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Proof of Life After Death!!

tsig said:
Right after my dad died I had a long dream where he told me he was OK and doing fine, my explanation is that I was asleep and dreaming.
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Fair enough. But let's just pretend that in your dream you asked your Dad to prove to you he really was visiting you. Then let's pretend he said, "Remember the pants. You'll know it was me because of the pants. Remember the pants." You wake up the next morning remembering his message as clear as day, but think the message is ridiculous (unless of course your Dad actually HAD some pants! Sorry Meg, couldn't resist). Anyway, then your Mom tells you she read an article entitled "The Pants" and it was a story about a dying father and the story reminded her of your Dad. It reminded her so much of your Dad that she cried while reading it and saved it especially for you to read.
If that had happened to you, tsig, would it sway you?
 
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When my first child was small, I thought I saw my someone bending over the crib in our bedroom one night. I reached over to the crib and realised the baby wasn't breathing, so grabbed him, started CPR while my husband rang 999. The baby was fine, he's now almost 26. When I described the figure to my husband, he said it sounded like his deceased grandfather, who I had never seen but I have since seen a photo of him.

Sensible explanation: I was befuddled with sleep and misinterpreted shadows in the dimly lit room with the moon shining through the curtains, thinking I saw a person bending over. I woke up because subconsciously I'd stopped hearing the baby breathe (he was very snuffly at that time). The experience of the baby not breathing was traumatic and frightening, and and in the telling and retelling, the shadow-figure became more real in my memory than it was at the actual moment, and coupled with my ex telling me it was his grandfather and then seeing a photo, I have 'made' the shadow-figure into his grandfather in my memory.

Memory is like that, it is plastic and malleable and the more you think about something or tell the story, the more chances there are of later interpretations being incorporated into the story.

An afterlife doesn't attract me; if I could see my children but not interact with them, I'd find it terribly frustrating and upsetting - not being able to comfort them in their grief, not being able to advise them, guide them or help them.

If the afterlife involved being some completely different plane of existence with people who've already died, well, what about the ones I didn't get along with? An eternity of my mother telling me all over again how she never loved or wanted me? No thanks, it was horrible enough first time round.
 
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Robin1 said:
Fair enough. But let's just pretend that in your dream you asked your Dad to prove to you he really was visiting you. Then let's pretend he said, "Remember the pants. You'll know it was me because of the pants. Remember the pants." You wake up the next morning remembering his message as clear as day, but think the message is ridiculous (unless of course your Dad actually HAD some pants! Sorry, couldn't resist). Anyway, then your Mom tells you she read an article entitled "The Pants" and it was a story about a dying father and the story reminded her of your Dad. It reminded her so much of your Dad that she cried while reading it and saved it especially for you to read.
If that had happened to you, tsig, would it sway you?
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I'm not tsig, but no, it wouldn't have swayed me. Because the likelihood is that prior to the dream, subconsciously or otherwise, you were aware of the story (maybe you flicked through the magazine in which it was printed, maybe your mum mentioned it before the dream, maybe someone else mentioned it...) and so the story influenced the dream. Even if that didn't happen, even 7 billion to one coincidences happen to to someone, somewhere, every single day. Coincidences are just that, and they happen all the time. None of that is provable one way or the other, but memory is a funny thing and doesn't always work in the way we expect.
 
Hey kids:

I just leave you a lone for a little while and the thread turns into a circus!

How could I respond to so many posts addressed to me?

Speaking of insults, two "delicate" participants accuse me bluntly of being a fake, and say my claims for being an academic are a hoax. No one popped in to protest against such ranting and insult, maybe because the posts are of "skeptic" origin, and it is necessary to backup the clan, no matter what.

Of course I am an academy director. I am Medialab Director at Galileo University in Guatemala. I graduated as Electronics Engineer, with masters in Systems, automation and Electronics applied to Television and Radio. I also graduated as a second carrer in Systems and Software engineering.

Currently I teach more than 12 weekly hours, mainly to engineering students, imparting the subject un Descriptive Technologies. Because of my training in arts, I am graduated as a classic guitar performer, keyboardist and musical composition I also teach at the same university School of Arts, subjects like Electronics applied to musical creation, Digital Sound Processing and other matters.
The link to my department pages is: Galileo Medialab Laboratory
The link to our university is: Galileo University Guatemala
Direct link to my classes on line: Descriptive Technology - Spanish classes by Mike Aparicio
Part of my careers were obtained at Columbia and other universities. Lately I obtained MDs at Galileo University as well.

So, now.... Those detractors please post your curriculum. Mainly the guy who said "I am doing a job at a children's school". If that would be the case I am sure he would be one of my students...:D

I present my excuses to moderators for being out of topic, but the bad behavior and brat attitude of some participants force me to do it.
 
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Could you give this question your consideration? It does go to the heart of what you were claiming yesterday.

