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The Mormons' Challenge

Correa Neto said:
Oh, good. My odds of going to Heaven increased!

Wait, no. Its Hellfire for me aniway. I'm atheist... Despite being a good guy, not accepting the word of Jesus Christ is all it takes to drop me in to the lakes of fire and brimstone. By the way, I am supposed to accept Jesus's words as said by whom? The Pope, Joseph Smith, Luther or one of those Neopentecostal teleevangelists?

Not to mention god may think I managed to make lots of people think dirty jokes in a most mischievous way.
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The gods will have to fight for my soul. I'm condemned by the Christian and the Muslim god and all the other hellflingers out there so they're going to have to go two out of three falls to see who gets the privilege of burning me forever. (Gods' energy bill must be hellish.)
 
John Jones said:
Who?
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Seriously? From context, I would have thought even an average mind would have realised it was intended to be Joseph Smith, and excused the simple slip from someone who evidently isn't overly concerned about the precision of knowledge in that particular sphere. If there are points to be won and lost, I'm happy to concede that I am not only relatively ignorant of a wholly fictitious folktale, but also slapdash in my remarks regarding it and the petty details of its provenance. I'd devote more time to the study of it, but I'm too busy trawling the internet looking for trivial errors and highlighting them. One day I hope to have a life...
 
Janadele said:
It is wise to resist unseeming behaviour Correa.

Participants in this thread should also realise that LDS Missionaries have a message to deliver to the world from Jesus Christ. Debate and contention is not their reason nor their assignment. The world is to be given the chance to accept or reject this message from Jesus Christ, and therefore cannot say they did not bring the consequences of that choice upon themselves.
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Initially I thought this was a fair point, but on second thought I'm not willing to give you that much credit. YOU send these people to US. You don't get to then pretend that the fact that we can point out errors in these people's statements is somehow excusable. Particularly not when it's information readily available to any Mormon. If we know your theology and the history of religion better than your missionaries, it is a demonstration of your missionaries' failure to learn their own faith before preaching it--a serious failure. If this is a consistent pattern, it's a demonstration of a failure of the administration.

The issue isn't their debate skills. It is their knowledge. They have NO excuse, NONE, for not knowing their faith better than us heathens.
 
Dinwar said:
Initially I thought this was a fair point, but on second thought I'm not willing to give you that much credit. YOU send these people to US. You don't get to then pretend that the fact that we can point out errors in these people's statements is somehow excusable. Particularly not when it's information readily available to any Mormon. If we know your theology and the history of religion better than your missionaries, it is a demonstration of your missionaries' failure to learn their own faith before preaching it--a serious failure. If this is a consistent pattern, it's a demonstration of a failure of the administration.

The issue isn't their debate skills. It is their knowledge. They have NO excuse, NONE, for not knowing their faith better than us heathens.
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I'm in total agreement here. If these kids went to their basements and read their fake story about barley in the New World and didn't try to convince anyone else about their beliefs, fine; I'd leave them alone. However since they enter themselves into the marketplace of ideas, it's game on. They have to compete. If they show up on my door (or recently, approach me on a commuter train) they assumed the risk. I feel no problem at all destroying their beliefs and publicly humiliating them.
 
Omni god's minions fail to convince me it is real and demands being worshiped according to those instructions.

And its MY fault...

Yeah. :rolleyes:
 
Garrette said:
The Christian gentleman's approach was effective only from a rhetorical point of view; his comments had no more merit than did those of the young LDS missionaries. Further, he had one of those nasty skills that I find more distasteful than what the missionaries were pushing: He had the skill of verbal bullying while making it appear he was the victim of it. Notice how he said something to the effect "You think overtalking will work on me?" then he proceeded to talk over the young man. He then said "We're having a discussion," but he wasn't; he was preaching.

This is the kind of man not to engage in public debate except in circumstances that allow for fair exchange as he will skillfully turn it into a game of showmanship, a game at which he will rarely lose, though his facts are non-existent.
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If you listen to the very end when he makes a comment to his friends he is also unpleasant about 'Israelites'. What I take away from it, not knowing any scripture well, is the contradiction between the Bible and the BoM. Of course they're both nonsense on stilts.
 
strummer said:
If you listen to the very end when he makes a comment to his friends he is also unpleasant about 'Israelites'. What I take away from it, not knowing any scripture well, is the contradiction between the Bible and the BoM. Of course they're both nonsense on stilts.
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Agreed on all counts.
 
