Ed Rob Menard's FOTL Claims

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LordEd said:
This would also presume that he has a desire to post irrefutable evidence of a claim. Considering this is page 215 of a request to do such a thing, I somehow doubt it'll happen even if it was signed.
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Nitpick: He was banned some time ago, so he cannot reply here. True of his time before banning otherwise.
 
Nitpick of nitpick: he could post his evidence anywhere. Information from other forums/facebook/etc. have be re-posted here.
 
remirol said:
Don't know about Canadia but in the US if you represent false legal documents as true you're already committing a crime -- if you successfully get anything out of it, that just aggravates the situation you'll rapidly find yourself in.

US Courts take a dim view of falsification of such things and you can very easily find yourself facing criminal charges. Don't know if any of them can be upgraded to 'felony' or not, but it is a circumstance that I will not voluntarily put myself in. :D

ETA: Also, I do know it's a binary -- either the papers in question are completely in order, and thus valid, or something is not correct and the whole thing is invalid. A "granted but unsigned" order would fall under "invalid" in this circumstance as the signature is required to make it a valid order. Even making the attempt to use an invalid order would put him officially over the line.
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In British Columbia, an order of the court is considered to be in effect from the moment it is pronounced in court (or chambers, in this case). The signed, filed order is simply proof of the terms of the order. So, if Menard did get the Master to pronounce that order, then he would be correct in telling the Community Centre that it was obligated to follow the terms of the order.

HOWEVER, typically an order like that would have terms providing for a time limit to comply, usually within a certain number of days of being provided with a copy of the filed order. There would also usually be terms requiring the party requesting the order to pay the cost of producing the evidence in question, unless the production is coming from another party to the action.

I don't think Menard got the order he was looking for, at least not in the terms he posted on his Facebook. It's not inconceivable that he would get an order for production of something like that from a non-party, but there would be other conditions attached. I suspect one of two things happened: either Master McCallum didn't grant him the order because he didn't serve the non-party or he didn't want to have to pay or something similar, or he overslept and forgot to go to court on the right morning and nothing happened.
 
Jon. said:
In British Columbia, an order of the court is considered to be in effect from the moment it is pronounced in court (or chambers, in this case). The signed, filed order is simply proof of the terms of the order. So, if Menard did get the Master to pronounce that order, then he would be correct in telling the Community Centre that it was obligated to follow the terms of the order.

HOWEVER, typically an order like that would have terms providing for a time limit to comply, usually within a certain number of days of being provided with a copy of the filed order. There would also usually be terms requiring the party requesting the order to pay the cost of producing the evidence in question, unless the production is coming from another party to the action.
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This is good to know. Thanks.
 
One thing that puzzles me is the time given to comply with the order. The hearing was on the 23rd November and the VWCC must produce the info by the 30th November. Seven days is a bit short notice isn't it?
 
Stacey Grove said:
One thing that puzzles me is the time given to comply with the order. The hearing was on the 23rd November and the VWCC must produce the info by the 30th November. Seven days is a bit short notice isn't it?
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Not necessarily, although at this stage of a lawsuit 14 days would be more typical. A party would probably have to show some urgency to get a 7-day time frame, although producing a few e-mails shouldn't take very long in any event. However, it would almost always be x number of days from service of a copy of the entered order, not from the pronouncement of the order, unless the non-party was present before the Master.
 
If Menard's story is true and he did get the emails from the West Vic center then the latter had to make a determination as to whether he was blowing smoke, or not.

How does an organization, like Vic West, verify a call or email from somebody with an questionable unsigned order and a story?

They may have given out information based on a lie. If that’s the case, Bloated Bong Boy is in a world of ****. The courts wouldn’t be happy that he falsified a court order and nobody in the civilized world is going to want do any business with him (including renting a hall). Vic West may want a piece of him, too.

Of course it’s possible that Fez boy never got a signed order and never called Vic West and is just running a fund raising bluff. If this is the case, our boy is still up **** River since he’s gone all over the internet saying he has a valid order.

Then, there is the possibility that Menard did get a valid order on which to act. Considering his zero for life batting average, I am not betting he did.

Logically, it seems to me that all one needs to know is whether the Fezzed One got a valid order or not.

On this last point, once again, Menard has made the mistake of showing his hand to a group that has a much longer attention span than his momma’s basement dwelling freeman minions.
 
