Atheism Plus/Free Thought Blogs (FTB)

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d4m10n said:
I'm not clear on what is sexist (in any sense of the word) about a person joking with another person about sex on stage, when it is abundantly clear that no expectations of actual sex are at play. Please, do enlighten us on this point.
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You may ask some female scientists what it's like to be reduced to their sexuality on a regular base. But then again, you removed precisely the context that matters when you reduced the issue to one between just "a person" and "another person". Your ignorance is wilful.
 
Stout said:
What I find interesting is the lengths that they'll go to to "win", these moral and ethical "superiors" of ours.

That's all part of the safe space thing. If they can't will, then they'll just take their ball and go home. snipped


Thread

There's a word for that......
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Ha, a page or two over, a poster going by the name 'Dawkins' Rottweiler' trolls the insufferable 'Cipher'. 'DR' was banned shortly after this exchange.


Dawkins' Rottweiler wrote:
You *********** idiot - do you think the 'pigs' are out to get you? Better hide under the bed covered in tinfoil...

by Cipher » Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:27 pm
Hey, you ignorant, privilege-blindered ****bag, some people have sensible reasons to fear police brutality.
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To which DR responded:
Hey you paranoid nonsense-spouting tosspot, some people on this board are detached from reality...wanting to disarm the police in a dangerous world is not very sensible.


Cipher: Oh, in what sense am I "paranoid"? This should be *********** fun to hear.


DR: You don't dispute 'nonsense-spouting tosspot' then'? Thanks for your honesty!
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Unfortunately, DR only lasted thirteen posts. :(
 
Verklagekasper said:
You may ask some female scientists what it's like to be reduced to their sexuality on a regular base.
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Perhaps I shall, but that's not what we were talking about just now.

Verklagekasper said:
But then again, you removed precisely the context that matters when you reduced the issue to one between just "a person" and "another person". Your ignorance is willful.
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Ignorance? I was in the room as these events unfolded, unlike yourself.

As to my removal of gendered pronouns, that was quite deliberate. What's sauce for the gander is sauce for the goose.
 
zooterkin said:
Do you think it's appropriate for the setting?
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Judging by the overwhelmingly positive audience response, yes. It was precisely the mix of levity and science they were hoping to experience at that place and time.
 
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d4m10n said:
Judging by the overwhelmingly positive audience response, yes. It was precisely the mix of levity and science they were hoping to experience at that place and time.
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You just don't understand, PZ is evil, Watson is evil and anyone who doesn't agree with that is also evil.
 
d4m10n said:
Judging by the overwhelmingly positive audience response, yes. It was precisely the mix of levity and science they were hoping to experience at that place and time.
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The sexual joking got overwhelmingly positive audience response and was precisely the mix of levity and science they were hoping to experience?
 
d4m10n said:
Taken together with the rest of the presentation, yeah. See for yourself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ch1XFqmGeM
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Thanks. I wasn't as positively overwhelmed as you by the "I gotta call you back for the sex part later" and the "I'd like my partner here to come up and we'll have sex on stage... Simulated sex, ok, sorry to disappoint you". But overall, it's good to know that the secular movement has a place for privileged straight old white men even when they are cracking jokes on stage about shagging a female volunteer.
 
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by Cipher » Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:27 pm
Hey, you ignorant, privilege-blindered ****bag, some people have sensible reasons to fear police brutality.
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I wonder what it must be like to live in a world where the phrase "privilege-blindered" is considered a viable and cutting insult?
 
Quinn said:
I wonder what it must be like to live in a world where the phrase "privilege-blindered" is considered a viable and cutting insult?
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:big: I note they had to throw in "ignorant" and a censored word to make that stick.
 
d4m10n said:
Shouldn't conference supporters and organizers be outraged at both TF's and FtB's attempts at blacklisting fellow skeptics and secularists? I'm sick to death of it myself, having dealt with blow-ups from incompatible speakers.
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Well certainly. TF likes his calls to arms and in this case it was misplaced. I just find it hypocritical that the parties so angered by his call to have supporters contact conference organizers and tell them their thoughts are defending a movement that not only publicly declared its desire to make TF a "pariah", it actively sought to have people fired from their jobs for expressing even mild disagreement.

That's the problem with cheering for a team.

d4m10n said:
You must have missed all the hilariously insightful jokes about how certain feminists aren't sexually attractive.
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I have taken a quick look through the site. I'm not all that interested. What I found was a stark contrast between the slymepit and A-Plus in terms of how readable it was and how welcoming it was. A-Plus is simply awful, it's peevish and unpleasant. Slymepit is just an internet forum. They don't like FtB or A-Plus but apart from that it's fairly unremarkable.
 
