New TWA Flight 800 film coming out

[beachnut]

The so called investigation of TWA 800 which included the NTSB and FBI and perhaps FAA clearly seemed to not want to consider over 200 credible witnesses who saw what looked to them like a missile. The damage to the plane seemed not to be from the center fuel tank exploding but something exploding outside the plane. So there was some level of collusion in my opinion (and others)... that the above alphabets lied.

Maybe... I would say that every bureaucratic establishment will lie to protect its franchise. Lying is an American as apple pie.

What cured you from posting lies from 911 truth of CD and an inside job? Which study, what papers?

I read the witness statements and they did not see missiles. Like 911, some are easy to fool, they don't read the facts and evidence first and believe the woo pushed by a few nuts. I agree, it sounds good sometimes to have "dirt" on your favorite liars, but on 911 and 800 the woo followers failed to read the stuff before following the nuts who spew woo. http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9464300#post9464300
The 800 thread is over yonder, and the woo of an outside explosion BS will fail as there is no evidence for the. ... the witness who saw windows from 17 miles,... . Like 911, a new study on 800 will not cure the faithful who failed to read the reality based studies before accepting on faith, what they want to believe, and rage against the man.

800 is another new study that would not get "die hard government is a liar woo followers" to read the old studies and learn how to do aircraft accident investigation.

Why do 911 truth followers jump on the wagon of woo without reading and researching the entire event?

 

[swright777]

I'm still waiting for the Long Island Coroner's report/testimony and for the name of the submarine captain who was relieved of duty. You want to talk about dodging? I bet that not only do I not get a straight answer, he also just ignores my post like it never existed, as he's done every other time I've posted this query.

He'll probably ignore it when I quote your post too, but just in case...

 

[kookbreaker]

I'm still waiting for the Long Island Coroner's report/testimony and for the name of the submarine captain who was relieved of duty. You want to talk about dodging? I bet that not only do I not get a straight answer, he also just ignores my post like it never existed, as he's done every other time I've posted this query.

You'd think he'd at least clean up the easy ones, such as the 'Long Island Police' one. That would just involve him checking his source and saying "sorry, meant to say Suffolk County Police - here's the article".

But no.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

The so called investigation of TWA 800 which included the NTSB and FBI and perhaps FAA clearly seemed to not want to consider over 200 credible witnesses who saw what looked to them like a missile. The damage to the plane seemed not to be from the center fuel tank exploding but something exploding outside the plane. So there was some level of collusion in my opinion (and others)... that the above alphabets lied.

Maybe... I would say that every bureaucratic establishment will lie to protect its franchise. Lying is an American as apple pie.

Well, there is your problem right there. Stop reading the Trvther Sights and read the analyses by people with more than a grade school education.

Investigators from six countries, 19 federal agencies, two aviation companies and two labor unions retrieved 5,000 pieces of evidence from the Atlantic. Two agencies, the National Transportation Safety Board and FBI, conducted exhaustive investigations into the cause of the crash of Flight 800, as well as possible terrorism. The FBI ruled out terrorism in 1997. Three years later the NTSB revealed in a 400-page report that the crash was likely caused by a short circuit that ignited fuel vapors in the center wing tank, which delivers excess heat from air conditioning units out of the plane. The explosion, which occurred 11 minutes into the flight, separated the nose of the plane from the cabin, lifting it into the air before bursting into flames and nose-diving into the ocean.

Joseph M. Kolly, director of the NTSB Research and Engineering division, delivered a PowerPoint presentation outlining the contents of the report, as well as several rebuttals to Hughes and Stalcup’s claims. The NTSB spent four years considering possible suspects in the case, everything from missiles to meteors to lightning to electric pulse.
“Did you think you’d still be doing this today?” a reporter asked.
“No, no I didn’t,” Kolly said. “There is no evidence of high energy penetration [missile strike] … it’s very clear to us that this was a central wing tank explosion and not anything else.”
Kolly was cool and methodical as he paced the auditorium and delivered the familiar facts of the case. His colleague, NTSB senior aviation safety investigator Bob Swaim, was a bit more fiery as he refuted claims about explosive residue found on several pieces of wreckage—contaminated by FBI and military personnel during the recovery process—and explained electrical components to a room full of communications degrees.

http://freebeacon.com/ntsb-clears-up-twa-800-conspiracy-theory/

 

[catsmate]

Those metals are not contained in Boeing 747 construction. So therefore you haven't accounted for them. Nor has the government.

