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Thoughts on bits from Romney's speech

pgwenthold said:
Joe - read your source
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Yes, right there in the very first sentence it says the CAFE standards are regulations.

There's a whole section about the 2011 agreement.
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It's an agreement that has the force of law. And it hasn't always been something the auto industry has been a party to in the past.

I have no problem with referring to it as an agreement, but you specified that it was a voluntary thing the auto industry was doing and was not an outside requirement. In fact, the CAFE standards are government regulations that the industry must adhere to.

From the section you mention (my bolding): "The agreement will result in new CAFE regulations for model year 2017-2025 vehicles which were finalized on August 28, 2012."

ETA: The last paragraph in that section about the 2011 agreement is a statement from Volkswagen saying that they don't like what was agreed to. However, if they want to continue selling cars in the U.S., they have to abide by the new regulations. So you can call it an agreement if you like, but it's not something the industry is doing on its own. There are some legitimate public interests that the free market just won't achieve. That's why I favor government regulations like these. That Obama has worked with the auto industry this way is commendable.
 
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pgwenthold said:
Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but when I hear about the "gas-mileage requirements" it always refers to the agreed-upon standards. IOW, these are goals that the auto manufacturers agreed to, not something that was imposed upon them. So the auto manufacturers agree with a goal for gas mileage, but somehow that is too extreme? That doesn't make sense.

I thought it was a GOOD thing how car manufacturers worked with the government to create better, more fuel efficient cars?
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Real AmericansTM drive muscle cars that get 6mpg but are really loud and have loads of power. Fuel efficient cars might as well be a sign of treason.

Giz said:
Is there good data to back this up? It seems like most of the green endeavors so far have been expensive and not that productive (i.e. wind farms) or flops (i.e. Solyndra).

This isn't saying that we shouldn't be green - just that I have understood that there is an economic cost to doing so. Seems like a feel good mantra that we can be nice to the environment and richer at the same time (of course, it would be wonderful if it is true).
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Loads of green businesses do quite well. People with ideological objections to going green search out for the rare failure to trumpet them and try and shame those dirty traitor hippies.

marksman said:
You're not helping... unless your goal is to say, "Mitt was wrong. There were two presidents who didn't get re-elected because the economy did not significantly improve during his term, not just one."

How on Earth does this do anything except make his argument stronger? Aargh! Sometimes I think Republicans can be morons because they can rely on Democrats doing their job.

"Those stupid Republicans were tryign to sabotage Obama but they're too stupid. I'll show you how to sabotage Obama." [promptly sabotages Obama]

Yeah, let's go around reminding people that two post-Depression Presidents, not one, failed to get re-elected durign tough economic times. That'll help Obama!
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It is all irrelevant as the economy is improving and has been for some time. No matter how much Republicans want America to fail America just isn't cooperating.
 
Travis said:
It is all irrelevant as the economy is improving and has been for some time. No matter how much Republicans want America to fail America just isn't cooperating.
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You are aware that the recovery is, shall we say, weak?
 
Travis said:
Loads of green businesses do quite well. People with ideological objections to going green search out for the rare failure to trumpet them and try and shame those dirty traitor hippies.
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So, no data then?
 
Giz said:
You are aware that the recovery is, shall we say, weak?
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True, but at least a couple of speakers at the RNC lied and said the economy is not in recovery (which would mean it's either not growing or it's contracting, neither of which is true as a matter of fact).
 
JoeTheJuggler said:
True, but at least a couple of speakers at the RNC lied and said the economy is not in recovery (which would mean it's either not growing or it's contracting, neither of which is true as a matter of fact).
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I know technically correct is the best kind of correct, but I think you and Obama both might have trouble selling matters of fact to people dealing with a jobless recovery and anemic growth overall.

I think a lot of people are still waiting for the other shoe to drop, and they're not seeing any evidence that it won't. To them, "as a matter of fact the economy is growing" sounds like you pissing in their ear and telling them it's raining.
 
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Travis said:
Real AmericansTM drive muscle cars that get 26mpg but are really loud and have loads of power. Fuel efficient cars might as well be a sign of treason.
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FT FY. It's the 21st Century for crying out loud. Real muscle cars get fairly decent mileage if you can keep your foot out of it, and, are not the gross polluters their ancestors were.


Travis said:
Loads of green businesses do quite well. People with ideological objections to going green search out for the rare failure to trumpet them and try and shame those dirty traitor hippies.
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See above.


Travis said:
It is all irrelevant as the economy is improving and has been for some time. No matter how much Republicans want America to fail America just isn't cooperating.
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As for the rest of this, what odd little nitch of California are you living in? When someone new comes to town, does Rod Serling step out and deliver a short monologue?
 
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One thing that is clear from Romney’s speech is that he will team up with Israel and attack Iran.
 
The daily show did a good job of rebuking the ludacris notion that the GOP put aside it's differences to support the president after his election. A clip from 8 days after the inauguration had mitt calling the presidents policies "failed." 8 goddamn days!
 
Biscuit said:
A clip from 8 days after the inauguration had mitt calling the presidents policies "failed." 8 goddamn days!
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And yet there was Romney lying his ass off to America the other night saying he wanted Obama to succeed. This guy believes there is a God? What kind of God allows him to lie to the world without a smite or two.

How much of an idiot must you be to listen to, much less vote for the guy.
 
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DavidJames said:
And yet there was Romney lying his ass off to America the other night saying he wanted Obama to succeed. This guy believe is a God? What kind of God allows him to lie to the world without a smite or two.

How much of an idiot must you be to listen to, much less vote for the guy.
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Well mitt makes the appropriate payments to his cult or church or whatever it is. So his gods bank account is flush thus mitt will get his own planet when he dies. It's all pretty straight forward and normal.
 
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