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Bigfoot: The Patterson Gimlin Film - Part 3

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In my opinion Munns knows it's a suit. That's why he quickly gave up on his suit analysis and switched to the lens instead.
 
Vortigern99 said:
That's either a testament to Patterson's skill or to the propensity to self-delude.
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It's a little of both, in my opinion... but then again, we could be giving Patterson too much praise in that regard, seeing as how most general Bigfoot believers will buy into even the shoddiest looking hoaxes around.
 
GT/CS said:
In my opinion Munns knows it's a suit. That's why he quickly gave up on his suit analysis and switched to the lens instead.
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I am sure he knows it is a suit, the guy just has way too much into now so there is no turning back unless he just comes right out and admits it's a suit. That don't seem to be happening so like all good footers time to play the game of "Fact's & Dodges".
 
Vortigern99 said:
It's weird to think back to the time, about 3 1/2 years ago, that I was convinced I was looking at something inhuman when I was seeing Patty. This was before I discovered the material folds and before I knew about the muscle-suits that pre-dated Rick Baker's work in the 1970s. I was arrogant enough, I guess, to think that because I had a foundation in undergrad primatology and anthropology, and knew a thing or two about make-up effects to boot, that I couldn't be fooled by such a simplistic fur suit. I thought I was seeing musculature when the suit is either padded in the right places, or it shows something of the human form beneath.

It only took me about a month of posting here, though, to come around. Others have been posting for longer and are still convinced. That's either a testament to Patterson's skill or to the propensity to self-delude.
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Interesting. So did you see the PGF after looking at a bunch of pro-bigfoot stuff first? Develop a belief before analyzing it?
 
AlaskaBushPilot said:
Interesting. So did you see the PGF after looking at a bunch of pro-bigfoot stuff first? Develop a belief before analyzing it?
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Good questions. I saw the footage on In Search of... when I was a kid in the 70s, and on re-runs in the 80s and 90s. I was never convinced, but I had a curiosity about the big fella, a "what if?" that developed into a willingness to believe. And like Jane Goodall, who was one of my early heroes, I have a lifelong affinity for apes that later turned into a romantic hope that bigfoot existed.

Flash forward to the internet age, when suddenly inspecting the PGF over and over again is as easy as clicking a button. I was watching it one day in late 2008 or early 2009, and an excitement overtook me, a certainty that what I was looking at was not human. I still recall that feeling, that uncanny sensation, a kind of tingling mixed with wonder or awe. I rushed over to my friend's house -- he's a paranormal collector -- and borrowed all his bigfoot books. I read them, re-watched the PGF film many times, wrote a little essay which my friend published on his site, started reading the responses to it here and elsewhere on the 'Net, and the rest is history.

ABP, was there ever a time that you believed in BF's existence?
 
Vortigern99 said:
Good questions. I saw the footage on In Search of... when I was a kid in the 70s, and on re-runs in the 80s and 90s. I was never convinced, but I had a curiosity about the big fella, a "what if?" that developed into a willingness to believe. And like Jane Goodall, who was one of my early heroes, I have a lifelong affinity for apes that later turned into a romantic hope that bigfoot existed.

Flash forward to the internet age, when suddenly inspecting the PGF over and over again is as easy as clicking a button. I was watching it one day in late 2008 or early 2009, and an excitement overtook me, a certainty that what I was looking at was not human. I still recall that feeling, that uncanny sensation, a kind of tingling mixed with wonder or awe. I rushed over to my friend's house -- he's a paranormal collector -- and borrowed all his bigfoot books. I read them, re-watched the PGF film many times, wrote a little essay which my friend published on his site, started reading the responses to it here and elsewhere on the 'Net, and the rest is history.
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Interesting. Thanks for sharing. It opens my eyes to what I guess I am closed-minded about.

ABP, was there ever a time that you believed in BF's existence?
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Nope. I grew up in the woods. Every day running around either alone or with my brother, and the first time I heard of bigfoot was my father bringing home the Journal of Skeptical Inquiry article about it.

I didn't give it much thought, even my Dad bringing home that article hardly registered with me. It was the rising popularity that got me interested, for how ludicrous the idea was.

Something that really strikes me is how different it is with this kind of background. I always felt safe in the woods, especially at night. You don't fear the night stalker when you're the night stalker. These proponents are always framing the woods as this spooky, mysterious, unknown thing and bigfoot being so scary. There are so many riveting experiences you can have like kicking up a 2,000 lb Kodiak bear out of his bed and seeing that massive thing just feet away from you, locking eyes for a moment, and watching him mull over what he's going to do. Watching him think. Or sometimes they put on the big show of hissing loud. Hahahhaha like a little one that's really scared. You have to keep from laughing. Or the times I've had to shoot them.

The closest I've come to getting killed by an animal though was an enraged moose trying to stomp me when I was unarmed less than a hundred yards from the cabin. My dog saved my life for sure then, three times in rapid succession drawing the moose off me so I could escape. I've never been afraid. I had three charging bears on my tail once, thinking "you can't buy entertainment like this - I hope I live through it". They really just about got me. They did take my deer.

Even as a boy there was an adventure every day with real stuff so I didn't ever develop a romantic hope of an unknown thing. Even bunny rabbits, minnows, frogs, and crawdads were exciting things. Bigfoot never once struck me as even remotely interesting.

But I did see things like giant anacondas, alligators, jungle tigers and the like on different shows as a boy so when I grew up I organized my own expeditions to hunt them. And I have very clear pictures of the ones I shot or captured, unlike bigfoot "hunters" that pride themselves on 20 years of never finding them. So it is hard to hide my contempt for it all.
 