The question is wether PZ was invited as a comedian or a scientist. If it was Penn Jillette who had made these comments, it would have been on character, as anyone who listen to his podcast "Sunday School" can attest.

However, for someone like PZ, who condemn people for being misogynist at the drop of a hat, this is a bit rich. The first rule of sexist jokes is "don't do them".

It is clear that the Watson/Myers/etc are more interested in doing the judging then being judge.
 
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WillyWonka said:
However, for someone like PZ, who condemn people for being misogynist at the drop of a hat, this is a bit rich. The first rule of sexist jokes is "don't do them".
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Sexist, eh? Which part of PZ's scientifically-themed comedy routine implied the belief that men and women should be treated in different ways and are best suited to different roles in society?
 
pz is upset.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyng...ulture-really-has-gone-pathological/#comments

42

PZ Myers
3 January 2013 at 11:43 am (UTC -6) Link to this comment
I’m getting a flood of email and tweets telling me to “kiss and make up” with thunderf00t, because this debate is hurting the movement, and is over such trivial, petty problems.

My official response to such diminution of a real problem: **** YOU.

This is a serious, substantive difference of opinion, and I think how we resolve it will shape the direction the atheist movement takes. If we minimize it and accept the Thunderf00t position, we will dribble away and become increasingly irrelevant, serving no one but an increasingly negligible fraction of white male interests. If we stand up for equality, we have a shot at replacing religious ideology in this country with something better.

lxxx
 
tsig said:
You just don't understand, PZ is evil, Watson is evil and anyone who doesn't agree with that is also evil.
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Replace PZ with ERV and Watson with Thunderf00t, and then we can all choose up sides and fling **** at each other. Yay for groupthink!

:crowded:
 
WillyWonka said:
The question is wether PZ was invited as a comedian or a scientist. If it was Penn Jillette who had made these comments, it would have been on character, as anyone who listen to his podcast "Sunday School" can attest.

However, for someone like PZ, who condemn people for being misogynist at the drop of a hat, this is a bit rich. The first rule of sexist jokes is "don't do them".

It is clear that the Watson/Myers/etc are more interested in doing the judging then being judge.
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Why not consider PZ Myers a comedian in general? Here's his "Why there has been an increase of female speakers at TAM" joke:

"Need I point out that the reason gender ratios have been improving is because people like Ophelia and Rebecca Watson and Greta Christina and Jen McCreight have been pointing out the discrimination for years."

Denying that the increase was due to DJ Grothe's programming. Hilarious! Or this one:

"For years, I’ve been saying that the way to make conferences and the movement as a whole less biased towards male concerns is to ask women what matters to them, and to listen and respond, rather than telling the little ladies what they need to hear."
Yet in the same article, as the punch line, he scolds Harriet Hall for expressing what matters to her and tells her what she needs to hear.

He pulled of these and more jokes in just one article: http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2012/12/12/thats-not-a-response-michael-its-a-denial/
 
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Verklagekasper said:
Why not consider PZ Myers a comedian in general? Here's his "Why there has been an increase of female speakers at TAM" joke:

"Need I point out that the reason gender ratios have been improving is because people like Ophelia and Rebecca Watson and Greta Christina and Jen McCreight have been pointing out the discrimination for years."

Denying that the increase was due to DJ Grothe's programming. Hilarious! Or this one:

"For years, I’ve been saying that the way to make conferences and the movement as a whole less biased towards male concerns is to ask women what matters to them, and to listen and respond, rather than telling the little ladies what they need to hear."
Yet in the same article, as the punch line, he scolds Harriet Hall for expressing what matters to her and tells her what she needs to hear.

He pulled of these and more jokes in just one article: http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2012/12/12/thats-not-a-response-michael-its-a-denial/
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A basic error in that article is that PZ thinks that in order to be an atheist/skeptic you have to want to attend (and preferably speak at) conferences for atheists and skeptics. I know that this stuff is a combination of social life and career for PZ, but I would bet my bottom dollar that most people really aren't that interested in doing those things.

Relevant section:
And that’s really the big problem here. There is no reason anywhere to think that women have less capacity for critical thinking, or that they are intrinsically more gullible and therefore more likely to be religious, or that they are less rational and so less suited to careers in science. Shermer is talking about the skeptical movement, a pursuit dedicated to fostering greater critical thinking. Why would you argue that women have less capacity or less to gain from that? Because that’s what they’re doing, pinning the blame for less participation on the women themselves.
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d4m10n said:
Sexist, eh? Which part of PZ's scientifically-themed comedy routine implied the belief that men and women should be treated in different ways and are best suited to different roles in society?
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Well, his interaction with the woman in the video speaks for itself.
 
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