream described by Rudy Guede at around 9:20 - 9:30? Is this thing on?

 

[JREF2010]

I saw Steve Moore and his sound test in the apartment above Nara. Hardly scientific,though he did admit to hearing someone walking outside, Too bad he didn't ask them to scream loudly.

Too bad the people standing outside the cottage didn't hear the scream.

 

[Bill Williams]

I'm going to spell it out in case you really don't get it . Lets say Halloween fell on a Sunday. There would be parties Friday Saturday and Sunday night in many cities and towns wherever Halloween is celebrated.

Except in Italy where Nov 1 is All Saints Day, where families traditionally take flowers to graves.... and it is a holiday which eclipses Hallowe'en....

Once again, a post that tries to skew things towards guilt....

 

[Bill Williams]

Bill she wasn't the only witness to wake to a scream , that gives more weight . Now whether you want to focus on Nara or not you can hear sounds from the valley like dogs or talking outside the cottage from the parking lot. You cannot here such sounds sitting where Curatolo sat. That is a fact. What those sounds tell us is that the sound that carries up to the parking lot , would be impossible to hear in the Piazza. Nara's window is directly above the parking lot facing the valley.

I not sure why you still claim all this stuff. Then when "Steve Moore" actually does what you asks, you say he's not an expert. Sheesh.

 

[JREF2010]

Her window faced the valley a prolonged scream was heard by two witnesses. I hear through glass windows no problem. I can hear my neighbor playing trumpet in the winter.

The scream was probably from inside the apartment complex, the witnesses who heard it localize the source. No one outside the complex heard this scream, supposedly as loud as a fire engine some imagine it to be.

And anyway, no one saw anything so its weak jabber about nothing and is why the last higher courts weren't interested in it. It will be the same outcome if its brought up again. It means nearly nothing.

The murder was over by 10:13-10:15pm when Rudy was outside the cottage per Merediths cell phone ping and per Rudys testimony to Matteini.

And lets not forget all the activity of the tow truck and broken down car and people in the car park garage not hearing any scream.

 

[RWVBWL]

Inside or Outside?

There were not "screams" just one and that is an important distinction. Waking up to one you would listen question what you heard and keep listening. That is why Nara couldn't justify calling police , she didn't hear fighting or screaming she heard one scream running then nothing. Nara said she hadn't heard a scream like that before, which made it stand out. As far as the noise can you hear a dog barking coming from the valley in Piazza Grimana or hear people talking outside on the cottage patio? No absolutely not the trees ,buildings , traffic noise and distance prevent that, but guess what you can hear both these sounds standing in the upper parking lot facing the cottage.It is the nature of the landscape with no obstruction, If these sounds carry up to the parking lot then a loud scream would certainly be heard through a closed window above.

You are comparing outside sound with inside sound?

Did that loud apparent scream, uninhibited by trees, buildings, traffic noise and distance, happen outside?

The murder happened inside of a house,
not outside in the adjacent valley or on an outside patio.

Inside.
On a chilly November night.
Meredith arrived home about 9:00pm
The supposed scream Nara heard happend after 11:00pm, right?

Do you really think that Amanda, Raff, and Rudy Guede forced Meredith to play a sex game gone wrong on a chilly night with the windows of the house and/or the front door wide open?

Do you really believe that Nara, with her own doors and windows closed,
could hear a dog barking or people talking from inside another house with its own doors and windows closed from across a street and a parking lot?

 

[RWVBWL]

People outside?

The scream was probably from inside the apartment complex, the witnesses who heard it localize the source. No one outside the complex heard this scream, supposedly as loud as a fire engine some imagine it to be.

And anyway, no one saw anything so its weak jabber about nothing and is why the last higher courts weren't interested in it. It will be the same outcome if its brought up again. It means nearly nothing.

The murder was over by 10:13-10:15pm when Rudy was outside the cottage per Merediths cell phone ping and per Rudys testimony to Matteini.

And lets not forget all the activity of the tow truck and broken down car and people in the car park garage not hearing any scream.

Hey JREF2010,
Wonder if anyone outside heard the scream?

IIRC,
Rudy Guede said that he saw alotta people out+about and people playing basketball when he left Meredith's flat, right?

Yep,
he does mention it, page 4 from his German prison diary:

I left the house in shock. I was outside, but didn’t know
where to go, seeing still all that blood. It was all so red. I
thought of going home. I had wet trousers and tried to
cover it with the sweatshirt. There were a lot of people in
the street, in Piazza Grimana. There were some guys still
playing basketball even though it was dark.

But Frank Sfarzo, in an interview with Curatolo from April 2008, writes this:
By the way, about the facts, what Antonio Curatolo told me is that that night he didn't see anyone at the basketball court


Wasn't Antonio Curatolo outside by the time Rudy Guede left Meredith to die alone in her bedroom so he could hit the nightclubs?
Was there or was there not anyone playing ball that night?
No one outside heard the scream?

 

[Dan O.]

That's it ? thanks for sharing your best. Who on PMF said this thread was embarrassing?

Thanks for stopping by

You are doing an excellent impersonation of a troll. I like the way you constantly repeat unsupported claims and then drop statements like the one above when someone shows that they have tired of your game.

You probably haven't noticed but when you aren't posting the same old crap you've posted many times before we actually make progress digging into the little unresolved issues, finding overlooked pieces of relavent information and comming to a better understanding of the case.

