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Pre-op Transwoman Using Women's Locker Room; Parents of Schoolgirls Object

Mercurial Artism

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http://www.komonews.com/news/local/...al-transgender-college-student-177055311.html

OLYMPIA, Wash. -- A controversial decision by Evergreen State College officials to let a transgender student to use the women's locker room has brought up issues of civil rights, state laws and how best to protect children.

At the center of the issue is a 45-year-old student who was born a man but identifies as a woman. The student uses the women's locker room at the college's indoor pool. Angry parents contacted the police after a young girl saw the transgender student naked inside the locker room.

As a compromise, the college put up "privacy curtains" and allowed the transgender student to continue using the women's facilities.

...
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Apparently they have girls ages 6-18 using the college's facilities. In general, I support trans people being recognized as the gender they're transitioning to, but I have serious reservations about the enforcement of gender identity laws in this particular type of situation. There is no way to tell whether someone you don't know personally is truly trans or just a straight man dressing up and pretending he's trans to use the women's locker room (unless they'd had surgery). If a trans person hasn't had genital surgery, you just have to go on their word that they're telling the truth that their gender identity is female. Trans women would tell the truth and say yes; perverts would lie and say yes.
 
Wow. A bunch of girls saw a naked guy.

I'm sure they're traumatized for life, now.
 
DragonLady said:
It's a college. Why were all those little girls there????
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Local elementary and high schools will often use nearby college facilities to teach swimming classes.

EDIT: I remember doing it very vividly as a child in elementary school because I had, and still have, man-boobs and was embarrassed to have to take my shirt off in front of the other children.
 
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Angry parents contacted the police after a young girl saw the transgender student naked inside the locker room.
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Usually when a grown man willfully exposes himself to little girls, there is an arrest, sentence, and said grown man is placed on a sex offender registry so everyone can be aware of his predilections.

Apparently being transgender means you're above the law. How nice. Maybe tomorrow I'll go down to the gym at the local universities and wander around the women's locker room. "No, don't mind me and my wang, I'm female where it counts: on the inside. Pass the shampoo?"
 
Usually when a grown man willfully exposes himself to little girls, there is an arrest, sentence, and said grown man is placed on a sex offender registry so everyone can be aware of his predilections.
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In general, I agree. But a college locker room is a place where all kinds of adult people are often walking around in various stages of undress. So, to me, the question is why the girls were in there?

Sharing the swimming pool and such is fine; but why a locker room?

Unless times have changed a lot, college girls brought college guys...by the droves. So the fact there was a naked guy in the women's locker room -transgender or not- is no reason (to me) for surprise. In fact, I'm more shocked there was only one.
 
Eh... Flame suit on.

Call me crazy... But I reckon that boys are boys and girls are girls and the difference between the two is not limited to genitals. I have been absolutely hounded on this forum for admitting that gender exists.

I can understand why a person would be physically one gender and 'feel' that they are another, that alone shows that gender is more than sexual organs.

But if you got the boy parts you go to the boys locker room. I don't see why this is a violation of his civil rights. If I, a boy inside and out, were to use the girls locker room I would be (and should be) prosecuted. But if I am a pre-op transgender it is suddenly OK? I don't get that. I think the girls were not out of line to say that they were made to feel uncomfortable.

Come on man, just use the boys locker room.

tyr_13 said:
<snip>

EDIT: I remember doing it very vividly as a child in elementary school because I had, and still have, man-boobs and was embarrassed to have to take my shirt off in front of the other children.
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They are not man boobs. They are pecs.
 
But if you got the boy parts you go to the boys locker room. I don't see why this is a violation of his civil rights. If I, a boy inside and out, were to use the girls locker room I would be (and should be) prosecuted. But if I am a pre-op transgender it is suddenly OK? I don't get that. I think the girls were not out of line to say that they were made to feel uncomfortable.
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I do agree with that. He should use the men's locker room. But...I still say if you send your young daughter into a college locker room where you can reasonably expect to find naked adult women, whatever their virgin eyes get filled with is...YOUR problem.

Of course, someone suggested he willfully exposed himself, and that does put a different complexion on it. But he was just stepping out of the showers or changing in an area designated for it, I have no idea why he should be expected to know the room was suddenly going to fill with children.
 
Newtons Bit said:
What was a guy doing in the women's locker room? And naked, too? Isn't that illegal?!?
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DragonLady was mistaken. It wasn't a guy. It was a girl who happened to have a penis and testicles.

