The crucifixion of Jesus Christ

[Akhenaten]

@pakeha, #527

What evidence can I present?

Since your arbitrarily assigned dates are no more important than knowing the first day of the Quidditch season and infinitely less important than fixing the date for the Easter Bunny's birthday, how about providing some evidence that any of the events surrounding this alleged crucifixion in the gospels ever took place at all.

I'd also like to see some evidence supporting your claim of an ushabti Pontius Pilate.

I honestly say to you that the spirit of Ama just said that Jesus was crucified and died on August 17, a summer date, a date outside Spring.

And I honestly say to you that your pet spook is a delusion and that is why it has no ability whatsoever either to predict the future, as in the case of the Olympic Games (plural) fiasco, or to shed light on past events, as in the case of the Saga of the Ocean-Going Nails™.

I heard this in 1983. From there, in my study from 1999 to 2003, I found that the Holy Bible confirms that August 17 is true and correct.

This would seem to provide an answer for your original bleat in this post about not having evidence to present. Instead of listing the books that you studied during these four years you should be able to cite the exact information on which your calculations were based. Instead of simply asserting that your fairytale confirms this, you should be able to cite the exact chapters and verses wherein lies this confirmation.

In other words, you need to show your working.

The year? 1 BC. I will enumerate next time the notable findings that I found in my study.

No you won't. You'll reiterate for the umpteenth time that some silly old witch in the Philippines mumbled something about it thirty years ago and that the Passionfruit Mahjong confirms it.

This is what Ama said if I remember right: He will tell us the truth.

What a surprise.

Mind you, at this stage I'm inclined to think that even if you thought it had said "Everything I tell you is a lie" you'd still believe it.

If we do not want to believe Him, He will still try.

"He" doesn't have much effort to put in. You're falling over yourself to believe whatever demented nonsense KaPow tells you.

If after trying and we still do not believe, then He and us will call it quits.

No you won't. You can't.

 

[Recovering Agnostic]

I'll just leave this here.

The Lord said to me: “What they say is good. I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him. I myself will call to account anyone who does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name. But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death.”

You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the Lord?” If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the Lord does not take place or come true, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously, so do not be alarmed.

Deuteronomy 18:17-22

Maybe this is one of those deliberate errors in the Bible.

 

[Blue Mountain]

What I find interesting about the whole Ka Apaz thing is she was making proclamations thirty years ago about things that were half a world away. At that time it would be very difficult for the people listening to her to confirm or deny anything she said.

Now we're into to the 2010s. We have the internet and the ability to communicate almost instantly with people who live half a world away, and they are now able to confirm or (in most cases) deny what the old lady said.

 

[Agatha]

PeaceCrusader, what people are asking for is the evidence you used to confirm these (ridiculous) dates that Ka Apaz gave for the birth and death of your fanboi. At the moment, all the evidence you have presented amounts to:

1) Ka Apaz in the guise of Ama said so
2) The Bible - the inerrant word of God to believers like you - is mistaken
3) Ka Apaz in the guise of Ama said so.

None of these things is evidence for the accuracy of those dates. Evidence would be things like books (give us title, author and page number) showing that the Jews used two different calendars, or a scholarly article (give us title, author and journal in which published) showing that Passover moved through the year in Biblical times, in direct contravention of Leviticus.

Do you have any of that sort of evidence? Or anything at all that doesn't rely on the ramblings of an old woman pretending to be a holy spirit but who has not made a successful prophecy yet?

 

[PeaceCrusader]

Paciencia?
The seances were conducted in Spanish?
You only proof the Passover has ever been held outside of Spring is something you remember having head a medium say?

PC, that is not rational in the least.
Even so, please give me the correct name of the person you want looked for in Spain- place of birth, wher they lived and I'll be happy to see what I can find.


You have nothing to show this is the case, PC, except your memories of what what as wsaid in a seance over thirty years ago.

Once you understood the medium was giving you false information, why did you bother to make calculations to make Passover fall in August?