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I have only one thing to say to Menard and his minions that may be tuning in.
Nelson.gif
 
They may have given out information based on a lie. If that’s the case, Bloated Bong Boy is in a world of ****. The courts wouldn’t be happy that he falsified a court order and nobody in the civilized world is going to want do any business with him (including renting a hall). Vic West may want a piece of him, too.
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Maybe I will drop them a quick e-mail. :D
 
So I've been thinking about this, and even if Menard got the order and its real it doesn't really say anything. I am assuming the Canadian legal system is like the United States legal system (which can be a dangerous assumption, I know, but..) in that anyone can file a lawsuit for any reason as long as its formatted properly and you pay the fees. I do believe the US legal standard here is that there is an assumption that the filing party is sane (another dangerous assumption when it comes to Menard) and that the statements made justifying initial discovery motions have the possibility of being true.

What Menard has done, if its real, is I believe the US version of a "motion to compel discovery" - which can only be objected to if the documents demanded are irrelevant to the case or is protected by privilege. And since the organization who received the demand probably has no interest in formally objecting (its just an email after all), and it is materially relevant to the case (even though the case is BS and would lose eventually anyways), then I don't know why Menard thinks hes done something so amazing here.

For example, if I wanted to tomorrow I could file a lawsuit against Robert Menard's for slander against JREF and then get a motion to compel for him to produce all documents mentioning the JREF in the past 2 years from his private emails. Assuming that I paid the filing fees, formatted the request properly, and otherwise appeared to not be a total nutcase, I would probably get it. The slander could be completely made up (and it would be thrown out since I wouldnt have standing, again that reality is irrelevant for purposes of the motion), it doesn't matter, the court will assume its true for purposes of discovery as long as it sounds not totally fruitcake-ish.

So...to conclude...even if its real, color me completely unimpressed.
 
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I am assuming the Canadian legal system is like the United States legal system (which can be a dangerous assumption, I know, but..) in that anyone can file a lawsuit for any reason as long as its formatted properly and you pay the fees.
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Pretty much, a quick search of "ludicrous lawsuits" and you can see that anyone can file basically anything.

Restless convict
Robert Lee Brock is reportedly the most legally active inmate in Virginia. "Two Souls Walker," as he is also known, has burdened the legal system over the years with frivolous suits complaining about prison life and its poor conditions. This 1995 endeavor was against himself.

Brock claimed that he violated his own civil rights and religious beliefs by getting drunk enough to commit crimes and getting arrested. He wanted $5 million, but the real kicker was that he was demanding that the monies be paid by the state on his behalf since he doesn't have an income while incarcerated. For the record, all his previous grievances have also been rejected.
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Well then can someone in Canada counter sue Menard for being a vexatious litigation - his suit being for the purpose of barratry?
 
jargon buster said:
Pretty much, a quick search of "ludicrous lawsuits" and you can see that anyone can file basically anything.
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In the US, however, you can be declared a "vexatious litigant", which is when a court declares that you cannot file an action without first seeking the permission of the court.
 
arayder said:
The dope clock is running!

It is day 23 since Fez boy filed his magic papers and I haven’t gotten one scrap of paper from the courts, heard one peep from my internet and email providers, or in any other way been effected.


. . .tick. . .tick. . .tick
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The dope clock is running!

It is day 26 since Fez boy filed his magic papers.

. . .tick. . .tick. . .tick
 
thedopefishlives said:
In the US, however, you can be declared a "vexatious litigant", which is when a court declares that you cannot file an action without first seeking the permission of the court.
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Same here, the different provinces have different rules surrounding being declared a vexatious litigant - but in essence one must be in the habit of abusing court processes, and or defying court orders to get there. Bobby's offering legal tripe, but as he's not in the habit of testing his theories out himself he has not been so declared.
 
I have the documents but when I uploaded them to docstoc, they came out sort of superimposed and illegible, so I will have to try again. (I just wanted to post this so that nobody bothers paying the fees to get them)
 
Border Reiver said:
Same here, the different provinces have different rules surrounding being declared a vexatious litigant - but in essence one must be in the habit of abusing court processes, and or defying court orders to get there. Bobby's offering legal tripe, but as he's not in the habit of testing his theories out himself he has not been so declared.
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Of course, on our side of the 49th parallel, we have Birther queen bee Orly Taitz and she still hasn't been slapped with vex. lit. anywhere, so I'm guessing the courts take an extremely cautious view of doing so.
 
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