Merged Continuation Part 2: Discussion of the George Zimmerman case

[TheL8Elvis]

Elvis, I asked in the context of Rare Truth's post of the defense claim that the money was all gone. If the diverted funds were not put back into the defense fund then the defense is distorting the truth.

If it's gone, it's gone. I don't understand how you define that as a "distortion of the truth".

In any case, all of the information is broken down here:
http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/pr...s-regarding-the-george-zimmerman-defense-fund

You may recall that MOM had a forensic account testify and account for all the money in the bond hearing.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

If he were using money donated to Paypal for the purposes of his defense for "not his defense", this would be relevant with regard to impeaching his credibility as a witness.

Obviously there are a wide range of uses that would qualify as "for purposes of his defense", so I don't expect this to be a big deal unless he did something moronic like "weekend at biloxi gambling" with it.

Maybe you should check and see what the defense fund site states the money can be used for, before worrying about hypotheticals.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Has O'Mara formally hired the "internet trolls?"

Do you have any more evidence that MOM has some control over what happens on websites out of his control this time than you had last time(none) ?

 

[Dan O.]

Maybe you should check and see what the defense fund site states the money can be used for, before worrying about hypotheticals.

The three bullet proof vests would go under general security. Did he buy a new gun or did the police return the murder weapon already? I guess that would go under security too. There's a fairley hefty tab for securing transportation. That would cover buying a new truck because the old one was too easily recognized. Z was talking about doing that.

I haven't tried adding all the numbers yet. How many of those $9000 transfers were there and what was the balance in the PayPall account afterwards? These are facts that should be known at this point but the details get glossed over and leave questions behind.

 

[johnny karate]

Not all, just some. Actually, I'm not sure if the burden still remains at the "preponderance" level at the jury trial or not. After all, I believe it's still the judges call, if there is indeed an option to make that call at the trial (which those educated on the matter seem to believe there is), so perhaps she'll still base her ruling/judgement, if it comes to that, based on her assessment of whether or not the defense has reached the preponderance burden.

It's my understanding that the prosecution has to disprove GZ's claim of self-defense beyond a reasonable doubt, but I'm not sure if the judge's burden level changes as well.

But the judge would never acquit Zimmerman. Because of politics and riots and Al Sharpton. That's what has been repeatedly asserted.

And if the judge refuses to acquit, that would look pretty bad, right?

If a denial of immunity is too devastating to even risk a hearing, I'm not sure how risking the denial of a motion is much better. Despite Zimmerman's incredibly strong case that I'm sure the prosecution will have nothing with which to refute, I doubt the jurors could resist being swayed by something so compelling as the denial of a motion.

So I'm not really seeing the point of even attempting any kind of immunity hearing or motion at all. There's just no way it could end well for Zimmerman.

 

[Cylinder]

No, it's a Florida Law also. Here's the relevant statute, and a link.

Thanks. Mea culpa.

 

[Cylinder]

MOTION TO DETERMINE CONFIDENTIALITY OF COURT RECORDS IN OPPOSITION TO DEFENDANTS MOTION T0 UNSEAL

Contrary to the contentions made by Defendant’s counsel, the Confrontation Clause is in no way applicable to the circumstances of this case. The wittnesses identified in the
Defendant‘s motion are the parents of Trayvon Martin, the deceased. As has previously been stated, Sybrina Fulton and Tracy Martin did not eincourage or create the circumstances giving rise to the killing of their son Trayvon Martin by George Zirnmerman, nor were they present when George Zimmerman profiled, pursued, and killed their son on February 26, 2012.

The purpose of the Confrontation Clause of the 6th Amendment of the Constitution of the
United States of America is to ensure the defendant has the right to confront witnesses
against him through cross examination. Although bias is a component of cross-examination, Sybrina Fulton and Tracy Martin did not kill or encourage that their son be killed for financial gain.

The rest of it reads like that excerpt - strawmen and non-sequitors.

 

[This is The End]

The three bullet proof vests would go under general security. Did he buy a new gun or did the police return the murder weapon already? I guess that would go under security too. There's a fairley hefty tab for securing transportation. That would cover buying a new truck because the old one was too easily recognized. Z was talking about doing that.

