Human colony on Mars in 2023?

[Zygar]

Nevermind, I forgot about the mars landers.

 

[GlennB]

I couldn't be a colonist of Mars myself but I'm excited to see that it may have a human population before I die.

Don't be. It won't have.

 

[StankApe]

Do you really want that **** to get the honor of going down as the first human in history to set foot on an extraterrestrial planet?

As far as the timetable, keep in mind that the US got a man in space mere weeks after Sputnik made us realize there was more to life than fancy cars and rock & roll.

an obvious commie trick!! There really isn't much more to life than fast cars and rock & roll dammit!!!

 

[Puppycow]

As far as the timetable, keep in mind that the US got a man in space mere weeks after Sputnik made us realize there was more to life than fancy cars and rock & roll.

Mere weeks?

Sputnik was launched on 4 October 1957.

The first man in space was actually Yuri Gagarin, on 12 April 1961 (also the first man to orbit the earth).

The first American in space was Alan Shepard on May 5, 1961, but did not orbit the earth.

 

[Anerystos]

Can I suggest that people read Mary Roach: “Packing for Mars”? ISBN 978-1-85168-902-6. Amongst other things she discusses what happens when you throw up in a space helmet, although divers in helmets (rather than with scubas) might well have an answer to this – and not a pretty one I suspect. At least they can be hauled up, long process though it might be. Unless they drown in it.

How are you going to carry all the food they would need? And what do you do about what comes out of the other end? Arriving at Mars surrounded by that would be an entertaining (?) experience.

And if you have mixed sex crews? What happens when Ms A has had enough of banging Mr B and decides that she prefers Mr C who she was banging before it all started anyway? Or maybe it was Ms D? Or Mr C gets a crush on Mr B? What do Ms A and Ms D do then? Or Ms A and Ms D both get the hots for Mr B? And what happens if you have a single sex crew? The mind starts boggling.

Moreover, assuming it’s not a suicide mission, how do they get back? “Wanted, Kamikaze pilots … ”

Perhaps there is a reason that we have not been visited by aliens. Traversing inter solar system distances would be difficult enough. Interstellar travel would involve building a small planet. And maybe a nice nuclear sun for it to orbit to provide the power.

FTL anybody?

I really don’t think the idea of BEMs in UFOs has much to recommend it, von Däniken et al not withstanding. For a start, they’d need a sodding great big mother ship, and we ain’t seen one yet. Have they invented invisibility screens? Or transparency screens.


Or even reduce themselves to protozoa size and … etc. As above, can you imagine a Paramecium getting the hots over a Euglena.

“She’s got such a lovely flagellum. Oh, I do like being whipped. She’s got divine chloroplasts as well.”

“Don’t be stupid, she’s not your type.” The mind starts boggling again.


Hey, I’ve got a new religion here! First book out a week next Wednesday. (I’m tied up until Monday, so I won’t have time until after that to write it and it will take a couple of days.) Publish on the net. Downloads from … . I can feel the sand on Grand Anse and Levera between my toes already. David Icke, eat your heart out. You’re history. Reptiles, nah. Protozoa are the name of the game.


OK, back at the plot. Think about the problems. 3013, maybe. It’ll take us that long to sort them out. If global warming or nuclear war don’t get us first.

 

[rjh01]

Paul W - It is a one way trip, so they never come back. Growing food may be hard so that they will need to have food with them.

One other problem is that one happens when one of the re-supply ships crash? They would need spare capacity.

 

[Puppycow]

And if you have mixed sex crews? What happens when Ms A has had enough of banging Mr B and decides that she prefers Mr C who she was banging before it all started anyway? Or maybe it was Ms D? Or Mr C gets a crush on Mr B? What do Ms A and Ms D do then? Or Ms A and Ms D both get the hots for Mr B? And what happens if you have a single sex crew? The mind starts boggling.

Have them all be polyamorists. Problem solved.

 

[Wolfman]

How are you going to carry all the food they would need? And what do you do about what comes out of the other end? Arriving at Mars surrounded by that would be an entertaining (?) experience.

Moreover, assuming it’s not a suicide mission, how do they get back? “Wanted, Kamikaze pilots … ”

Gee, nothing like asking questions without actually bothering to read the information...which answers most of those questions.

First, supplies and housing will be sent there and landed before the colonists arrive, and will continue to be sent in a similar manner. With the recent landings of the various Mars rovers, they have the technology to do this with a high degree of accuracy. Modular housing designs will require minimal setup.