Pixel42 said:
Once again, Mike, you have completely missed my point.

Let me put it this way. Suppose someone followed your advice precisely, and instead of receiving knowledge about life after death received instructions from God to demonstrate God's anger with a certain nation by flying a plane into one of its most important buildings. How would you go about persuading this person that that is not the right thing to do? You have already declared that the knowledge obtained in this manner is bound to be correct. There are no facts, no arguments that you can use to counter it because this person's belief was not obtained by facts or arguments. There is no test in reality for it.
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Robin1 said:
Wow me? Condescending? I'm an idiot. And open always to reevalution. I grew up raised to think "homosexuality" was an abomination. And I believed it. Until, my loving brother told me he was gay. And there is no sweeter, kinder brother, ever. Ever..
It didn't take me too long to see the error of my ways but ,by the grace of God.
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So you've been taught that homosexuality was wrong. Then you discovered it wasn't wrong. What is preventing you from taking that extra step and weighing the evidence that there is no afterlife? After all if the people telling you about homosexuality was wrong, perhaps they were also wrong about the afterlife?
 
TheDoLittle said:
So you've been taught that homosexuality was wrong. Then you discovered it wasn't wrong. What is preventing you from taking that extra step and weighing the evidence that there is no afterlife? After all if the people telling you about homosexuality was wrong, perhaps they were also wrong about the afterlife?
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It is precisely because of all the evidence that I believe in an afterlife.
 
MikeAparicio said:
I just leave you a lone for a little while and the thread turns into a circus!

How could I respond to so many posts addressed to me?

Speaking of insults, two "delicate" participants accuse me bluntly of being a fake, and say my claims for being an academic are a hoax. No one popped in to protest against such ranting and insult, maybe because the posts are of "skeptic" origin, and it is necessary to backup the clan, no matter what.

Of course I am an academy director. I am Medialab Director at Galileo University in Guatemala. I graduated as Electronics Engineer, with masters in Systems, automation and Electronics applied to Television and Radio. I also graduated as a second carrer in Systems and Software engineering.

Currently I teach more than 12 weekly hours, mainly to engineering students, imparting the subject un Descriptive Technologies. Becaseu of my training in arts, I am graduated as a classic guitar performer, keyboardist and musical composition I also teach at the same university School of Arts, subjects like Electronics applied to musical creation, Digital Sund Processing and other matters.
The link to my department pages is: Galileo Medialab Laboratory
The link to our university is: Galileo University Guatemala
Direct link to my classes on line: Descriptive Technology - Spanish classes by Mike Aparicio
Part of my careers were obtained at Columbia and other universities. Lately I obtained MDs at Galileo University as well.

So, now.... Those detractors please post your curriculum. Mainly the guy who said "I am doing a job at a children's school". If that would be the case I am sure he would be one of my students...:D

I present my excuses to moderators for being out of topic, but the bad behavior and brat attitude of some participants force me to do it.
Click to expand...

How much of the knowledge that you teach was the product of personal experience alone? This being the method you say can allow us to reach reliable conclusions about the existence of life after death.
 
Robin1 said:
Fair enough. But let's just pretend that in your dream you asked your Dad to prove to you he really was visiting you. Then let's pretend he said, "Remember the pants. You'll know it was me because of the pants. Remember the pants." You wake up the next morning remembering his message as clear as day, but think the message is ridiculous (unless of course your Dad actually HAD some pants! Sorry Meg, couldn't resist). Anyway, then your Mom tells you she read an article entitled "The Pants" and it was a story about a dying father and the story reminded her of your Dad. It reminded her so much of your Dad that she cried while reading it and saved it especially for you to read.
If that had happened to you, tsig, would it sway you?
Click to expand...

Quite all right. I lol-ed. Glad you're back :)
 
MikeAparicio said:
I just leave you a lone for a little while and the thread turns into a circus!

How could I respond to so many posts addressed to me?

Speaking of insults, two "delicate" participants accuse me bluntly of being a fake, and say my claims for being an academic are a hoax. No one popped in to protest against such ranting and insult, maybe because the posts are of "skeptic" origin, and it is necessary to backup the clan, no matter what.

Of course I am an academy director. I am Medialab Director at Galileo University in Guatemala. I graduated as Electronics Engineer, with masters in Systems, automation and Electronics applied to Television and Radio. I also graduated as a second carrer in Systems and Software engineering.

Currently I teach more than 12 weekly hours, mainly to engineering students, imparting the subject un Descriptive Technologies. Becaseu of my training in arts, I am graduated as a classic guitar performer, keyboardist and musical composition I also teach at the same university School of Arts, subjects like Electronics applied to musical creation, Digital Sund Processing and other matters.
The link to my department pages is: Galileo Medialab Laboratory
The link to our university is: Galileo University Guatemala
Direct link to my classes on line: Descriptive Technology - Spanish classes by Mike Aparicio
Part of my careers were obtained at Columbia and other universities. Lately I obtained MDs at Galileo University as well.