Really? You're actually saying that aluminium and titanium aren't used in aviation?

Do you understand that you lose this debate on this one point alone?

That'd be the point you've just lost perhaps?

By the way, like most of what you post, if we traced this you would find those were metals used in US missile warhead incendiary devices.

State which missile warhead supposedly uses those materials. We're waiting.
We're also waiting for something other than your unsupported claims that those materials were found in the manner you claim.

Sephton is not an idiot prone to statements that would blow up on him. He was an MIT professor.

So? Argument from Authority fallacy.

The shaking proved a missile.

That'd be the shaking that sould have required a multi-kilotonne nuclear explosion to actually have happened?

If you follow the thread the FBI documented pellets found in the body of a victim that consisted mostly of aluminum with traces of titanium, zirconium, cerium and barium. The shape and proportions of those materials was consistent with US warhead incendiary devices.

And again with the unsupported assertions. State which missile warhead supposedly uses those materials.

Tansy's quote from witness Mike Wire's FBI statement clearly said the blast from the explosion hit him with a concussive force that was accompanied by a violent shaking of the bridge on which he was standing.

Which, if it had actually happened, would have required a multi-kilotonne nuclear explosion.

Meanwhile Kallstrom admitted the tracks in question were Naval vessels.

Evidence?

Tell it to the missile pellets found in one of the victim's body's and recorded by FBI.

Evidence?

Or FBI's seat glue?

Actually the adhesive residue to traced by the NTSB, confirmed by the manufacturer and tested by NASA. Again you are wrong in your claims.

 

[catsmate]

Good. Flagrant dodging is a tacit admission of guilt.

Is this who you've avoided addressing the numerous flaws in your claims?

 

[catsmate]

What is a 'warhead incindiary device'?

A made up CT term perhaps?

The FBI won that court case. ..., this claim failed out of the box, never made the curve.

Bah, mere facts.

The aircraft is made of aluminum. The rest of the elements are found in paint. oops

Well Titanium and Zirconium are also used in high temperature turbines. I wonder if you'd find any of them on a jet aircraft...............
Cerium is an additive in aluminium alloys, and very common in electrical devices due to its use in magnets.
Barium is also used in aerospace alloys.
Of course you're also right on them being used in paints.

You'd think he'd at least clean up the easy ones, such as the 'Long Island Police' one. That would just involve him checking his source and saying "sorry, meant to say Suffolk County Police - here's the article".

But no.

Yeah CTs hate to give up on any part of their fantasies.

 

[beachnut]

A made up CT term perhaps?


Bah, mere facts.


Well Titanium and Zirconium are also used in high temperature turbines. I wonder if you'd find any of them on a jet aircraft...............
Cerium is an additive in aluminium alloys, and very common in electrical devices due to its use in magnets.
Barium is also used in aerospace alloys.
Of course you're also right on them being used in paints.


Yeah CTs hate to give up on any part of their fantasies.

Yes all the metals can be in aircraft. It is sad he can't source his faith based beliefs.

Yes, the engines could have been damaged and turbine blades could be liberated and hit stuff. I spend a morning picking up turbine blades from an engine that destroyed itself. The blades melted into the runway tar at the seams, and were all over the place.

All the metals are in aircraft. But he has to share the lies he googled, he believes this stuff on faith.

 

[Andy_Ross]

In allthe length of this thread has anyone mentioned why the Govt would shoot the aircraft down anyway? (apart from the claim it was shot down by the 'Cabal'to force the Govt to cover it up and so be controlled by the 'Cabal')

 

[matt.tansy]

In allthe length of this thread has anyone mentioned why the Govt would shoot the aircraft down anyway? (apart from the claim it was shot down by the 'Cabal'to force the Govt to cover it up and so be controlled by the 'Cabal')

JB brought up Cashill's theory that the Navy was trying to shoot down a kamikaze Cessna but accidentally hit TWA 800.

 

[Robrob]

JB brought up Cashill's theory that the Navy was trying to shoot down a kamikaze Cessna but accidentally hit TWA 800.

That's the theory recently espoused by a CT on another board I frequent.