Craig4 said:
... If they show up on my door (or recently, approach me on a commuter train) they assumed the risk. I feel no problem at all destroying their beliefs and publicly humiliating them.
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In such instance it is yourself who shows ignorance, bad manners, and who exposes yourself for what you are.

Do not think mere mortals who follow Lucifer can "destroy the beliefs" nor "humiliate" those who are true followers of Jesus Christ. It is not their concern where you spend eternity. It is the elect of God, whose immortal Spirit recognises His message, who the dedicated LDS Missionaries are seeking.
 
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Janadele said:
In such instance it is yourself whose shows ignorance, bad manners, and who exposes yourself for what you are.

Do not think mere mortals who follow Lucifer can "destroy the beliefs" nor humiliate those who are true followers of Jesus Christ. It is not their concern where you spend eternity. It is the elect of God, whose immortal Spirit recognises His message, who the dedicated LDS Missionaries are seeking.
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The few, the proud, the elect.
 
Janadele said:
In such instance it is yourself whose shows ignorance, bad manners, and who exposes yourself for what you are.

Do not think mere mortals who follow Lucifer can "destroy the beliefs" nor humiliate those who are true followers of Jesus Christ. It is not their concern where you spend eternity. It is the elect of God, whose immortal Spirit recognises His message, who the dedicated LDS Missionaries are seeking.
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Such compassion from your God -- he pre-chooses people for salvation then condemns the ones he didn't choose because he didn't choose them.
 
I could never choose a religion that promotes hate, bigotry, and misogyny. And I tell the missionaries that come to my house just that.
 
Janadele said:
No Garrette, not at all.
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Actually, yes, for both the Christian God and the Mormon variant, at least in some versions, and most assuredly in the post of yours I quoted.

The whole idea of a Chosen People ( which I only recently learned is called the Scandal of Particularity) was one of the major realizations that placed me on the path to atheism.
 
Janadele said:
In such instance it is yourself who shows ignorance, bad manners, and who exposes yourself for what you are.

Do not think mere mortals who follow Lucifer can "destroy the beliefs" nor "humiliate" those who are true followers of Jesus Christ. It is not their concern where you spend eternity. It is the elect of God, whose immortal Spirit recognises His message, who the dedicated LDS Missionaries are seeking.
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What about us mortals who give no more a fig about "Lucifer" that about any other invented 'gods'?

WHy did your 'god' equip its missionaries form a book rife with falsehood?

(Do you intend to go back to your other thread, and answer the questions you abandoned there? I am particularly amused by your contention that a 700,000 year-old Przewalski's Horse fossil indicates the presence of a horse culture in the pre-Colombian americas--when is the BoM set, again?)
 
Garrette said:
Such compassion from your God -- he pre-chooses people for salvation then condemns the ones he didn't choose because he didn't choose them.
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You may argue all sorts of points against Mormonism, including the propriety and mechanics of divine election if you care to acknowledge a divine anything at all, but I think you will find that Mormons are vehemently opposed to the idea of predestination. Historically it is one of the reasons Mormons and the sects springing from Calvinism never got along.
 
Janadele said:
In such instance it is yourself who shows ignorance, bad manners, and who exposes yourself for what you are.

Do not think mere mortals who follow Lucifer can "destroy the beliefs" nor "humiliate" those who are true followers of Jesus Christ. It is not their concern where you spend eternity. It is the elect of God, whose immortal Spirit recognises His message, who the dedicated LDS Missionaries are seeking.
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In addition to being a mere mortal, I also happen to be correct about the barley.
 
Janadele said:
In such instance it is yourself who shows ignorance, bad manners, and who exposes yourself for what you are.

Do not think mere mortals who follow Lucifer can "destroy the beliefs" nor "humiliate" those who are true followers of Jesus Christ. It is not their concern where you spend eternity. It is the elect of God, whose immortal Spirit recognises His message, who the dedicated LDS Missionaries are seeking.
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Not gonna lie this made me LOL. So you believe that all muslims, jews, Buddhists, Hindus, etc are going to be burning in hell for all of eternity for not following Jesus correct? In other words, about 70% of the worlds population?
 
Quad4_72 said:
Not gonna lie this made me LOL. So you believe that all muslims, jews, Buddhists, Hindus, etc are going to be burning in hell for all of eternity for not following Jesus correct? In other words, about 70% of the worlds population?
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It's how all religion works, They [insert religion here] picked the right god and you better get on board with the winning team or burn forever.

Mormon's got a leg up, They have a quaker with a magic hat and mystical underwear.
 
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