Founder of Sea Shepherd Arrested in Germany

[NoahFence]

I heard Watson stepped down as head of SS, and gave up any paid positions. Anyone know why? It came right after an event with coast guard. From what I understand, someone on shore saw the BB and mistook it's trimaran hull for a yacht that had overturned and called out the coast guard. The CG sent out a helicopter to investigate, but the BB, with Watson on board refused to make radio contact, and instead made a beeline for international waters. I guess Watson thought he they were coming to get him.

Anyone know if this was why he stepped down, or they unrelated?

Probably just legal mumbo-jumbo because he's on the interpol wanted list. If he separates himself from the SSCS, their liability is lessened.

Watson's statement of resignation said he was personally named in the injunction, which was meant to prevent the vocal activists from carrying on with their annual efforts to stall the whale hunting season.

His decision to step down, he said, came from a desire to maintain a clean record.

"I myself have never been convicted of a felony crime," Watson said in the statement. "And for this reason, the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society in the United States and myself as a U.S. citizen must comply with the order by the 9th Circuit court of the United States."

Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/busines...+court+order/7790741/story.html#ixzz2LXlVX4zy

 

[Ryokan]

If this thread has taught me anything it's that modern whaling techniques are bad, but a traditional method of whaling where you stab the whale with spears until it dies of blood loss is a-ok.

Yeah, I was thinking about commenting on that. The image some people seem to have of modern whaling seems to be based on the traditional hunting by natives in Greenland, Canada, Faroe Islands, etc.

The thing is that, according to the IWC, that's the only form of whaling that's actually legal..

 

[WildCat]

For those that don't quite understand why this is such a hot topic for those of us down here, you know those Eagles the US is so proud of, and has made a protected speices? How would you feel if I brided a bunch of US senators so I could come and do some Scientific research by shooting a dozen to two and then turned them into Kentucky Fried Eagle to sell as food, and did it year after year?

You can shoot all the bald eagles you like, just do it outside the USA.

What gives New Zealand the right to police fishing outside of its territory?

 

[WildCat]

Yeah, except that they're in Australian Antarctic Waters and both us and New Zealand have made it abundantly clear that they are not welcome there.

What? Australia claims the waters of the Antarctic?

Last I checked Australia was a good 1,500 miles from Antarctica, well beyond your 12 mile limit. Australia has no "Antarctic waters". You may as well claim the moon while you're at it.

 

[Silly Green Monkey]

No, the moon's mine. They can have Mars.

 

[Marcus]

View attachment 27667

The funny thing is that we are supposed to believe that this ship, which has a freezer capacity of 2,000 tons of processed whale meat, is merely engaged in research. One of the more humorous moments in the early seasons of Whale Wars is when they put out large banners (in English) saying 'Research" or "Research Vessel', something like that. Yeah right.

 

[Manger Douse]

Your homework for today: Research how modern whaling is done.

Do you have any suggestions on where to look with regards to welfare? I'd be interested in seeing how it compares with that of an abattoir. Most of what I find is from animal rights groups but I did find this paper:
Welfare Aspects of the Commercial Slaughter of Whales

From the abstract:

(WRT Grenade Harpoons) Some studies indicate that less than 30 per cent of animals are killed instantaneously, though best practice can achieve 50 per cent of animals killed instantaneously but with wounded animals surviving for up to one hour.

the equipment has evolved little from that originally developed by the Norwegians in the Nineteenth Century. As currently practised few people would consider the current methods employed by the whaling industry to be humane.

This is welfare guild lines from DEFRA in the UK but I'm guessing what I'm after would be in Norwegian:
http://www.defra.gov.uk/food-farm/animals/welfare/slaughter/

 

[Manger Douse]

I should then be able to ram your truck off the road, even before you harpoon the cow. Hopefully you and any other passengers won't be killed but you would deserve it, right?

If a cow killed that way doesn't bother you then I salute your consistency sir.

 

[Wildy]

Yeah, I was thinking about commenting on that. The image some people seem to have of modern whaling seems to be based on the traditional hunting by natives in Greenland, Canada, Faroe Islands, etc.

The thing is that, according to the IWC, that's the only form of whaling that's actually legal..

Well the groups that are permitted to whale for traditional reasons can have some very different methods. Greenland for example is pretty modern while this description of whaling in St Vincent and the Grenadines seems quite cruel (also, it's more illegal than what the Japanese are doing).

What? Australia claims the waters of the Antarctic?

Last I checked Australia was a good 1,500 miles from Antarctica, well beyond your 12 mile limit. Australia has no "Antarctic waters". You may as well claim the moon while you're at it.

It depends on whether you accept the territorial claim that Australia has on Antarctica. If you do than Australia has a pretty big EEZ there because quite a large amount the continent would belong to Australia. But because of the nature of the Antarctic Treaty it's a moot point.

 

[Ryokan]

Manger Douse, this is what the Norwegian Ministry of Fishing says:

(My translation of the relevant bits, you can run it through Google Translate or similar if you want to compare.)

The killing methods have been criticised in the past, and a lot of work has been done to improve them so that the animal dies as fast as possible. Norway has been a model nation in this, and the methods of Norwegian minke whale hunting are on the level with, or better than, those used in other game hunting, both when it comes to how fast death occurs and how many animals are wounded instead of killed. They're also on the level of what is required of domesticated animals in slaughter houses.

Most of the animals lose consciousness or die instantly or very fast. A study from 1999 showed that 72% of the animals died instantly - that is, they stopped moving and started sinking. This is, however, not a very good criteria to determine when death occurs, and research into improving this is still going in. Preliminary results indicate that about 80% of the animals lose consciousness or die instantly. Around 10% survive the first shot and have to be put down by a second shot or a rifle shot. Work is still being done to improve this.