This list was in the evidence several months ago if you are wondering exactly what types of things they have been spending money on while in "hiding":

Judge Lester's cleaning out his Zimmerman file:

Notice of Filing

From that pdf.
<snip>

Some interesting things. At least 5 seperate credit cards with multiple payments on most of them.

Let's just say I would have not spent $25k like this, no matter where I got it.

$177,790

$122,393 Trust Fund Check
 $20,000 Cash
  $5,000 Bond
    $409 Cash from ATM for miscellaneous expenses
    $705 Food
    $520 Clothing
    $120 Dr. Co-Pays
    $600 New cell phones
    $600 Prepaid phone calls from Jail
    $800 Gasoline
    $130 RX Medicines
  $1,525 Rental Cars
     $90 Salon
  $3,961 AMEX
    $500 Hotel
    $800 Jail Commissary
    $200 WiFi Hotspot
    $170 Hotspot service fee
  $1,300 AT&T WiFi Service (24 month contract)
  $2,500 LandLine Installation (2,600 feet)
    $600 12 Months Verizon service
     $60 Strong VPN
    $600 Groceries
    $400 Dog care
    $300 Fedex
    $400 Airfare
    $439 Sam's Club Credit Card
    $167 T-mobile
    $256 Target Credit Card
    $455 Capital One Auto Loan
    $358 Capital One Auto Loan
    $113 Capital One Credit Card
    $950 Rent
     $33 Electric
  $1,500 AMEX
     $50 Brighthouse
    $500 Capital One Auto Loan
    $500 Capital One Auto Loan
    $240 Vehicle Maintenance
    $500 Capital One Credit Card
    $150 City of Sanford Water
    $250 First Premier Credit Card
    $150 Progress Energy
    $500 Sam's Club
    $300 T-mobile
    $200 Target
    $200 Walmart
    $600 Cypress (Renter's Insurance)
    $950 Rent
    $500 Loan re-payment
    $250 Chase Credit Card
  $3,000 Loan re-payment

 

[phonebook]

But the judge would never acquit Zimmerman. Because of politics and riots and Al Sharpton. That's what has been repeatedly asserted.

And if the judge refuses to acquit, that would look pretty bad, right?

If a denial of immunity is too devastating to even risk a hearing, I'm not sure how risking the denial of a motion is much better. Despite Zimmerman's incredibly strong case that I'm sure the prosecution will have nothing with which to refute, I doubt the jurors could resist being swayed by something so compelling as the denial of a motion.

So I'm not really seeing the point of even attempting any kind of immunity hearing or motion at all. There's just no way it could end well for Zimmerman.

I'm not certain if a mid-trial denial of immunity would necessarily be made known to the jury if it was requested and denied in the midst of the jury trial. Since it would still be solely up to the judge decide, this is something that could be considered and decided in private, without the jury's immediate knowledge/awareness (unless immunity was granted). In fact, because of the potential influence a denial of immunity might impose on the jury, like you suggest, I would expect this to be something that was done in the judge's chambers, etc.

 

[johnny karate]

I'm not certain if a mid-trial denial of immunity would necessarily be made known to the jury if it was requested and denied in the midst of the jury trial. Since it would still be solely up to the judge decide, this is something that could be considered and decided in private, without the jury's immediate knowledge/awareness (unless immunity was granted). In fact, because of the potential influence a denial of immunity might impose on the jury, like you suggest, I would expect this to be something that was done in the judge's chambers, etc.

But it would be made public. And the jury could potentially find out.

If the voir dire process is not believed to be sufficient to weed out potentially biased jurors, I'm not sure how those same jurors could be trusted not to allow themselves to be exposed to media reports about the case and render a verdict based on those reports.

By the standards already established in this thread for why an immunity hearing is so dangerous to Zimmerman because of bias and negative publicity, there is no way a motion for immunity would be any safer.

 

[triforcharity]

Thanks. Mea culpa.

No harm no foul sir! You are right about the CBA requiring drug tests though. It's pretty standard policy for most departments from what I understand. Makes sense to me.

 

[This is The End]

This story is almost too pathetic to acknowledge with a post...

A Port Canaveral police sergeant was fired Friday after an internal investigation showed he offered other officers a target resembling Trayvon Martin to use for shooting practice.

