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2012 Debates

MattusMaximus said:
Part of me thinks that Virus and those like him/her don't really even read other people's posts that much.
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Spend some time over in the Conspiracy Theories sub-forum and you'll see a similar style of trolling from most of the conspiracy theorists. There's no attempt at an honest conversation; they just try to bludgeon you into submission.
 
The one thing I will give Romney... He does look presidential. I know most of you guys hate the guy, so you only see a smug lying idiot... but I think for people who are only casually interested in politics, Romney looks like a President.

If you were to cast a fake president for a TV show.... you'd cast a guy that looks like Romney. Obama looks pretty presidential as well.
 
DavidJames said:
I think Virus is a good representative of those who live in the Republican echo chamber. They have no interest in interacting with those who disagree. They are right, because everywhere they "live" everyone agrees.
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Isn't this whole USA politics forum a democratic echo chamber? Not the way Free Republic is a right wing echo chamber.... but still.
 
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Virus said:
That's funny considering the forum is overwhelmingly dominated by the left.

Point a finger and there's three pointing back at you.
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Most people on this forum will engage and debate. I was a very active conservative on this forum for nearly a decade. I always engaged in debate and I honestly don't believe I ever complained that it was dominated by the left.
 
Caper said:
Isn't this whole USA politics forum a democratic echo chamber? Not the way Free Republic is a right wing echo chamber.... but still.
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From 2001 until 2009 I came here religously and defended and advocated conservative ideology. I never thought the forum was an echo chamber, left leaning or otherwise.
 
RandFan said:
From 2001 until 2009 I came here religously and defended and advocated conservative ideology. I never thought the forum was an echo chamber, left leaning or otherwise.
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Well, you were about the only one... and you retired. Like I said, it's not the opposite of the Free Republic... but I just think when 90% of members are of a certain party, you can't help but be a bit of a echo chamber. With that said.... most of the points are good.
 
seayakin said:
Pew poll seems to indicate a big bounce for Romney.

http://touch.latimes.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-72792143/
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Interesting. For months Romney is all over the place, making gaffes small and large, being secrative about taxes (and what he does reveal indicating some "issues"), thoroughly non-specific on his proposed plans (and what he does put forth being easily countered), at times arrogant and elitist, evasive and tone-deaf, flip-flopping faster than a hummingbird... And then, after just one well-presented sales presentation, a significant percentage of the public says, "Wow, this guy is awesome!" What?!

I've gotta hitch up my flummox.
 
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Regnad Kcin said:
Interesting. For months Romney is all over the place, making gaffes small and large, being secrative about taxes (and what he does reveal indicating some "issues"), thoroughly non-specific on his proposed plans (and what he does put forth being easily countered), at times arrogant and elitist, evasive and tone-deaf, etceterino... And then, after just one well-presented sales presentation, a significant percentage of the public says, "Wow, this guy is awesome!" What?!

I've gotta hitch up my flummox.
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The left brought this on themselves by selling the guy so low.

For months, every time Romney opened his mouth, regardless of what came out, "ah-ha, another gaffe!" Romney: "I like America." Media: "But Governor Romney, what about your GAAAAAAFFFFFFFESSSSS!" The way it was told, the guy was a walking rutabaga who was mentally incapable of opening his mouth without insulting women, men, minorities, whites, gays, straights, old, young, foreign, and domestic - with the whole statement bookended by a "DERP-DE-DERP". I'd imagine that the casual citizen, exposed to the common media narratives, had an image of Romney that involved a lot of drooling and the near-constant wear of a football helmet.

Then the debate happened. And afterwards, Mr. Casual Citizen scratched his head and thought to himself, "wow, I've been sold a load of BS."

And that's what you call a game-changer.
 
mikedenk said:
The left brought this on themselves by selling the guy so low.
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That's close.

More accurately, however, the Right really didn't want Romney in the first place, and only took him because they thought they had to. Sure, it's "beat Obama at any cost," but that cost is high.