And yes, it's a one-way trip...the site is quite clear on that. They will send groups of four colonists every two years, to slowly build up the number of colonists (and replace those who die). A round trip is pretty much impossible to pull off given current technology...although who knows, after 15 or 20 years on Mars, they may reach a point where a return trip would be possible (although it's not being planned at this stage).

 

[GlennB]

And yes, it's a one-way trip...the site is quite clear on that. They will send groups of four colonists every two years, to slowly build up the number of colonists (and replace those who die). A round trip is pretty much impossible to pull off given current technology...although who knows, after 15 or 20 years on Mars, they may reach a point where a return trip would be possible (although it's not being planned at this stage).

I don't think the proposal is that serious, Wolfman. It appears to be nothing more than publicity for a reality TV show.

 

[spin0]

First, supplies and housing will be sent there and landed before the colonists arrive, and will continue to be sent in a similar manner. With the recent landings of the various Mars rovers, they have the technology to do this with a high degree of accuracy. Modular housing designs will require minimal setup.

Umm... about that accuracy: Landing ovals for Spirit and Opportunity were about 80 by 12 km. Curiosity's landing oval was 20 by 7 km. With that degree of accuracy the (completely imaginary) modules would land kilometers apart. But no worries, with MarsOne no modules will be lost and nobody's gonna die on Mars as no-one will be launched there.

 

[Wolfman]

I don't think the proposal is that serious, Wolfman. It appears to be nothing more than publicity for a reality TV show.

Actually, I think it's both.

There are some very serious scientists involved in this, people who are very familiar with the challenges involved. Nor are they alone in this, there are several other private organizations with similar plans to put men on Mars.

I think that if they were to raise all the funds necessary, they would take a shot at this...but with a projected price of $6 billion (and undoubtedly the cost will be significantly higher than that), it seems quite doubtful they'll actually reach their target, with the practical effect that it will end up being nothing than a reality TV show.

While I'd consider the odds to be very high that this will never happen, it is still beneficial if it results into further research into how to colonize another planet. And in this case, the research is being funded privately, rather than by tax dollars, which I'd consider a good thing, too.

 

[mike3]

Actually, I think it's both.

There are some very serious scientists involved in this, people who are very familiar with the challenges involved. Nor are they alone in this, there are several other private organizations with similar plans to put men on Mars.

I think that if they were to raise all the funds necessary, they would take a shot at this...but with a projected price of $6 billion (and undoubtedly the cost will be significantly higher than that), it seems quite doubtful they'll actually reach their target, with the practical effect that it will end up being nothing than a reality TV show.

While I'd consider the odds to be very high that this will never happen, it is still beneficial if it results into further research into how to colonize another planet. And in this case, the research is being funded privately, rather than by tax dollars, which I'd consider a good thing, too.

Hmm. I'm curious, though:

1. what's the problem with taxpayer-funded research?

2. would it be easier to try for a base on the Moon instead?

 

[Wolfman]

Hmm. I'm curious, though:

1. what's the problem with taxpayer-funded research?

2. would it be easier to try for a base on the Moon instead?

1) Taxpayers don't want to pay for it, and it leaves it at the mercy of politicians. NASA has seen its budget increased and decreased numerous times over the years, with major projects stalled or cancelled, due to changes in the political climate. Not to mention that gov't projects tend to cost way too much, with pork barrel projects being the norm.

Private projects have much greater incentive to be both cost-efficient and profitable; and aren't so subject to the vagaries of political winds.

2) The site addresses that question in their FAQ:

After the Earth, Mars is the most habitable planet in our solar system. Its soil contains water and it isn't too cold or too hot. There is enough sunlight to use solar panels and its gravity is 38% that of our Earth's, which is believed by many to be sufficient for the human body to adapt to in a healthy fashion. It has an atmosphere, albeit a thin one, that offers protection from cosmic and the Sun's radiation. An important point is also the day/night rhythm, which is very similar to ours here on Earth: a Mars day is 24 hours, 39 minutes and 35 seconds.

The only other two celestial bodies in orbits near the Earth are our Moon and Venus. There are far fewer vital resources on the Moon, and a Moon day takes, well, a month. It also does not have an atmosphere to form a barrier against radiation. Venus is a veritable purgatory. The average temperature is over 400 degrees, the barometric pressure is that of 900 meters underwater on Earth, and the cherry on top comes in the form of occasional bouts of acid rain. It also has nights that last for 120 days. Humans cannot live on Mars without the help of technology, but compared to Venus it's paradise!