The Trayvon target, which features a bull's eye over his heart, a package of Skittles in his pocket and a beverage can in his right hand, is sold online.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...rtin-target-practice-20130413,0,1239247.story

 

[Dancing David]

MOTION TO DETERMINE CONFIDENTIALITY OF COURT RECORDS IN OPPOSITION TO DEFENDANTS MOTION T0 UNSEAL



The rest of it reads like that excerpt - strawmen and non-sequitors.

Is this regards the settlement between TM's parents and the housing association? What would the defense want from there? The housing association most likely also wants it to stay sealed, now I could see the defense making a case that there might be evidence that would exonerate GZ, but that seems unlikely. So what purpose would unsealing it have?

It is SOP for settlements to seal them.

 

[triforcharity]

This story is almost too pathetic to acknowledge with a post...





http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...rtin-target-practice-20130413,0,1239247.story

Poor taste? Most likely, yes. But an offense worth firing someone over? Nah. I'd suspect that he hires a lawyer and get's his job back.

I prefer the bleeding zombie ones myself....

 

[johnny karate]

Is this regards the settlement between TM's parents and the housing association? What would the defense want from there? The housing association most likely also wants it to stay sealed, now I could see the defense making a case that there might be evidence that would exonerate GZ, but that seems unlikely. So what purpose would unsealing it have?

Laughably enough, it's because of this:

Zimmerman's attorneys say it's important because it shows a "potential bias" by Trayvon's parents, who are expected to testify at Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial.

Because nothing proves self-defense like demonstrating that the parents of the victim might be biased against the guy who killed their son. This is obviously the case-cracker.

At this point, I have to wonder if O'Mara has actually looked at any of the evidence. Because according to assertions made in this thread, it quite clearly exonerates his client.

So what's with all these weird desperation moves?

 

[Alt+F4]

This list was in the evidence several months ago if you are wondering exactly what types of things they have been spending money on while in "hiding":

$400 for "dog care"? Was his dog in "hiding" too?

 

[Cylinder]

Is this regards the settlement between TM's parents and the housing association? What would the defense want from there? The housing association most likely also wants it to stay sealed, now I could see the defense making a case that there might be evidence that would exonerate GZ, but that seems unlikely. So what purpose would unsealing it have?

It is SOP for settlements to seal them.

Evidence of financial motive as impeachment. Remember that the Clerk of Court opined that it should be unsealed. Zimmerman is asking for the settlement to either be unsealed or provided as discovery which presumably would be protected.

 

[johnny karate]

Evidence of financial motive as impeachment.

Motive for what?

 

[triforcharity]

Evidence of financial motive as impeachment. Remember that the Clerk of Court opined that it should be unsealed. Zimmerman is asking for the settlement to either be unsealed or provided as discovery which presumably would be protected.

Help me understand what financial interest they would have with seeing (in their opinion) their son's murderer in prison? I'm not following. Unless I am reading and understanding this all wrong.

 

[Unabogie]

Some people here have made the contention that Trayvon's family was "dysfunctional" and I know that the defense is going to try and demonstrate that Trayvon was some sort of "thug" who was quick to anger, so I happened to read a story about George's ex girlfriend and what she said he was like.

But Mr. Zimmerman did show flashes of temper. During an argument with his ex-fiancée, a stylist he met at Supercuts in 2001, he slapped her in the mouth because she was chewing gum.

For chewing gum? He hit someone with no provocation...for CHEWING GUM? What kind of creep treats a woman like that?

Oh, wait, this kind.

The documents also reveal that Mr. Zimmerman had a difficult relationship with his mother. Once, after his ex-fiancée argued with his mother, Mr. Zimmerman turned off his mother’s electricity and left the house.

That's right. He locked the electrical box and left his mother without electricity because he was mad at her.

Just curious. Does turning off your mother's electricity, locking the junction box, and leaving the house constitute healthy behavior?

And finally, just to show he doesn't always target women...

As the two were breaking up, they pushed each other forcefully, and he kicked her dog in the stomach

Yep. He kicked her dog.

But wait, there's this...

Until he was arrested, George Zimmerman had been estranged from most of his family.

You know, just in case we want to compare families, since dysfunctional families is somehow tied to who started things that night.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/13/u...-trayvon-martin-case.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0