@pakeha, #539

No, pakeha, the sessions are conducted in Filipino and never in Spanish. The word in Filipino that He used is “pasensiya” which was borrowed from the Spanish word “paciencia”.

You still do not get it. Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two different entities. Ama just uses the physical body of Ka Apaz to talk to people. You may go to the Philippines and observe the exit and entry of spirits if you wish.

Thank you for volunteering to look for Rosalina Miraflor, the Spanish woman whose spirit was transferred to Ka Apaz in 1938 when fertilization of the egg occurred. All I remember is that the Spanish woman was 18 years old when she died. The spirit rested for about fifteen years before being transferred to Ka Apaz. I do not where in Spain she lived or where she was born.

I did not make Passover to fall in August. Ama revealed the August 17 crucifixion date which I first heard in 1983 when I first went to the Session Hall in 1983. Based on the Aristean Cycle that I developed during the study, Passover was on August 1, 1 BC

 

[pakeha]

...Evidence would be things like books (give us title, author and page number) showing that the Jews used two different calendars, or a scholarly article (give us title, author and journal in which published) showing that Passover moved through the year in Biblical times, in direct contravention of Leviticus.

Do you have any of that sort of evidence? Or anything at all that doesn't rely on the ramblings of an old woman pretending to be a holy spirit but who has not made a successful prophecy yet?

Yes, I am actually interested in knowing why you think the Passover was ever celebrated outside of Springtime.

...
You still do not get it. Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two different entities. Ama just uses the physical body of Ka Apaz to talk to people. You may go to the Philippines and observe the exit and entry of spirits if you wish.

Thank you for volunteering to look for Rosalina Miraflor, the Spanish woman whose spirit was transferred to Ka Apaz in 1938 when fertilization of the egg occurred. All I remember is that the Spanish woman was 18 years old when she died. The spirit rested for about fifteen years before being transferred to Ka Apaz. I do not where in Spain she lived or where she was born. ...

Yes, I do get it, PC.
You are under the thrall of a medium.

PC, I need dates to do a search. And places. "Spain" and "18 years old when she died" aren't enough.
I'll see what I come up with the surname Miraflor and get back to you here.

 

[Akhenaten]

@pakeha, #539

No, pakeha, the sessions are conducted in Filipino and never in Spanish.

From what I've seen/heard of them, they're conducted in grunts and gibberish.

The word in Filipino that He used is “pasensiya” which was borrowed from the Spanish word “paciencia”.

'Nonsensiya' would have been more appropriate.

You still do not get it. Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two different entities. Ama just uses the physical body of Ka Apaz to talk to people.

People who believe in spooks and possession do not get to tell other people that they "do not get it".

You may go to the Philippines and observe the exit and entry of spirits if you wish.

On the strength of this thread you wouldn't get me within Cooee of the Philippines to win a bet.

Thank you for volunteering to look for Rosalina Miraflor, the Spanish woman whose spirit was transferred to Ka Apaz in 1938 when fertilization of the egg occurred.

Whether or not the ever-helpful Pakeha finds evidence of this woman, none will ever be found that she was possessed.

All I remember is that the Spanish woman was 18 years old when she died. The spirit rested for about fifteen years before being transferred to Ka Apaz. I do not where in Spain she lived or where she was born.

You do not remember any of this. It never happened.

I did not make Passover to fall in August. Ama revealed the August 17 crucifixion date which I first heard in 1983 when I first went to the Session Hall in 1983. Based on the Aristean Cycle that I developed during the study, Passover was on August 1, 1 BC

Hmm . . .

The year? 1 BC. I will enumerate next time the notable findings that I found in my study.

No you won't. You'll reiterate for the umpteenth time that some silly old witch in the Philippines mumbled something about it thirty years ago and that the Passionfruit Mahjong confirms it.

What a surprise.

 

[Pixel42]

You still do not get it. Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two different entities.

You are the one who still does not get it. Everyone else got it even before her prophecies utterly failed, and the fact that you are still don't get it despite that failure beggars belief.

Let me spell it out for you yet again: the spirit of Ama does not exist. Ka Apaz is simply pretending to be entered by a spirit, in a performance that any reasonably competent amateur actor could easily duplicate.