 

[mike3]

1) Taxpayers don't want to pay for it, and it leaves it at the mercy of politicians. NASA has seen its budget increased and decreased numerous times over the years, with major projects stalled or cancelled, due to changes in the political climate. Not to mention that gov't projects tend to cost way too much, with pork barrel projects being the norm.

Private projects have much greater incentive to be both cost-efficient and profitable; and aren't so subject to the vagaries of political winds.

2) The site addresses that question in their FAQ:

Thanks very much. Now I'm wondering, since you said that this particular project will probably "never" happen, even if useful research comes out of it, do you think it'll be a government or a private entity that will be the first to put a human on Mars? Considering that you say that private projects have "much greater incentive to be both cost-efficient and profitable", do you think that the private sector in general stands a good chance of being able to land the first man on Mars, even if this particular attempt won't be it?

 

[rjh01]

Thanks very much. Now I'm wondering, since you said that this particular project will probably "never" happen, even if useful research comes out of it, do you think it'll be a government or a private entity that will be the first to put a human on Mars? Considering that you say that private projects have "much greater incentive to be both cost-efficient and profitable", do you think that the private sector in general stands a good chance of being able to land the first man on Mars, even if this particular attempt won't be it?

The simple answer is another question "Where is the revenue going to be so that private enterprise can make a profit?" If there is something on Mars which enables a profit to be made then private enterprise will do it. Without that then it will either be Government or no-one will land on Mars. I seriously doubt that anyone will land on Mars and return, as least for the next 50 years.

 

[zeggman]

While I'd consider the odds to be very high that this will never happen, it is still beneficial if it results into further research into how to colonize another planet.

I think I can save you some time there, sport.

Step 1: Find one you have a good reason to colonize...

 

[zeggman]

Hmm. I'm curious, though:

2. would it be easier to try for a base on the Moon instead?

Of course it would. In my mind, that's the clincher for calling this a conscious scam with the primary purpose of siphoning money from suckers.

A moon colony has an outside chance of actually happening by 2023. A Mars colony before 2100 is a pipe dream, unless it's a colony of robots.

 

[Wolfman]

do you think that the private sector in general stands a good chance of being able to land the first man on Mars, even if this particular attempt won't be it?

Absolutely...that seems to be the whole direction that things are going. Private organizations are making huge leaps in getting man into space, without all the political interference and meddling. And most of those are consciously making this a truly international effort, involving everyone who's interested, regardless of nationality.

I personally believe that our expansion into space is inevitable (albeit not sure when we'll actually accomplish establish a colony somewhere other than Earth)...and I hope that that accomplishment will be one made in the name of humanity as a whole, rather than as the result of the political ambitions of any one particular country.

The U.S. and China have both stated their goal to land humans on Mars. I hope that one of these private efforts will beat them to the punch.

 

[GlennB]

Absolutely...that seems to be the whole direction that things are going. Private organizations are making huge leaps in getting man into space, without all the political interference and meddling.....

Sort of. Commercial satellite launches work because there's money to be earned. LEA "thrill flights" might work if the price is right.

This Mars project has no payout that I can see.

Meanwhile ... extracting useful amounts of water from the surface at the temperate latitudes that would be chosen for such a project is certainly no gimme, even if it's possible at all. If it isn't, then 4 people at a minimal 2L per day means 1 launch+delivery every 120 days to provide water alone, assuming ~1000kg payloads like the Curiosity Rover. For the very first inhabitants.

Is there extractable water? Do these jokers have a clue about that?

 

[Puppycow]

The simple answer is another question "Where is the revenue going to be so that private enterprise can make a profit?" If there is something on Mars which enables a profit to be made then private enterprise will do it. Without that then it will either be Government or no-one will land on Mars. I seriously doubt that anyone will land on Mars and return, as least for the next 50 years.

People do lots of things that aren't strictly for profit. There's no profit in climbing Mt. Everest but lots of people do it anyway for bragging rights, a place in history or whatever their motivation is. This is something like that. The first team there gets bragging rights and a place in the history books. There's a long history of this sort of thing. The race to be the first explorer to the North Pole and then the South Pole. Mt. Everest, etc. Mars is the next new frontier.