Every year, before the hunting starts, all gunners have to complete a course on shooting, focusing on killing shots. In addition there are mandatory shooting tests both with harpoon and rifle. All ships are monitored electronically during the hunt.

 

[Manger Douse]

Manger Douse, this is what the Norwegian Ministry of Fishing says:

(My translation of the relevant bits, you can run it through Google Translate or similar if you want to compare.)

Thank you.

All other things being equal I think I'd still rather get a quick bolt to the back of the head in an abattoir than rather than an explosive harpoon out on the rolling seas. YMMV

 

[Ryokan]

Thank you.

All other things being equal I think I'd still rather get a quick bolt to the back of the head in an abattoir than rather than an explosive harpoon out on the rolling seas. YMMV

There are other things to consider as well, if all things are to be equal. I'd rather live a free life and then get violently killed, like other game animals, than live inside a pig pen my entire life until I got a quick bolt to the back of the head.

But, as you say, YMMV.

ETA: And if you think all animals die instantly and without pain in a slaughter house, you really have to visit one. I don't recommend it, though....

 

[theprestige]

The funny thing is that we are supposed to believe that this ship, which has a freezer capacity of 2,000 tons of processed whale meat, is merely engaged in research. One of the more humorous moments in the early seasons of Whale Wars is when they put out large banners (in English) saying 'Research" or "Research Vessel', something like that. Yeah right.

What, exactly, do you think the Nisshin Maru is researching?

In fact, it's not a funny thing at all. Research whaling is explicitly permitted by the whaling treaty that Japan has signed. Japan's current whaling activity is in full compliance with that treaty.

Compare that to Norway, which simply left the treaty and resumed full-scale commercial whaling.

So, again, what research do you think Japan is doing? What's Japan's annual research catch? What is Norway's annual commercial catch? Which behavior is actually "worse"--small-scale research whaling permitted by the treaty, or full-scale commercial whaling prohibited by the treaty?

 

[Ryokan]

full-scale commercial whaling prohibited by the treaty?

Prohibited? How can you be bound by a treaty you never signed, written by a commission that has no law making power?

To use the simplest analogy, that's like you and a friend agreeing with each other not to eat pork, and then expect me to abide by that as well.

 

[theprestige]

Prohibited? How can you be bound by a treaty you never signed, written by a commission that has no law making power?

To use the simplest analogy, that's like you and a friend agreeing with each other not to eat pork, and then expect me to abide by that as well.

My apologies. I didn't mean to imply that Norway was violating a treaty they hadn't even signed.

Marcus, which would you prefer? That Norway signed the treaty and abided by its commercial whaling prohibitions? Or that Japan abandoned the treaty and scaled up from treaty-permitted research whaling to treaty-prohibited commercial whaling?

 

[Wildy]

What, exactly, do you think the Nisshin Maru is researching?

The tastiness of whales.

In fact, it's not a funny thing at all. Research whaling is explicitly permitted by the whaling treaty that Japan has signed. Japan's current whaling activity is in full compliance with that treaty.

The research whaling is permitted and there a no rules that say you can't sell the whale meat afterwards.

Compare that to Norway, which simply left the treaty and resumed full-scale commercial whaling.

As far as I'm aware Norway never left the treaty. They have an objection to the treaty that allows them to continue whaling. The Japanese used to have it but were given an ultimatum by the US to give it up or they wouldn't be able to fish in US waters. Incidentally they ended up being locked out of those grounds anyway.

So, again, what research do you think Japan is doing? What's Japan's annual research catch? What is Norway's annual commercial catch? Which behavior is actually "worse"--small-scale research whaling permitted by the treaty, or full-scale commercial whaling prohibited by the treaty?

The Japanese numbers and the Norwegian numbers are about the same at the moment, but Japan has caught more whales in the past.

 

[smartcooky]

Your homework for today: Research how modern whaling is done.

The whale is harpooned and then dragged behind the whaling vessel until its is drowned. The whale dies an extremely painful and very protracted death. It is a cruel, brutal way to kill a defenceless animal.

I know that the "intention" is to kill the whale quickly with the explosive head on the harpoon, but it rarely happens. Most times, the whale drowns.

The Japanese get around the IWC moratorium by claiming that they do it for so called scientific research. The fact that the scientific research started the year after the moratorium was enacted, tells anyone with half a brain that it is not a coincidence. That fact that they then sell the meat for profit seals the deal for me. That is why I contribute to Sea Shepherd.

BTW: Japan has not managed to kill their whale quota for a number of years now, and that is thanks directly to the efforts of Sea Shepherd, whose tactics of confronting the whalers, ramming their boats and generally getting in their way. The tactics have never resulted in a human fatality.

 

[Seismosaurus]

BTW: Japan has not managed to kill their whale quota for a number of years now, and that is thanks directly to the efforts of Sea Shepherd, whose tactics of confronting the whalers, ramming their boats and generally getting in their way.

Not at all true. The quota is a maximum, not a target. There is nothing to suggest that the Clowns of the Sea have stopped them reaching it because there is nothing to suggest that they intend to reach it.

 

[NoahFence]

Not at all true. The quota is a maximum, not a target. There is nothing to suggest that the Clowns of the Sea have stopped them reaching it because there is nothing to suggest that they intend to reach it.

Wow.

You think the SSCS has no affect at all?

 

[theprestige]

The tastiness of whales.

And that is not actually a true statement.