Got it now?

 

[Astreja]

People who believe in spooks and possession do not get to tell other people that they "do not get it".

^ ^ ^ This.

It's a pity that there are no severe, immediate real-world consequences for breaking promises and telling the same ridiculous stories over and over again on an Internet forum.

Akhenaten, could you please pick up the Red Phone and let Ma'at know that we have an Impaired Truthiness Situation in progress? (Mind you, if we put this thread on one side of Her scales and dropped Her sacred feather on the other, we'd probably catapult the whole thing into space...)

 

[Akhenaten]

^ ^ ^ This.

It's a pity that there are no severe, immediate real-world consequences for breaking promises and telling the same ridiculous stories over and over again on an Internet forum.

Akhenaten, could you please pick up the Red Phone and let Ma'at know that we have an Impaired Truthiness Situation in progress? (Mind you, if we put this thread on one side of Her scales and dropped Her sacred feather on the other, we'd probably catapult the whole thing into space...)

Not to worry, Goddess. Sobek is standing by to gobble it up and he's a very good catcher.

 

[HansMustermann]

Actually, here's something even more weird about the whole affair. Let's look at what the God of the Bible says about people consulting spirits:

Deuteronomy 18:9-12:

9. When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.

10. There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch.

11. Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

12. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.​

Verse 10 pretty much spells all the ways you could possible obtain information from a spirit (a familiar spirit being a spirit serving one person, i.e., the medium). The rest of it not only calls it an abomination unto the LORD, but says that the LORD will smite and destroy whole nations BECAUSE they're practicing such crap, and forbids the LORD's flock from learning or practicing such crap.

If that was not clear the first time around, then comes a briefer point-blank interdiction in Leviticus 19:31:

31. Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards, to be defiled by them: I am the LORD your God.​

Still not clear? Try Leviticus 20:6:

6. And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people.​

Now I must say that I don't actually believe in either God or mediums, but the idea that you'd both believe the Bible is the word of God, yet take your prophecies and information from exactly the people that God in his word in the bible warned you against, is stupidity squared. It's like telling a kid to not trust people giving out candy from the back of a van, only to have him come back and say that a guy giving candy from the back of a van taught him that you didn't really mean that.

IF you believe that God dictated the bible, then exactly that God told you point blank to not have anything to do with such mediums and not trust them. In fact, he called them abominations, and in other places he called for their death. He said he'll be mightily pissed off at you and listen to you no more, if you even ever consult such people. He calls people who sought such mediums and wizards defiled. Those aren't ambiguous words. WTH gives anyone the idea that if God were to issue an Errata, he'd do it exactly through the people he said not to trust?

 

[Astreja]

Not to worry, Goddess. Sobek is standing by to gobble it up and he's a very good catcher.

(Springy G's eyes widen as She sees the pretty crocodile) Kawaii!

(rummages around in meat compartment of Her fridge and comes up with a piece of beef striploin) A little tide-me-over, luv, till the thread reaches apogee and starts coming back down. I suspect it's going to be medium-well from the reentry friction, though.

 

[Akuma Tennou]

Actually, here's something even more weird about the whole affair. Let's look at what the God of the Bible says about people consulting spirits

<snip>

he've already been said that on the WW3 thread. he's very well aware of his own heresies and blasphemies (god lying purposely), just look at how he won't bother to answer you

 

[Stomatopoda]

tl;dr:

If 30 people reply with paragraphs of valid criticisms, NuclearWarCrusader will reply by picking a single line (probably having to do with calendars or dates) out of context, then congratulating the poster on being correct about something they didn't say, and finishing with several paragraphs repeating the illiterate spook's assertions that he's proven logically correct by consulting her other assertions.

He will never respond to valid criticisms because they're bad for the soul and should be discarded, and lapkip instead of laknip or somesuch.

 

[Astreja]

He will never respond to valid criticisms because they're bad for the soul and should be discarded, and lapkip instead of laknip or somesuch.

