Looking for Skeptics

[Stray Cat]

Let me explain that. If your laptop is bad with audio, then you are going to hear things that are not on the original recording. This would be noise that is introduced to the speakers but is not on the actual audio file. It can also explain noise introduced to your recordings as well. This is a technical/equipment issue and not a spirits manipulating wires issue. And let's face the facts here. Most laptops are not made for quality audio recording and playback.

This.

Plus many audio applications (bearing in mind Flaccon is using a webcam application to record with) have 'auto-level record' which will as the name states automatically alter the input recording level of the microphone depending upon what level of signal is going through it. As a result silence and near silence will turn up the record level of the microphone as the circuitry expects to hear noise of some sort, making it extremely sensitive to even the slightest background sound as the input level gain is increased beyond 0db. Just the circuitry increasing and reducing the input signal can introduce chirp and warble sounds and any noise from the moving components within the laptop will be exaggerated.

 

[Dumb All Over]

flaccon, is it your intention to apply for Mr. Randi's Million Dollar Challenge?

 

[TjW]

My point regarding Paredolia is this, it does not account for what appears to be a super-imposed photo-like image of my eyes, and my brother's eyes. It does not account for the image of my late sister. It does not account for the magnitude of images, so refined that one can count the teeth in the mouth's of some of the images. It does not account for voice-recognition of 2 of the spirits.

Yes, it does.

 

[Maurice Ledifficile]

flaccon, is it your intention to apply for Mr. Randi's Million Dollar Challenge?

No. She will not fly... She wants to apply to a group in the UK.

 

[Mojo]

If this is Paredolia, and it's not something one "suffers" then this cannot be Paredolia because it is to the point of suffering.

You're confusing two slightly different meanings of the word "suffer". Paredolia is not a disease, it is a phenomenon.

 

[Maurice Ledifficile]

I didn't really point out the Cassandra story, a member asked me her/his thoughts on the take, and I couldn't find the post, which appeared ignorant on my side, so I mentioned it in hope that member would see I had not forgotten. But that aside, its the name-calling, and everyone has a right to make a claim. My claims are true Maurice, I lost my Father and I accidentally found him. Everything I am trying to say here, is true. I do keep repeating, and I don't mind doing so, but I have been to the GP, several times, and he is helping me, he does realise that Psychiatry will not benefit this situation. He also has guidelines, like what the Churches have, which of course are really just irrelevant issues, considering the magnitude of this.

My site will polish in time, but the claims have to remain. There is no public advertising going on. I'm not allowed to shout out in jubilation in the real world, it's considered crazy for the common person to have such a revelation, but I can on the internet, whilst gathering witness upon witness in the meantime.

I really have to sign out and go, have a good day.

Well, if you are sick, you have all my sympathy, and I encourage you to insist on getting the proper help from your GP.

If you are not sick, then your site is just another scam aiming at taking advantage of vulnerable grieving folks.

I personally highly despise this type of business and I'm not alone. That's exactly the sort of thing that kept Houdini going and is also to an extent why The Amazing Randi is doing the work he does.

 

[Mojo]

What might a church do about it?

An exorcism?

 

[chillzero]

My site will polish in time, but the claims have to remain. There is no public advertising going on.

You have a publicly visible website. That is all that is required to be considered advertising, particularly when you are soliciting use of a service.
You are on very shaky legal ground.

 

[Mojo]

and once again, your website is an advertisement. Anyone who stumbled across it with a google search or followed the link to it from this thread could legitimately submit a complaint about it to the Advertising Standards Authority who can investigate based on a single complaint, and take action up to and including prosecution.

They don't actually prosecute, but they can refer persistent infringers to Trading Standards. I'm not sure how often this happens.

For websites that refuse to remove infringing claims, there is a list of "Non-compliant online advertisers".

Prosecution, is the best hands-on I can hope for right now. I have tried the more private route, respectfully for over 5 months. I can't be dismissed because of it's bizarre content, if I am to be prosecuted, because at last my evidence would have to be heard out hands-on.