Maybe someday you will learn to join the conversation by being prepared to support your claims. But right now you are just a distraction.

 

[RWVBWL]

Rudy didn't see 'em either...

when asked by the investigating police shortly after the crime he said nothing. He didn't come forward with the tale of unusual behavior sighting for months and only after the cub reporter convinced him. He had the day wrong in that he described Halloween and disco buses that weren't there. He admitted being high on heroin everyday including the night of Nov. 1st 2007.

People that owned businesses there saw nothing.

He didn't pick the kids out of a line-up and had months to read up on the details.

He was conveniently arrested on a 2003 dealing rap during the appeals trial and thereby was kept from the press and then conveniently died in prison.

What a joke. Oh and the other cases he testified in...

Arrested and died in prison "conveniently" really, part of the bigger plot ?? Students would have been in costumes Nov 1 as well. Halloween is not a traditional Italian holiday and has only been celebrated this decade. Hardly a big mistake, more important that the accused were not there Halloween night by their own alibi's and Curatolo was certain he saw the men in white coats the day after the sighting.

Hey Briars,
Have you ever read Rudy Guede's German prison diary?

I find it odd that Rudy Guede makes no mention of seeing people wearing Halloween masks or costumes anywhere as he went thru town with bloody hands back to his home after leaving Meredith to die. I don't recall him ever saying that he saw people in costumes or masks when he went dancing at the nightclubs later that night, do you?

No mention of it anywhere, not even in the Skype call either...

Weird.
Maybe it was because all Rudy kept seeing was red?
I don't know, errr, well maybe, I'll speculate, there wasn't anyone wearing masks or costumes on the night after Halloween?
Hmmmm, I wonder...

 

[RWVBWL]

Abat-jour?

You probably haven't noticed but when you aren't posting the same old crap you've posted many times before we actually make progress digging into the little unresolved issues, finding overlooked pieces of relavent information and comming to a better understanding of the case.

Ahh, but Dan O.,
we do find little pieces of info when responding to Briars and friends...

Here's something else I just found, from, yep page 4 of Rudy's diary:

I wasn’t able to see him well because the house was not
well lit. Only Meredith’s room had light. I remember
because the abat-jour was switched on.

Did Meredith borrow Amanda's night light already?

 

[Antony]

I'm going to spell it out in case you really don't get it . Lets say Halloween fell on a Sunday. There would be parties Friday Saturday and Sunday night in many cities and towns wherever Halloween is celebrated.

Except that Hallowe'en in 2007 was on a Wednesday. What have Friday 29 October and Saturday 30 October in an unspecified year got to do with a murder that happened on Thursday 1 November 2007?

 

[Diocletus]

Is there an award?!

Oh, the Most Interesting Man in the World. Stay thirsty, my friends.

 

[Bill Williams]

Ahh, but Dan O.,
we do find little pieces of info when responding to Briars and friends...

Here's something else I just found, from, yep page 4 of Rudy's diary:



Did Meredith borrow Amanda's night light already?

Amanda had already placed it in the room that afternoon in anticipation of needing it for a clean-up.

 

[codyjuneau]

Ahh, but Dan O.,
we do find little pieces of info when responding to Briars and friends...

Here's something else I just found, from, yep page 4 of Rudy's diary:

Originally Posted by Rudy Guede
I wasn’t able to see him well because the house was not
well lit. Only Meredith’s room had light. I remember
because the abat-jour was switched on.

Did Meredith borrow Amanda's night light already?

.
RW, you are right, the discussion always favors the PIPs when truth is discovered.

And good find about the lamp.

Maybe Rudy is preparing an explanation in case his fingerprints are found on Amanda's desk lamp. If he attacked Meredith in the dark, he would not realize Meredith had her own table lamp. After Meredith screamed, he may have gone to Amanda's bedroom window to see if anyone was responding. When the coast was clear, he may have taken Amanda's lamp back to Meredith's bedroom to survey the damage with some subdued light.

If you recall, when he broke into his neighbor's house (the lady with the gold watch), he caused a fire by putting a cloth over a lamp. I suspect the cloth was being used to subdue the light from the lamp, not to deliberately start a fire. So using a subdued light is part of his MO ... IMO.

As an aside, one thing I have always been curious about is why Rudy told his Skype friend that Meredith's scream was loud enough to be heard from the street. How would he know? Did he see someone reacting to the scream? Or perhaps someone told him about it?

And similar to your argument re Nara, if Meredith's scream could be heard from the street, it was because Filomena's window was already broken open.
.

 

[Dan O.]

Ahh, but Dan O.,
we do find little pieces of info when responding to Briars and friends...

Here's something else I just found, from, yep page 4 of Rudy's diary:

Did Meredith borrow Amanda's night light already?

Did you know that we found and discussed that in the original thread many years ago? This could be referring to one of the desk lamps or the wall light. There is insufficient information to say which.

The state of any lights being on when the door is kicked open is also not discovered. This and the state of any objects in the room should have been the subject of the first round of questioning for everyone that was at Meredith's door that afternoon.

 

[Briars]

What about the scream described by Rudy Guede at around 9:20 - 9:30? Is this thing on?

Thanks for the reminding me Rudy and Amanda also mention the scream.