Dear, sweet Uncle Loki -- If I actually were encumbered by a "soul" like that, I'd be glad to be rid of it. What a horrible, horrible way to live: Spinning around the drain of one's mind, lying and making more and more convoluted excuses for the inexcusable.

 

[gabeygoat]

PC, I need dates to do a search. And places. "Spain" and "18 years old when she died" aren't enough.
I'll see what I come up with the surname Miraflor and get back to you here.

I doubt it will help much, but if the spirit entered Ka Apaz in 1938 after 15 years of rest, then, Miraflor must have died in 1923 at the age of 18 and therefor lived from 1905 to 1938.



I don't know if I should bother to ask again, but PC, Why does the Hloy Spirit (God) tell you evil things? You've admitted that He tells you evil things that you must discard, but WHY does He tell you these things?

 

[Craig B]

I don't know if I should bother to ask again, but PC, Why does the Hloy Spirit (God) tell you evil things? You've admitted that He tells you evil things that you must discard, but WHY does He tell you these things?

When people start experiencing supernatural beings telling them evil things, they often find themselves in institutional care. That happened to someone I know of, who began to hear "voices from Space". Fortunately they fell silent after he had received treatment.

 

[PeaceCrusader]

Yes, I am actually interested in knowing why you think the Passover was ever celebrated outside of Springtime.


Yes, I do get it, PC.
You are under the thrall of a medium.

PC, I need dates to do a search. And places. "Spain" and "18 years old when she died" aren't enough.
I'll see what I come up with the surname Miraflor and get back to you here.

@pakeha, #546

You think that I am a thrall of Ka Apaz? Then say this also to all the peopel who go to see Ka Apaz. You have to go to the Philippines and observe for yourself.

Abraham Lincoln said, “You can fool all the people some of the time, you can fool some of the people all the time, but you can’t fool all the people all the time.”

You know there are some listeners who have been coming to the sessions since the 1970s. Some are already children of the listeners and they still come.

Rosalina Miraflor may have died in 1923 or 1924. If she was 18 years old when she died, she may have been born in 1905 or 1906.

 

[PeaceCrusader]

From what I've seen/heard of them, they're conducted in grunts and gibberish.


'Nonsensiya' would have been more appropriate.


People who believe in spooks and possession do not get to tell other people that they "do not get it".


On the strength of this thread you wouldn't get me within Cooee of the Philippines to win a bet.


Whether or not the ever-helpful Pakeha finds evidence of this woman, none will ever be found that she was possessed.


You do not remember any of this. It never happened.


Hmm . . .

​

What a surprise.

@Akhenaten, #547

Yes, Akhenaten, the spirit of Ama revealed that Jesus Christ was crucified and died on August 17. I found the year to be 1 BC. And it makes sense because the equivalent of this date in the Jewish calendar is Av 30, 3760, the last day in the month of Av. The following day was Elul 1, 3760 and a high day (John 19:31), a sabbath being the New Moon Festival or Rosh Hodesh.

I used the Perpetual Jewish/Civil Calendar Conversion by Alan Corre, and Universal Calendar Converter by Timothy Forsythe.

 

[PeaceCrusader]

You are the one who still does not get it. Everyone else got it even before her prophecies utterly failed, and the fact that you are still don't get it despite that failure beggars belief.

Let me spell it out for you yet again: the spirit of Ama does not exist. Ka Apaz is simply pretending to be entered by a spirit, in a performance that any reasonably competent amateur actor could easily duplicate.

Got it now?

@Pixel42, #548

If I did not experience it, I would have heeded your and many others’ advice not to believe Ka Apaz because she is just faking it. But I have experienced it. Ama and Ka Apaz are really two different entities. You may have to experience it to know whether she is faking it or not. I don’t think Ka Apaz is capable of saying what Ama said – especially the long discourses.

Just the whistling sound in the entry and exit of spirits, why is it that we hear it not at the mouth of Ka Apaz but near the forehead? You may listen to these in the hun (sound) file list in http://aristean.org/audioidx.htm .

Pick out what will be good for your soul and discard what is evil. Be discerning.