Probably not. In a prosecution it would probably be up to the prosecution to prove that you were deliberately misleading, not necessarily that your claims were false. The ASA's procedure is different in that they can put the burden of proof on you to show that you have sufficient evidence to back up your claims.

NB: I am not a lawyer.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

I was planning to take a listen to flaccon's files yesterday, but my internet died last night, and I don't have time while at work. I'm not sure when my internet will be undead, but it looks like there would be little point, given that flaccon hasn't even acknowledged Strat Cat's second manipulation of her recording and has since declared that these recordings only work on her computer, and seems to understand very, very little about the technology she's using.

flaccon, I hope you get the help you need.

 

[IXP]

flaccon,

Unlike anyone else on this thread who listened to your uploaded file, I was able to "hear" voices on it. In fact, I identified what sounded like a voice at exactly the one place that you have since pointed out specifically: the "dog bark" on the file that Stray Cat uploaded. I had identified the voice there before you had mentioned it on this thread, so I was not influenced by your assertion.

But you heard "Evidence" there, while I heard "It will do". What does this tell us?

If I might be so bold, I would say that the coincidence is enough to make it likely that that bit of the recording sounds more like speech than other parts, since we both identified it independently. I think there is enough similarity in what we heard, i.e. the number of syllables and the 'd' sound in the third syllable, to make it likely that we are responding to the same stimulus.

Then there is the fact the word(s) we heard were completely different. This tells me that it is a speech like sound, but far from clear and unambiguous. The two of us fit it to different words. So, is this a spirit communicating, or is it two people trying very hard to make out words where they do not exist. Which seems more likely?

If it is a spirit communicating, how do you know that you are getting it right and I am getting it wrong? Is it not possible that it is the other way around? If ten people listen and all hear something different is it still spirit communication? Or does that dreaded pareidolia sound like a better explanation?


IXP

 

[DuvalHMFIC]

If you talk to "over 1000 spirits", how can you be so sure that you can contact anyone's loved ones? In the grand scheme of things, 1000 is a tiny, tiny, tiny fraction of all the dead spirits that should be out there, considering how many people have died in the history of humanity.

And if communicating with them is such a struggle as to even make out a word like evidence amongst a garbled mess, how valuable or important can a message from the persons loved one even be in the first place?

"Cool. I've been waiting to hear grandma tell me the word Pizza. Thanks for giving me an idea for dinner granny, you always had a way with word."

 

[Alderbank]

We tried a couple of online activities, and Alderbank will hopefully confirm the rest.

Sorry Flaccon but I must add my voice to all the others who disagree with what you remember.

You sent me two PMs, first asking me for personal details and the second inviting me to call a landline and listen to a recording which I declined.

I suggested

Flaccon, have you thought about what you would like to do when we meet up? Adman gave you some good ideas in post #42 as did Pixel in post #48. I note you have not commented on any of these yet.

I can bring along cards and envelopes or anything else you ask for.

If you would like to change any of their protocols at all, this is the ideal forum to discuss it

later

In post #315 I asked you a simple question. Essentially I said Pixel and I are willing to visit your venue at a time and date of your choice to help you carry out whatever demonstrations you choose to substantiate your claim - what exactly would you like to do?

after more prompting, you replied

Found it, sorry. I would think it best if we asked the spirits.

We didn't make any more progress after that.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

I guess you just don't suffer from pareidolia, then.

I only (whimsically) make out words if I repeat one of the quieter sections over and over. It sounds much like you describe to me on first listen as well. I am not saying there are any words to be heard there, only that if I really try, I can eventually come up with something, and once I have, it reinforces itself after repeated listening.

IXP

I should perhaps have said that I do indeed experience pareidolia, but not in the case of that particular recording. I tend to start 'hearing' murmuring voices when listening to white noise or other continuous broadband noises.

But I mend audio equipment for a living so perhaps that recording is too familiarly characteristic of recording equipment at the limit of its abilities for me to imagine anything else into it.

 

[Biscuit]

If the effects of pareidolia are causing you suffering then stop making recordings, stop playing them back, and stop looking at microscopic drops of dried blood. At the end of the day the pareidolia is not causing your suffering its your interpretation of the results of pareidolia and your repeated exposure to the conditions under which you experience it.

