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New TWA Flight 800 film coming out

Don't know if it's been already discussed but I just listened to the Skeptoid podcast on this subject. His analysis of the issue with eyewitness reports and the speed of sound is pretty conclusive.
 
Robrob said:
Don't know if it's been already discussed but I just listened to the Skeptoid podcast on this subject. His analysis of the issue with eyewitness reports and the speed of sound is pretty conclusive.
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Sound takes about 5 seconds to do a mile so the sound of the explosing would take about 50 seconds to do 10 miles.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
Sound takes about 5 seconds to do a mile so the sound of the explosing would take about 50 seconds to do 10 miles.
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Yep, which of course puts the lie to the majority of claimed "eyewitness accounts" of a missile in flight Most of them claiming to have heard an explosion before turning to look at the plane and then seeing a missile, etc... E.G. the plane exploded and then almost a minute later they looked up at it - and saw a missile in flight?

Of course not that they let truth or reality get in their way.


TWA flight 800

President Clinton enacted Executive Order 13039 (I have a copy of this order obtained through FOIA) on March 11 1997, which states any member of the Naval Special Warfare Group that leaks data in regards to the recovery/investigation of TWA flight 800 will not be protected by federal whistle-blower laws.
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Here's the actual text of Executive Order 13039:

Executive Order 13039 of March 11, 1997
Exclusion of the Naval Special Warfare Development Group
From the Federal Labor-Management Relations Program
By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including section 7103(b)(1) of title 5 of the United States Code, and having determined that the Naval Special
Warfare Development Group has as a primary function intelligence, counter-intelligence, investigative, or national security work and that the provisions of Chapter 71 of title 5 of the United States Code cannot be applied to
this organization in a manner consistent with national security requirements and considerations, Executive Order 12171 of November 19, 1979, as amended, is further amended by adding the following at the end of section 1-
205:
‘‘(i) Naval Special Warfare Development Group.’’
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Nothing at all about Flight 800. Not to mention, why would you have to FOIA a document publicly available on the national Archives website?
 
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I heard back from the author, Cashill, on the impossibility of the witnesses claims of blast waves being so strong at 10 miles as to shake a bridge or house. "I took them at their word."
 
carlitos said:
I heard back from the author, Cashill, on the impossibility of the witnesses claims of blast waves being so strong at 10 miles as to shake a bridge or house. "I took them at their word."
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Well dang I guess that settles it then, lol....but what about the witnesses' that didn't report it? Do they cancel out each other?
 
matt.tansy said:
Was any member of the Naval Special Warfare Development Group involved in the investigation of TWA 800?
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Doubtful. Odds are the CT loon saw "Naval" and "Executive Order" in the same citation and jumped to the inevitable conclusion.
 
matt.tansy said:
Was any member of the Naval Special Warfare Development Group involved in the investigation of TWA 800?
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Extremely unlikely but possible I suppose. The NSWDG is the successor to SEAL Team Six and is an operationall SOF unit rather than an investigative unit; it's *possible* that the expertise of some of there members was requested during the investigation.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
WHy not, he ignores my experience with Navy AA missiles in actual combat over the story from a man sat on a bridge 10 miles away.
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Sorry, Fred Meyer and his massive credibility as far as brilliant anti-aircraft high-explosives flashes, is what is being ignored here.

He saw TWA 800 impacted by a surface to air missile. You didn't.

The investigation was caught mis-quoting him and lying about what he said.
 
beachnut said:
Show us your MACH 4 ejecta from the RADAR data; where is the paper?
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Physicist Thomas Stalcup produced this evidence. You demand we jump through your hoops and hurdles but anyone can see you have yet to produce a simple explanation for the unidirectional ejecta plume caught on radar. Tansy tried to get away with radar obfuscation however his arguments failed to answer the basic question of how an alleged fuel tank explosion for which you have no evidence caused such a one-sided event? I've asked this several times now and your side has yet to come-up with a credible answer for it. Tansy got awfully evasive when pressed to give a direct answer on this. Your CIA animation shows a symmetrical tank blast pattern, so why does the hard radar data show something completely different? Where is YOUR paper on this?
 
catsmate1 said:
Extremely unlikely but possible I suppose. The NSWDG is the successor to SEAL Team Six and is an operationall SOF unit rather than an investigative unit; it's *possible* that the expertise of some of there members was requested during the investigation.
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Ah. SEALs were employed for the wreckage recovery as divers along with about 10 other Navy commands that had divers (EOD, underseas medicine, maintenance activities, etc). I can't find from which team though. If they were from SEAL Team Six then they are subject to the Executive Order; if they're not then they aren't.
 
LSSBB said:
It was an SSBN. They carry ICBMs. They do not carry Surface to Air Missiles. They are not even fitted for them. There is a substantial difference between a Trident and an SM-2. There is also no Guided Missile equipment mounted anywhere on an SSBN, to guide the SAM to the target.
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From the 'What Really Happened To Flight 800' website:



" Despite early denials, the Navy finally admitted that there had been three submarines present in the area on the night of the crash. The Trepang; a Sturgeon class attack submarine, the Albuquerque; a type 688 Los Angeles class fast attack submarine equipped with vertical launch tubes, and the Wyoming, a nuclear ballistic missile submarine just out of Groton on sea trials. It has just surfaced that something went wrong on those trials, delaying the commissioning of the Wyoming, and her captain and exec were relieved of command. "



What about the Trepang?


One of its seaman claimed "We shot down Flight 800."


You guys are great at demanding information. Especially when any credible people's democracy should have access to its military records in such an event. You operate under the premise that the government and military always tell the truth. Even right next to your own written statements that they have an accepted license to misinform (lie).
 
carlitos said:
I heard back from the author, Cashill, on the impossibility of the witnesses claims of blast waves being so strong at 10 miles as to shake a bridge or house. "I took them at their word."
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Yeah, he should have been more critical of people who had no reason to lie making-up a shocking memory of blast-shaking. Especially when two witnesses said the same thing separately without speaking to each other.


Very strong arguments you make.
 
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