I'm confused. Are you saying that that's evidence that psychics are phony, or evidence that hell and sin are imaginary? Or perhaps evidence of something else? Or maybe just an idle observation for entertainment purposes?
Proof of Life After Death!!
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I'm confused. Are you saying that that's evidence that psychics are phony, or evidence that hell and sin are imaginary? Or perhaps evidence of something else? Or maybe just an idle observation for entertainment purposes?
You are correct if all time happens simultaneously. If not, the selling of indulgences was banned at the Council of Trent back in 1564 or so. Perhaps you're having a past life recollection?
Yes.
tsig
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When I was in the Catholic seminary there were always priests saying mass who had been paid to say them in behalf of a loved one in Purgatory.
Catholics still believe in indulgences:
An indulgence that may be gained in any part of the world is universal, while one that can be gained only in a specified place (Rome, Jerusalem, etc.) is local. A further distinction is that between perpetual indulgences, which may be gained at any time, and temporary, which are available on certain days only, or within certain periods. Real indulgences are attached to the use of certain objects (crucifix, rosary, medal); personal are those which do not require the use of any such material thing, or which are granted only to a certain class of individuals, e.g. members of an order or confraternity. The most important distinction, however, is that between plenary indulgences and partial. By a plenary indulgence is meant the remission of the entire temporal punishment due to sin so that no further expiation is required in Purgatory. A partial indulgence commutes only a certain portion of the penalty; and this portion is determined in accordance with the penitential discipline of the early Church. To say that an indulgence of so many days or years is granted means that it cancels an amount of purgatorial punishment equivalent to that which would have been remitted, in the sight of God, by the performance of so many days or years of the ancient canonical penance. Here, evidently, the reckoning makes no claim to absolute exactness; it has only a relative value.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07783a.htm
While you technically can't straight out buy an indulgence you can offer up your money as a sacrifice and that could carry an indulgence.
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
Denial, I think. She couldn't stand having her beliefs challenged.
Now I am going to show my age. Thirty years ago, as a teen, I ate and drank astrology, tarot cards, dowsing, ley lines, earth energy, ouija boards, and on and on and on without end. Fun times. I can tell you only two things about all of that:
1. It is all bunk. All of it.
2. No amount of argument from me will convince any believer that this is the case. Seems to me that unless you think your way out of it rationally, one simply moves on to the next bunk. I know I did way back in the day. Even that is no guarantee. I had a lecturer, long since deceased. He was a demon on antenna design. He wrote the book as it were. He was also convinced that he could use antennae to detect ensoulment of a fetus 15 femto seconds after conception. Nobody ever asked how he measured that.
You got me there.Which one, please?
From my perspective:
Psychics are phony.
Hell and sin are nothing more than beliefs in a persons mind.
It could be evidence of something else and my mind is open to whatever that might be.
I take most things in this thread as idle observations and entertainment.
How do you see things?
Well, you get no argument from me that Catholics still believe in indulgences. And while you can say prayersoffer up money as a sacrifice that could carry an indulgence. That is considered Simony and isn't allowed.
Also, any priest who accepts payment to say mass or for any other form of prayer is considered guilty of Simony by the Catholic church, and is subject to excommunication.
Quoting the same source you have used, here on the matter of Simony:
So, I'm sorry, but the statement you made ("the Catholics even let you buy your loved ones out of the torment") is incorrect, your experience in seminary notwithstanding. But I am impressed with your ability to weave both a straw man ("Catholics believe in indulgences") AND an argument from authority ("when I was in the Catholic seminary, etc") fallacy into a single post. Most of the skeptics on this forum are usually only capable of one at a time.
Most "psychic phenomena" are easy to explain as spurious. A very few aren't, which is a far cry from saying that they are evidence of the existence of same. There are some anecdotal data that are interesting enough to warrant more rigorous investigation in my opinion.
Agreed, completely.
All kidding aside, a psychic never saying that someone is going to burn in hell is perhaps evidence that bearers of bad news don't get paid very well and not much else. I appreciate your open mind.
I take most things in this entire forum (let's say 75%) as meritricious, self-important blather, half of which is malicious as well. The rest is pretty interesting.
So, I would say we're not that far apart actually.
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tsig
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Most "psychic phenomena" are easy to explain as spurious. A very few aren't, which is a far cry from saying that they are evidence of the existence of same. There are some anecdotal data that are interesting enough to warrant more rigorous investigation in my opinion.
Agreed, completely.
All kidding aside, a psychic never saying that someone is going to burn in hell is perhaps evidence that bearers of bad news don't get paid very well and not much else. I appreciate your open mind.
I take most things in this entire forum (let's say 75%) as meritricious, self-important blather, half of which is malicious as well. The rest is pretty interesting.
So, I would say we're not that far apart actually.
You ought to strive for your posts to be in the non malicious half.
Aepervius
Non credunt, semper verificare
Most "psychic phenomena" are easy to explain as spurious. A very few aren't, which is a far cry from saying that they are evidence of the existence of same. There are some anecdotal data that are interesting enough to warrant more rigorous investigation in my opinion.
Agreed, completely.
All kidding aside, a psychic never saying that someone is going to burn in hell is perhaps evidence that bearers of bad news don't get paid very well and not much else. I appreciate your open mind.
I take most things in this entire forum (let's say 75%) as meritricious, self-important blather, half of which is malicious as well. The rest is pretty interesting.
So, I would say we're not that far apart actually.
I followed you example and removed the 75% "meritricious, self-important blather"
"Most easy spurious. aren't, far that of same. anecdotal interesting more my.
All , psychic someone burn perhaps of get and. I mind.
things forum (75%) meritricious, , half malicious . rest .
So, we're apart .
"You are welcome
(ok my humour maybe isn't that good)
FluffyPersian
Critical Thinker
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FYI, Designer handbags are not "nothing;" like Rolexes, women use them to signal their wealth and position in society. Moreover, the most desired bags are not "simple items;" Hermes and other top companies are smart enough to use expensive materials and difficult-to-replicate methods so that their products can be easily distinguished from cheap fakes.
So the two are not comparable.
Apology
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Plus handbags are tangible
Elizabeth I
Philosopher
The Mormons let you baptize your relatives post-mortem, in absentia, so they can be saved even though they've already died.
PiscesMercury
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I have seen the ugliest goods ever being purchased just because they have designer names. Also from experience I know that expensive goods are not always good quality ones. Plus my brother picked up a Rolex and gave it to me, I can't say it has made a difference in my life. As for signalling status, I guarantee that many goods fail to do that. I had the funniest experience when I was at university. I had bought shoes that cost less than a dollar, just because I liked them. So this rich snobby art student runs up to me and says, "Where did you get those shoes?! I love them!!" I almost took them off my feet and gave them to her. Ha ha, I could care less about Dolce & Gabanna etc. Speaking of Dolce & Gabanna who have a penchant for tax evasion...they should have come to my country where no one has to pay taxes.
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I'll do my best.
I followed you example and removed the 75% "meritricious, self-important blather"
"Most easy spurious. aren't, far that of same. anecdotal interesting more my.
All , psychic someone burn perhaps of get and. I mind.
things forum (75%) meritricious, , half malicious . rest .
So, we're apart .
You are welcome
(ok my humour maybe isn't that good)
That's pretty interesting.
Plus handbags are tangible
Edible even, in a pinch.
Wealth and position in society don't exist without belief and are therefore inherently subjective concepts.