Get with the times, dude!
 
Just an FYI on this, the transgender women I know think this person should be bounced out of the locker room.
 
truethat said:
Just an FYI on this, the transgender women I know think this person should be bounced out of the locker room.
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I think he should be prosecuted.

Maybe some time in a jail cell will motivate him to pull his head out of his ass.
 
DragonLady said:
I do agree with that. He should use the men's locker room. But...I still say if you send your young daughter into a college locker room where you can reasonably expect to find naked adult women, whatever their virgin eyes get filled with is...YOUR problem.
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I imagine grown naked men are not a sight that parents can reasonably be expected to foresee their children encountering in the womens' locker room.
 
foxholeatheist said:
Eh... Flame suit on.

Call me crazy... But I reckon that boys are boys and girls are girls and the difference between the two is not limited to genitals. I have been absolutely hounded on this forum for admitting that gender exists.

I can understand why a person would be physically one gender and 'feel' that they are another, that alone shows that gender is more than sexual organs.

But if you got the boy parts you go to the boys locker room. I don't see why this is a violation of his civil rights. If I, a boy inside and out, were to use the girls locker room I would be (and should be) prosecuted. But if I am a pre-op transgender it is suddenly OK? I don't get that. I think the girls were not out of line to say that they were made to feel uncomfortable.

Come on man, just use the boys locker room.



They are not man boobs. They are pecs.
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In order to get qualification for Genital Reassignment Surgery, most transexuals NEED to live as their 'target' gender for a year or so (in most jurisdictions). M2F transexuals HAVE to use the girl's locker room, despite them still having boy parts.

I don't know whether or not making others feeling comfortable is a valid excuse at all. I felt uncomfortable to undress numerous times in my life because of the presence of a creepy person, but was required to do so anyway.
 
The person had two options: Use the boys room or girls room. He, physically at least, was a boy.

Using the boys room would have been a none event. Using the girls room exposed him to young girls.

I have never heard of that requirement. What does it mean to live as your target gender? Alternate how you pee? I think common sense should play a role here and this person did not use it.
 
foxholeatheist said:
But if you got the boy parts you go to the boys locker room. I don't see why this is a violation of his civil rights. If I, a boy inside and out, were to use the girls locker room I would be (and should be) prosecuted. But if I am a pre-op transgender it is suddenly OK? I don't get that. I think the girls were not out of line to say that they were made to feel uncomfortable.
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I know I'm not supposed to bring up homosexuality in a transgender thread. So just to be clear I'm not equating anything here. Different things entirely. Etc.

Anyway this* is very close to an argument I had months ago with, of course, a republican/christian/anti-Obama person.

They claimed they were against gays in the military, the ending of DADT, solely because the armed forces were now going to have to have 4 barracks at every base instead of two. The old ones: one for men, one for women. And 2 new ones: one for lesbians, one for gays.

rolleyes.gif



*"this" being the topic of this thread, not foxholeatheist's post, obviously. That is just the post that made me remember it.
 
mikedenk said:
Usually when a grown man willfully exposes himself to little girls, there is an arrest, sentence, and said grown man is placed on a sex offender registry so everyone can be aware of his predilections.

Apparently being transgender means you're above the law. How nice. Maybe tomorrow I'll go down to the gym at the local universities and wander around the women's locker room. "No, don't mind me and my wang, I'm female where it counts: on the inside. Pass the shampoo?"
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The think is it all depends on the situation. You don't see nudist camps being raided for that. There is a difference between exposing yourself for sexual reasons and because you are changing.

why not charge the men some of them their own fathers exposing themselves to boys in the mens locker room?
 
Why is it assumed this person is "pre-op"? I saw nothing in the OP link that indicated this. Many trans people are no-op.
 
foxholeatheist said:
Eh... Flame suit on.

Call me crazy... But I reckon that boys are boys and girls are girls and the difference between the two is not limited to genitals. I have been absolutely hounded on this forum for admitting that gender exists.

I can understand why a person would be physically one gender and 'feel' that they are another, that alone shows that gender is more than sexual organs.

But if you got the boy parts you go to the boys locker room. I don't see why this is a violation of his civil rights. If I, a boy inside and out, were to use the girls locker room I would be (and should be) prosecuted. But if I am a pre-op transgender it is suddenly OK? I don't get that. I think the girls were not out of line to say that they were made to feel uncomfortable.

Come on man, just use the boys locker room..
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Unless you're gay if course.
 
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