Scientology abandoned by Hubbard's granddaughter & Miscavige's father

Chris L said:
What we keep getting is a "it just works" kind of argument. You can apparently ignore all the nonsense surrounding the Church in general and LRH (and by extension, Miscavige) in particular, because the "tech" actually does all the magic things they claim. It seems that even though LRon was a major league fantasist and con-man, he just happened to trip over "the one true path" on his way to fame and fortune. Compared to that, the Xenu story sounds down right plausible.
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I'm not sure that Justinian wants to commit himself to saying that it is the one true path. He seems somewhat resistant to affirming that any religions are wrong about their core beliefs. Clearly most religions are, Islam, Christianity and Judaism can't all be right about the status of Jesus and Mohammad. The only reason that jumps to my mind for avoiding addressing this is to avoid us getting to the question of why those religions are wrong despite the religious convictions and confirmatory experiences of their followers, but Scientology is True and the proof of it being true are the religious convictions and confirmatory experiences of it's followers.
 
dafydd said:
No,it wasn't me. Refusing to talk about Xenu is one of the reasons why Avalon is not being entirely frank with us.
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I think you may have enturbulated your Fundies... Or did you mean YHWH instead of Xenu? We don't want to perpetuate Noah's Ark beliefs you know...


My Brain Hurts!
 
Brainache said:
I think you may have enturbulated your Fundies... Or did you mean YHWH instead of Xenu? We don't want to perpetuate Noah's Ark beliefs you know...


My Brain Hurts!
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My brain is starting to ache with thinking about the six fingers remark. I have no clue what it means.
 
Brainache said:
I think it was another Princess Bride referrence.
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I have no idea what the Princess Bride is. Did she have six fingers, and if she did, what does it have to do with $cientologists making up daft definitions of words?
 
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Why does anybody here think they are qualified to give any advice about therapy and religion?

Bullies think they can give advice, but all who know them know they have no qualifications. Bullies don't care if they are qualified or not. Bullies provoke a negative response and then use the reaction to their provocation to justify their actions.

I'm not calling any of you bullies. I'm just saying that some people don't care if they are qualified or not.

1) Are you qualified?
2) Do you care if you're qualified or not?
 
dafydd said:
My brain is starting to ache with thinking about the six fingers remark. I have no clue what it means.
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Quotes from the Princess Bride. It started with the thing about some word not meaning what Justinian thought it meant:


Then there was a quote from me about Justinian knowing something we didn't from the dual between Cary Elwes and Mandy Patinkin:



Then there was the quote about 6 fingers on the right hand. I can't find a clip of that, but a six fingered man features in the Princess Bride.
 
Justinian2 said:
Why does anybody here think they are qualified to give any advice about therapy and religion?

Bullies think they can give advice, but all who know them know they have no qualifications. Bullies don't care if they are qualified or not. Bullies provoke a negative response and then use the reaction to their provocation to justify their actions.

I'm not calling any of you bullies. I'm just saying that some people don't care if they are qualified or not.

1) Are you qualified?
2) Do you care if you're qualified or not?
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Do you think Judaism, Islam and Christianity are all correct about the significance of Jesus and Mohammad? Please give an unambiguous answer to this question. If the question is unanswerable, please explain unambiguously why. I have asked it several times. It's not as if they are insignificant issues for each religion. If Christians are correct about Jesus and there is a new covenant with God, then Jews are missing something hugely important. If Jesus isn't the messiah then that's kind of a blow for Christianity. If Mohammad isn't God's prophet, then that kind of undermines the value of the Koran. If he is, then Jews and Christians are missing something very important.
 
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Justinian2 said:
Why does anybody here think they are qualified to give any advice about therapy and religion?

Bullies think they can give advice, but all who know them know they have no qualifications. Bullies don't care if they are qualified or not. Bullies provoke a negative response and then use the reaction to their provocation to justify their actions.

I'm not calling any of you bullies. I'm just saying that some people don't care if they are qualified or not.

1) Are you qualified?
2) Do you care if you're qualified or not?
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Anybody capable of rational thought is qualified to tell that a "religion" started by a pathological liar, lunatic sci-fi writer which features stories like Xenu, is obviously a bunch of nonsense. And when he charges a lot of money for the "religion', after saying that the way to make money is to start a religion, it is also an obvious scam.
 
shuttlt said:
Do you think Judaism, Islam and Christianity are all correct about the significance of Jesus and Mohammad? Please give an unambiguous answer to this question. I have asked it several times.
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You may as well try and nail a jellyfish to a wall.
 
The Dark Lord said:
Anybody capable of rational thought is qualified to tell that a "religion" started by a pathological liar, lunatic sci-fi writer which features stories like Xenu, is obviously a bunch of nonsense. And when he charges a lot of money for the "religion', after saying that the way to make money is to start a religion, it is also an obvious scam.
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Not if you view it with your third eye.
 
Justinian2 said:
1) Are you qualified?
2) Do you care if you're qualified or not?
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1) No.
2) Very much so.

To help me to become qualified, I would greatly appreciate it if you could direct me towards the scientific journals in which the papers which test the claims made in Dianetics were published.
 
shuttlt said:
I'm not sure that Justinian wants to commit himself to saying that it is the one true path. He seems somewhat resistant to affirming that any religions are wrong about their core beliefs. Clearly most religions are, Islam, Christianity and Judaism can't all be right about the status of Jesus and Mohammad. The only reason that jumps to my mind for avoiding addressing this is to avoid us getting to the question of why those religions are wrong despite the religious convictions and confirmatory experiences of their followers, but Scientology is True and the proof of it being true are the religious convictions and confirmatory experiences of it's followers.
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That's a very broad topic. It's like saying democracy, free trade and capitalism are good. However it really depends on how the democracy, the free trade and the capitalism are structured and work. If we look at certain metrics like the distribution of wealth, taxation and government debt, then we can conclude that those functions are poorly designed and implemented.

I think that the benefit to cost ratio of the Miscavige church is far too low. Furthermore, I think that the future benefits of a limited amount of auditing is, like timeshares, overstated at the prices that Miscavige charges. That the prices of the Miscavige church are mere pocket change for Tom Cruise, is not the point - unless the church is only for the rich. God knows billionaires seem to need all the help they can get.
 
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Squeegee Beckenheim said:
1) No.
2) Very much so.

To help me to become qualified, I would greatly appreciate it if you could direct me towards the scientific journals in which the papers which test the claims made in Dianetics were published.
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A jellyfish and a wall yet again. He will avoid that question ad infinitum. And he wonders why he is not garnering any respect here!
 
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