And then (and still) it looked like he wasn't going to.

Now, all of a sudden, there's actually a reason to think he might have a chance. And the Right suddenly discovers they love the guy after all. :rolleyes:

That, plus the Democrats historically have gone absolutely to pieces at the first sign of trouble. Maybe you don't remember, but it used to take almost nothing before they'd all scream The Sky Is Falling!

That's what we're seeing here. And I still contend it's transient. Taken in isolation, that debate was really just not that interesting.
 
My theory from a while ago is that Obama will lose because he is black. I think that could possibly tip the election.
 
Caper said:
Well, you were about the only one... and you retired. Like I said, it's not the opposite of the Free Republic... but I just think when 90% of members are of a certain party, you can't help but be a bit of a echo chamber. With that said.... most of the points are good.
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Yeah, not buying it. At all. But if you really think that then what's the point of staying. I damn sure wouldn't have stayed if I thought as you do.
 
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mikedenk said:
The left brought this on themselves by selling the guy so low.
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The guy had a successful news cycle. Every GOP candidate has at least one successful debate and news cycle. Seriously why are getting all wet over a single news cycle? Did you forget all of the screw ups?

For months, every time Romney opened his mouth, regardless of what came out, "ah-ha, another gaffe!"
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They were gaffes. Even the GOP admitted Romney was screwing the pooch big time.
 
RandFan said:
Yeah, not buying it. At all. But if you really think that then what's the point of staying. I damn sure wouldn't have stayed if I thought as you do.
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I don't know if you noticed... but there are other topics outside of politcs on the board. Also, I don't really care if a large majority are left wingers.
 
Caper said:
I don't know if you noticed... but there are other topics outside of politcs on the board. Also, I don't really care if a large majority are left wingers.
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Well I certainly wouldn't bother with the politics forum if I didn't care and thought it was just an echo chamber, what's the point?
 
RandFan said:
The guy had a successful news cycle. Every GOP candidate has at least one successful debate and news cycle. Seriously why are getting all wet over a single news cycle? Did you forget all of the screw ups?
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Personally, I think it's a mistake to dismiss a (relatively) good performance at the end of a string of poor performances. There's a TED Talk that I think may provide some insight about a situation like this: Daniel Kahneman: The riddle of experience vs. memory.

Daniel Kahneman said:
A very critical part of a story is how it ends.
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RandFan said:
Well I certainly wouldn't bother with the politics forum if I didn't care and thought it was just an echo chamber, what's the point?
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Hey... I don't mind the echo's. Still lots to learn.
 
RandFan said:
I don't at all dismiss it. In fact I just said that it was a cause for concern.
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Err...

RandFan said:
The guy had a successful news cycle. Every GOP candidate has at least one successful debate and news cycle. Seriously why are getting all wet over a single news cycle? Did you forget all of the screw ups?
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That's quite clearly a dismissal of the event as "nothing special". Additionally, now you appear to be implying that it's OK for the left to find that successful news cycle concerning, but it's not OK for the right to get excited about it.
 
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Cl1mh4224rd said:
Err...

That's quite clearly a dismissal of the event as "nothing special". Additionally, now you appear to be implying that it's OK for the left to find that successful news cycle concerning, but it's not OK for the right to get excited about it.
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Err... no. If you think a single successful news cycle puts the odds of winning in Romney's favor then you are smoking something. The people who put their money where their mouths are certainly don't think that. Stating the facts ISN'T a dismissal. It's simply accepting reality. That said, Romney, at this moment has momentum and a 20% - 35% chance of winning (according to many people who make a living calculating odds and people who have actually put money on the race). Now, that's simply stating the facts also. Let me put it this way, anyone who would take an even money bet that Romney will win doesn't understand statistics and is one grade a sucker.

So, I'm really not sure what your point is. Probabilistic statements are nothing more than reality.
 
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