So, now.... Those detractors please post your curriculum. Mainly the guy who said "I am doing a job at a children's school". If that would be the case I am sure he would be one of my students...:D

I present my excuses to moderators for being out of topic, but the bad behavior and brat attitude of some participants force me to do it.
Click to expand...

Nice resume.

Have you any reliable objective evidence for an afterlife?
 
Misunderstanding in skeptic moral.

Pixel42 and other folks misunderstood my opinion on moral aspects of skepticism.

I did not say explicitly "skepticism is immoral" in all aspects.
I sustain the intrusion of skepticism in spiritual, religious and mystical human activities is not only prone to spread immorality but also a detour from the basic skeptic foundation.

Skepticism in scientific and technological work is vital. Those are the fields were skepticism contributes to reach earthly knowledge and understanding. Invasion of personal fields, like idealism, spiritualism, love, belief in things beyond proof, emotion and other internal activities is out of center.

From reading some of the thousands of posts I realize skeptics invariable claim for evidence and proof. It is logical to conclude evidence and proof possibilities are fundamental for skeptic thinking.
In other words: The realms of thought, where proof and evidence cannot be obtained and where the same skeptic thinkers cannot define the nature, characteristics and quality of the proof, are not suitable for skeptic discussion, because it is impossible to reach a state of proof or denial.

This means skeptic thinking applied to criticize beliefs in things beyond proof cause distorted perceptions and logical confusion.

One clear example of such confusion is:

Invariably, skeptics express ideas of God as a "punishing entity, mean, and unjust, which demands of humans a certain attitude or otherwise they will be punished with infernal treatment".

Even worse, skeptics constantly sustain, all societies with a religious foundation behave morally because such "fear of punishment".

This also connects with the topic in this thread: Life after Death.

It is true many religions sustain thoughts like those, mainly radical religions, but such creeds do not have a thing to do with the Reality of a Superior Consciousness and the progression of Consciousness through totally different realms and not only within this earthly realm.

True Christian thinking (I am NOT saying religion), as an example, is NOT based in promoting fear to an angry god or a horny devil. It is based on the spread of Love, Solidarity, Unselfishness, Compassion, Truth, Honesty, Sincerity, Devotion and Dedication.

Truly spiritually advanced persons can accomplish those goals without any spiritual guidance. Skeptics can enjoy those qualities as well, as long as they do not destroy them by intruding into others right-to-use their own beliefs to accomplish the same.

The immorality surges when the internal convictions are systematically attacked and ridiculed and if succeeding, destroying the seed of moral behavior. There it is when publicly spread skeptic notions seriously affect large sectors of the social body.

Skeptics also fail to understand there is no need to profess a religion to understand God, Life after Death and Spiritual values.

We could say, those skeptic thinkers who behave with total morality, exhibiting the attributes mentioned above, are actually understanding God, no matter they have replaced his name for "Inner Conviction" or a "native moral state".

Why then skeptics insist in spreading their points of view, using their slogan of "Freeing people from superstition, slavery and fear of death"?

There is a noticeable lack of Honesty when a person claims having "no fear for death". Fear of dying is innate. It is part of the survival instinct. Skeptics are really pretending to be super-humans, beyond natural instincts.

Skeptics also fail to perceive the obvious Order in the Universe. It is necessary to think, demand and accept total disorder to be able to deny a Superior Mind, because there can be no order without intelligence.

Skeptics cannot envision an ulterior purpose for human consciousness except to "enjoy your little time on earth, before you are totally annihilated".

Like getting on a plane, to fly for 10 hours thinking there is no destiny and the plane will land nowhere. (Which you actually don't know until you get there)

Life After Death, LAD, is the logical consequence of a World, whose primordial object is the creation, evolution towards expansion, and emancipation of Consciousness.

If skeptics "love" to thrive in a meaningless world, where nothing has a reason, where there is no ulterior purpose, where there is no order, and where there is an inevitable end.... Be my guests.

But intruding in others mental state, with the purpose of bringing the person down to such an arid state is immoral.
 
MikeAparicio said:
If skeptics "love" to thrive in a meaningless world, where nothing has a reason, where there is no ulterior purpose, where there is no order, and where there is an inevitable end.... Be my guests.

But intruding in others mental state, with the purpose of bringing the person down to such an arid state is immoral.
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What skeptic where claims anything like the above?

The one you've invented perhaps?
 
Sideroxylon said:
How much of the knowledge that you teach was the product of personal experience alone? This being the method you say can allow us to reach reliable conclusions about the existence of life after death.
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The personal experience in technology and science matters is COMMUNICABLE. I have several times explained why the inner perceptions of the Soul cannot, and if you do, you end up creating a religion and further confusing both skeptics and non skeptics.
 
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