The best theory...The small commuter plane was flown by a terrorist with 1000 lbs of explosives on it, on a "kamakazi" mission to take down a "wide body"....The P-3 Orion was tracking it and the Navy shot at the Kamakazi...First missle missing the small plane and going through FLT 800, taking out the front leading edge of the right wing and an engine..(found in the closest of the debris field) the second missle hitting the small plane and detonating the explosives while the plane was almost along side of FLT 800....

A claim was also made:

President Clinton enacted Executive Order 13039 (I have a copy of this order obtained through FOIA) on March 11 1997, which states any member of the Naval Special Warfare Group that leaks data in regards to the recovery/investigation of TWA flight 800 will not be protected by federal whistle-blower laws. A Master Chief aboard the USS Trepang did eventually come forward (after retirement) but rescinded his statements after being threatened by the Navy.

Of course the Executive Order didn't actually say that (and is publicly available, not requiring a FOIA request). The response to that was:

...do some research. It was signed specifically for the groups involved with the TWA recovery. Any time a president signs an executive order lifting federal whistle blower protection it always spans all branches of the military. Yet this order only dealt with the naval group operating 10 miles off the coast of Long Island in a classified op called Global Yankee 96 the night TWA went down. To this day the Navy divers who participated in the salvage recovery can't talk about it. Why not? It was a civilian "accident"! Also the FBI clearly was investigating the Navy early on so why would they let the Navy recover salvage if they were a chief suspect initially? A reporter asked Jim Kalstrom (head of the investigation) why the Navy was participating in the recovery process (when they were a suspect) at a press conference and the reporter was thrown out of the conference?????

 

[matt.tansy]

How could they possibly know it was loaded with 1000 lbs of explosives?

 

[Myron Proudfoot]

How could they possibly know it was loaded with 1000 lbs of explosives?

It's one of those universal measurements.

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/monster.png

 

[abaddon]

It's one of those universal measurements.

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/monster.png

LOL. Is xkcd omniscient or what?

 

[Jetblast]

The FBI won that court case. ..., this claim failed out of the box, never made the curve.

You never produced the documented FBI stuff. You talk about hearsay, but you never produced the documented stuff. Do you have it?

That's not really honest. All parties admitted they documented pellets that could not have come from a Boeing that perfectly conformed to US warhead incendiary pellets. The only reason FBI "won" is because they got away with murder on a technicality by saying they lost the documents.


It's not really difficult to defend pure government corruption. You have some powerful bullies on your side.

 

[Jetblast]

Here is a screencap from Stellarium showing what the pilots would have seen if it were dark. Gamma Pegasi was directly in front of the aircraft.

Gamma Pegasi is also known as Algenib, Greek for "the flank" or "side". Where did the missile hit TWA 800, boys and girls? That's right. In the side! We're down the rabbit hole, people!

http://i.imgur.com/TWmAeOD.png

But wait, I thought you said CIA's Zoom Climb explained the streaking object hundreds of witnesses saw?

So which one is it?


Boy, what I would give to see Tansy go to VietNam veteran Meyer's face and tell him he saw Gamma Pegasi.

 

[Jetblast]

Yes, it was real. The possibilty of what it could have been though can be eliminated. Could a US Navy cruiser have avoided being seen by the people within 2 miles of it, by a decorated Vietnam veterran helicopter pilot within 5 miles of it, or by dozens of people within 10 miles of it? No.

You still haven't explained it. The way evidence works is you can't not explain critical evidence.

Kallstrom: "They were Naval vessels."

 

[carlitos]

The way evidence works is you can't not explain critical evidence.

 

[Jetblast]

What happened to the passengers on the planes? They were real people. Carry on insulting their memory.

What???


There are many family members who are outraged at the false investigation.

You are forgetting your side has been proven to have lied and committed crimes in the investigation.

 

[Jetblast]

Really? You're actually saying that aluminium and titanium aren't used in aviation?

Since the point was more than clear to anyone with any basic intelligence that the pellets were shaped like US warhead incendiary shrapnel and were composed of the exact same metals in direct proportion I'll consider this regressive evasion the obvious tacit admission of guilt it is and a concession of the issue.

It isn't honest to demand evidence that is presently being criminally withheld by FBI as we have more than reasonably shown. You haven't explained what they were since even FBI admits they were not metals found in Boeing construction.

I would like to get you people in front of a jury.