AlaskaBushPilot said:
Interesting. Thanks for sharing. It opens my eyes to what I guess I am closed-minded about.



Nope. I grew up in the woods. Every day running around either alone or with my brother, and the first time I heard of bigfoot was my father bringing home the Journal of Skeptical Inquiry article about it.

I didn't give it much thought, even my Dad bringing home that article hardly registered with me. It was the rising popularity that got me interested, for how ludicrous the idea was.

Something that really strikes me is how different it is with this kind of background. I always felt safe in the woods, especially at night. You don't fear the night stalker when you're the night stalker. These proponents are always framing the woods as this spooky, mysterious, unknown thing and bigfoot being so scary. There are so many riveting experiences you can have like kicking up a 2,000 lb Kodiak bear out of his bed and seeing that massive thing just feet away from you, locking eyes for a moment, and watching him mull over what he's going to do. Watching him think. Or sometimes they put on the big show of hissing loud. Hahahhaha like a little one that's really scared. You have to keep from laughing. Or the times I've had to shoot them.

The closest I've come to getting killed by an animal though was an enraged moose trying to stomp me when I was unarmed less than a hundred yards from the cabin. My dog saved my life for sure then, three times in rapid succession drawing the moose off me so I could escape. I've never been afraid. I had three charging bears on my tail once, thinking "you can't buy entertainment like this - I hope I live through it". They really just about got me. They did take my deer.

Even as a boy there was an adventure every day with real stuff so I didn't ever develop a romantic hope of an unknown thing. Even bunny rabbits, minnows, frogs, and crawdads were exciting things. Bigfoot never once struck me as even remotely interesting.

But I did see things like giant anacondas, alligators, jungle tigers and the like on different shows as a boy so when I grew up I organized my own expeditions to hunt them. And I have very clear pictures of the ones I shot or captured, unlike bigfoot "hunters" that pride themselves on 20 years of never finding them. So it is hard to hide my contempt for it all.
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I would like to live like that before I die.
http://hark.com/clips/rrlvsjvpvg-you-are-a-madman
 
I'll never forget the time I was camping with my son, and we heard a strange sound outside the tent. He said "What is that" with his eyes wide. I replied "Sounds like an Alligator". he didn't believe me, so he stuck his head outside the tent to look, just in time to see it sliding down the bank into the river. He never doubted me again. Never stuck his head outside the tent after hearing a strange sound either. Hahaha

I've never seen a Bigfoot in the woods though.
 
Something very interesting. During the "Look me in my eyes" part. Bob G says "There was two people down there" Not, "there we're JUST two people down there" This speaks volumes.

I also like the "good honest country boy" part. I know some "good honest country boys" that will rob you blind while smiling to your face, and looking you right in the eye. It's been going on for forever, and they bank on people perceiving them as "salt of the earth country boys".
 
Deacondark said:
Something very interesting. During the "Look me in my eyes" part. Bob G says "There was two people down there" Not, "there we're JUST two people down there" This speaks volumes.

I also like the "good honest country boy" part. I know some "good honest country boys" that will rob you blind while smiling to your face, and looking you right in the eye. It's been going on for forever, and they bank on people perceiving them as "salt of the earth country boys".
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One bit that gets me, one of many, is the part where the fella mentions that Bob H talked about it being hunting season, and the first thing Gimlin chooses to reply with is "Oh yeah, it was hunting season alright."

Gimlin doesn't seem to bat an eyelid when Bob H's name is even mentioned, i'm reading too much into it all, haha, but it's just an odd reaction imo, seeing as how Bob H is supposed to be a big liar, Gimlin merely states that there were two men there, he doesn't attempt to claim that Bob H is a liar at any point...
 
Gilbert Syndrome said:
I just find it odd how Gimlin doesn't challenge the Bob H version of events, other than to say there were only two men there.
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But he doesn't do that. He never says "only" two men. He just says "there were two men out there" I'm in a building with well over 100 people right now, and i can, without lying at all, say there are "two men here" because there are. But it's not the whole truth.
 
Deacondark said:
But he doesn't do that. He never says "only" two men. He just says "there were two men out there" I'm in a building with well over 100 people right now, and i can, without lying at all, say there are "two men here" because there are. But it's not the whole truth.
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Yeah, he doesn't say it, that was just me putting that in there in my own words. It just strikes me as odd that that's the only part he seems to want to challenge whilst on the subject of Bob H.

I mean, if anything, he could have just said "Bob is a liar..." That'd be effective in stamping out the possible 3 person situation.
 
Another thing that gets me is how in every single video I've seen of Gimlin speaking to an audience about his version of events, he begins with a bit of background story, about Roger showing him a cast for the first time, and how he lent the Sanderson book from Roger to read, generally how he had began to join Roger on his quests occasionally...

He always starts with this background story, then goes into the Mount St. Helens story, then straight to the PGF encounter itself, at no point whatsoever does he mention donning a wig for a Patterson Bigfoot film... I mean, you'd think he'd throw that in there before getting to the PGF..

"Oh well, y'know, we started to make Rogers film," etc.

Is this now erased from his memory? What's the deal?
 
In this particular video, Gimlin mentions how he stepped off his horse to cover Roger during the "look-back" scene. I hadn't known he'd stepped off the horse at all during the encounter, but I haven't read every single account.

He mentions having his gun, but not feeling the need to shoot. There's no mention of a no-shoot policy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qdN9ho6hjI
 
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