If every time I saw a cloud that looked like a dragon I interpreted that as an actual dragon I would probably be pretty damn miserable as well.

 

[Donn]

Of course it's dodgy, I've never put a website together in my life. I spend 22 years with my nose in Antique books.

You have a gift for missing the point.

Here it is plainly:
Why does your website have the following text on the following pages:

http://www.chapter23.org/default.html
To book an afternoon/evening appointment, please contact Flaccon or Patricia via email to bookings@chapter23.org, or text postcode and number in group, to 07753 263 143.

Groups of 4 to 6 people preferred. Private bookings are also welcome.

http://www.chapter23.org/About-Us.html
My name is Tracey Patricia (spirit name; Flaccon) Our aim is to enlighten as many souls as possible. Please state your reason upon booking, Bereft/Grieving, Guidance, Searching a loved one, Spiritual Healing/Enlightenment, curiosity, skepticism. Each situation is treated accordingly, and with utmost respect.

Hours of business: Afternoons/Evenings.

http://www.chapter23.org/Contact-Us.html
Please fill out the form below to be added to our customer list.
?

These are all words that reveal a business aspect to your website. The highlights are keywords that support this.

Why do you have this wording if you are not profiting in any way?

Remove these words, or remove the business aspect, and you will be on the straight and narrow again.

 

[Stray Cat]

... given that flaccon hasn't even acknowledged Strat Cat's second manipulation of her recording...

Nor the version I uploaded that was unprocessed so people could compare.

 

[Maurice Ledifficile]

Flaccon did alter her website recently. I no longer find the following:

[For skeptics: We can offer you a £1000 reward, against a £100.00 donation made by yourself to your chosen Charity, if you can debunk "our claim" or simply re-create the "Art work and Voices" in the same style as spirits have created it.
"Claim" = Spirits exist, have voices and are performing amazing art work in millimeters.
P.S. Your chances are slim.. ]

It's pretty easy to see why Flocon would not mention this part in the present thread and why one would chicken out...

I would bet more than that on certain skeptics being able to reproduce her results...
(ETA: Not that I'm suggesting it would be worth the effort)

 

[wardenclyffe]

Sorry Flaccon but I must add my voice to all the others who disagree with what you remember.

You sent me two PMs, first asking me for personal details and the second inviting me to call a landline and listen to a recording which I declined.

I suggested


later



after more prompting, you replied



We didn't make any more progress after that.

I believe (and hope) that flaccon meant that you (and hopefully Pixel42 and members of her local sceptics group and the one in Chester) would participate in some sort of controlled test.

Ward

 

[Foolmewunz]

Flaccon did alter her website recently. I no longer find the following:

[For skeptics: We can offer you a £1000 reward, against a £100.00 donation made by yourself to your chosen Charity, if you can debunk "our claim" or simply re-create the "Art work and Voices" in the same style as spirits have created it.
"Claim" = Spirits exist, have voices and are performing amazing art work in millimeters.
P.S. Your chances are slim.. ]

It's pretty easy to see why Flocon would not mention this part in the present thread and why one would chicken out...

I would bet more than that on certain skeptics being able to reproduce her results...
(ETA: Not that I'm suggesting it would be worth the effort)

Oh, I can reproduce the results, readily. My son cut his finger this afternoon, just a wee cut - nothing serious. But a droplet of blood splattered on his t-shirt. OMG!!! It's L. Ron Hubbard. Of course, it's microscopic and I won't be able to post a picture of it for the next four hundred posts, and once you get it you have adjust your monitor to the highest contrast possible, and then put an index card over your left eye, jump up and down on your right foot, swing a dead chicken in a burlap sack around your head counter-clockwise four times in a graveyard at midnight during a full moon and then squint with your right eye (you didn't remove the index card from the left eye, did you? crap, we've got to start all over again) and check the droplet from a distance of fourteen meters... but there's L. Ron! See? There's his eye. Or is that a foot. Oh, no, that's the ear and the eye is over there... yeah, that's it.

So you're all going to sign on for Scientology, right? I mean, I have proof.