Belz...
Fiend God
The point is that if the customer makes the calculation when he orders the pizza, the price in BTC might be completely different when the time comes to pay up, etc.
How To Use Bitcoin – The Most Important Creation In The History Of Man
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The point is that if the customer makes the calculation when he orders the pizza, the price in BTC might be completely different when the time comes to pay up, etc.
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
I could quote the price in BTC at the time the order was placed or at the time the customer took delivery. It depends on what we agree to.
If the first thing you have to do when trading in a currency is figure out what the currency is worth, is it really a currency? I have never gone to a store in the US, put down some goods and money, and seen the cashier check a table to find out what the Dollar was trading at in relation to the Euro.
Belz...
Fiend God
Well if you agree to a dollar value in BTC then it's fine, but then why not pay in dollars ? Otherwise one of you is screwed.
Chaos
Penultimate Amazing
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Please don't tell me you think you are being clever?
No, I think YOU are being - to put it diplomatically - foolish.
Worse - what price do I as the pizza provider charge for a pizza, if a specific amount of BTC could be worth half its current value tomorrow, and twice its current value by the end of the week?
I cannot price it too high, because that would scare away the customers.
I cannot price it too low, because then I´d operate at a loss.
So, what price do I charge?
The problem is when, a week later, you have to pay your employees or buy new supplies, but the price dropped by over 50% like it did recently and you can't pay.
kevsta
RBL CHeck Failed
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and being as its not possible to short it, well not without owning a load of them and selling, you cant even hope for a short squeeze for your Xmas bonus.
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
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But that then would only work for things with no over head. If the $70 was based on a price of $50 overhead and $20 wages and profit for you, then instead of $40 in your example you would have lost $30 the first week and made $50 the second.
So it might work for people who are doing odd jobs for cash with no overhead, but for me I need to know that I will make enough to cover rent. And at work we are in a competitive market place we can't not know if we will make or lose money depending on such a volatile market. If I want to risk my money on this rollercoaster why should I endanger my business too?
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
The numbers I ran suggest that "screwed" is probably a bit of an exaggeration. If accepting bitcoins increases the amount of business you do then opening an account at a reliable bitcoin exchange is not only doable but likely to be profitable as well.
Of course, that is a hypothetical scenario. I don't have an up to date list of how many off line businesses accept bitcoins but is still isn't many. Those that do probably wouldn't do much business in bitcoins. The blockchain shows that most people who buy bitcoins do so to hang on to - not to spend them in pizza shops.
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psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
I already ran those numbers for you. Did you not understand them?
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
Yes, I know. Bitcoin is a lousy currency. But if that is the way some people want to do business then a hard headed business man simply conducts a study to see if it is economically viable to do business with them.
The answer will vary from business to business. In my case, it would work out ok as long as I had access to a reliable bitcoin exchange. Walmart would probably find the cost of converting its checkouts to accept bitcoins prohibitively expensive compared to any extra revenue it might generate.
The biggest point that folks are making is that the Bitcoin is simply too volatile to do business with. If the value varies minute to minute, as I have seen, then there is a huge risk in operating on day to day costs. Right now, at 2340, 1 BTC is worth 146.8 USD.
[EDIT] 0003, and BTC has risen to 147.3 USD, then dropped down to 146.0 USD.
[EDIT] 0003, and BTC has risen to 147.3 USD, then dropped down to 146.0 USD.
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psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
What do you think a business is? A steady wage? Almost every aspect of a business is a risk that has to be managed.
Most businesses fail in their first year of operation. More often than not the reason is that the proprietors did not do their homework.
Puppycow
Penultimate Amazing
For some people volatility is a bug. For others it's a feature. There are people who travel all the way to Las Vegas on their own dime just to get a thrill by gambling with their money. Bitcoin lets you do that in the comfort of your own home. Or business as the case may be.
Puppycow
Penultimate Amazing
It looks like you found the answer to your own question. As the eternal optimist says:
- Nothing is as easy as it looks.
- Everything takes longer than you think.
- and If anything can go wrong, it will - at the worst possible moment.
Or the old saying: If something sounds too good to be true, it usually is.
Come to think of it, I can't think of any counterexamples, so the word "usually" might be overly optimistic.
For some people volatility is a bug. For others it's a feature. There are people who travel all the way to Las Vegas on their own dime just to get a thrill by gambling with their money. Bitcoin lets you do that in the comfort of your own home. Or business as the case may be.
From an uninvolved observer's standpoint, it's amusing. 144.2 USD now as of 0423. I, for one, would not be interested, as a businessman, in a currency that has such rapid and wide swings in value. Sure, I'd go to Vegas sometime if I had money to burn, but I'd go in expecting to lose, not gain anything.
I'm well-aware of the risks of a business. I've looked into opening a store before, and I know the work involved (not to mention of my friends recently opened up a gaming store). Calculated risk is one thing, but having to constantly check and update prices because you want to use a volatile mechanism? Sure, if you really really want to. For me, it'd just be one hassle that can easily be dealt with.
Disclaimer, I currently have a steady full-time job, but I own and operate my own film studio in the background.
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
If you're not interested in additional revenue then business is not for you.
Petrol prices in Australia are just as volatile. They can vary by more than 20 cpl in a single day. By your reasoning, a transport industry would not be viable in Australia because businesses would not be sure what their fuel bill would be.
ponderingturtle
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So what is a reasonable surcharge to accept bitcoins say a 50% increase in price?
It is only additional revenue if it covers your expenses. Selling more at a loss is not a viable business model. And no one seems terribly interested in spending bitcoins either.
Look into businesses that have been driven out of business by selling more too cheaply.
The speculation-based volatility of Bitcoin has no effect on its utility-based value, and the utility-based value is what will cause it to grow in acceptance, and that growth in acceptance will disperse the market and thus decrease the volatility over time.
Your complaint is a non-concern.
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