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Tea Party Smeared by ABC

varwoche said:
Goalpost on the move... see if you can find it. It's obvious.
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Nothing is obvious to one who has not followed the story, so here are some clues.
U.S. Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Calif., and U.S. Sen. Charles Grassley, R-Iowa, chose a few select mainstream media outlets to receive an advanced copy of the report and then break the story long before anyone else could see it.

David Codrea, one of the two original reporters to break the Fast and Furious story, stated,

The concern was that first Senator Grassley and then Rep. Issa were initially urged to open the investigation by Gun Rights Examiner and citizen journalist Mike Vanderboegh of the Sipsey Street Irregulars blog, and much further information has been provided to their staffs throughout the course of the investigations. Additionally, pressure from respective readerships did much to help the story gain wider notice, particularly in the early days before “mainstream media” would touch it. That dynamic is still occurring, and to ignore representatives of new media, especially the ones who dragged this story to their doorstep, in favor of the old does not serve to support an informed citizenry, particularly noting how many outlets have either continually ignored the story or wrote it up with a spin designed to derail the investigation and advance an administration and “gun control”-promoting agenda.​

http://www.examiner.com/article/iss...ters-release-of-final-fast-and-furious-report
 
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Mhaze, sheesh, here's the idiotic statement that is the original goalpost location:
Robert Prey said:
Fast and furious is almost 2 years old. NBC just covered it a few weeks ago.
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Here's you concurring with said idiocy:
mhaze said:
Sounds about right. Sad, though. But you know, things that reflect poorly on the Bamster's crew and cronies need to be replaced with oh, let's say, human interest programming.
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Here's me mocking said occurrences:
varwoche said:
Clueless Tweedledum giving a thumbs up to clueless Tweedledee.

In other words, this is 200 proof, fact-free bias confirmation.
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And here's you moving the goalpost hither and yon:
mhaze said:
No clue what you are talking about. It's well known to people who have followed this story from the get go how it developed, and it's these two bloggers.

IF some media outlet picked it up other than Fox News in the early days, all power to them. But I think NOT.
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So, will you now concede that RP's claim is false?

Maybe you guys could add some nuance to your BS -- this is too easy.
 
varwoche said:
Mhaze, sheesh, here's the idiotic statement that is the original goalpost location:

Here's you concurring with said idiocy:

Here's me mocking said occurrences:

And here's you moving the goalpost hither and yon:
So, will you now concede that RP's claim is false?

Maybe you guys could add some nuance to your BS -- this is too easy.
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Nope. I'm just being honest, when I say...

IF some media outlet picked it up other than Fox News in the early days, all power to them. But I think NOT.

Admitting that you don't know everything in the world and that you could be wrong isn't moving goalposts. Well, then, is it "bias confirmation"? I don't know. Say you are a CBS editor or tycoon. What you going to feed to the masses, Lady Gaga or Fast and Furious?

By the way, I don't watch TV and don't have cable or satellite, but I know Fox did cover F&F consistently, and I'll give them credit for that. Is it possible there were one or two stories in the early days on the left leaning stations? Could be, but I have not found them.
 
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mhaze said:
Nope. I'm just being honest, when I say...

IF some media outlet picked it up other than Fox News in the early days, all power to them. But I think NOT.

Admitting that you don't know everything in the world and that you could be wrong isn't moving goalposts. Well, then, is it "bias confirmation"? I don't know. Say you are a CBS editor or tycoon. What you going to feed to the masses, Lady Gaga or Fast and Furious?

By the way, I don't watch TV and don't have cable or satellite, but I know Fox did cover F&F consistently, and I'll give them credit for that. Is it possible there were one or two stories in the early days on the left leaning stations? Could be, but I have not found them.
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Just to clarify, you don't have any problems with the following?

Robert Prey said:
Fast and furious is almost 2 years old. NBC just covered it a few weeks ago.
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Spindrift said:
Just to clarify, you don't have any problems with the following?
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Why should I? It looks correct to the best of my knowledge. I have posted other things that show little or no coverage of F&F by media.

If I should have a problem with this statement, what, exactly should the problem be?
 
mhaze said:
Why should I? It looks correct to the best of my knowledge. I have posted other things that show little or no coverage of F&F by media.

If I should have a problem with this statement, what, exactly should the problem be?
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It's inaccurate.
 
AlBell said:
No worry on why no coverage for 100+- weeks?
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That has nothing to do with whether or not the statement was inaccurate and whether mhaze has a problem agreeing with an inaccurate statement.

Since you asked, I never watch NBC News, what they do or do not cover makes no difference to me.
 
AlBell said:
No worry on why no coverage for 100+- weeks?
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Nope, and that is because it is a non-story of interest only to those who are already so deluded they think Obama is a stealth Muslim Communist Nazi who is coming to get 'er guns.
 
mhaze said:
Frequency of phrase "fast and furious"

Foxnews.com - 617, then thousands
cbs.com - 58
nbc.com - none
msnbc.com - none
npr.com - 216, first in June 2011
abc.com - search engine produces garbage
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Assuming these figures are accurate, why, mhaze, do you think fox gave this fairly unimportant story SO much coverage.
 
Travis said:
Nope, and that is because it is a non-story of interest only to those who are already so deluded they think Obama is a stealth Muslim Communist Nazi who is coming to get 'er guns.
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False. Some of us may know people who have been senselessly killed in the border drug wars and be genuinely concerned about the several hundred killings done with American weapons.

The subject of why this has been largely ignored by the media is certainly a good one. I'm certainly okay with the inference that largely liberal media doesn't want to air things that might look bad for the Bamster admin.
 
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SezMe said:
Assuming these figures are accurate, why, mhaze, do you think fox gave this fairly unimportant story SO much coverage.
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I consider it a highly important story, but then I live close to the affected areas. You could say, maybe it's one of the things Foxnews has done right.

By the way, HuffingtonPost also has done it right. But we are I think in this thread looking at or talking about video news and such not Internet sites, so I did not include Huff in the list.

"Assuming these figures ..."

That's just my typing "fast and furious", with the quotes, into the search engines on those sites...
 
mhaze said:
I consider it a highly important story, but then I live close to the affected areas. You could say, maybe it's one of the things Foxnews has done right.
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OK, let's say it is an important story, at least to a segment of our population. But this gun running operation is not the first of its kind. My understanding is that 3-4 covert gun running operations were carried out by the ATF starting about a decade ago. All efforts were initiated under Bush43.

AIUI, these operations were known to the media but were not a big deal so there was no coverage, especially by fox.

Correct me if I have anything wrong so far.

After Obama became president, only then did it become a prominent story. Why? And why is it blamed on Obama in light of the fact that even Holder did not know about it when he was sworn in as AG. And when he (Holder) did find out about it, an investigation was started, some of those involved were sanctioned (some fired I think) and the program stopped.

What more should he have done? One possibility would have been to appoint a special prosecutor instead of or in addition to the internal investigation; if you suggest that, I would completely agree. Given the history of the program, Ashcroft, Mukasey and Gonzales should have been under subpoena. And, if you want to hold Obama responsible now, Bush43 would have to be added to the list.

Your thoughts?
 
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mhaze said:
False. Some of us may know people who have been senselessly killed in the border drug wars and be genuinely concerned about the several hundred killings done with American weapons.

The subject of why this has been largely ignored by the media is certainly a good one. I'm certainly okay with the inference that largely liberal media doesn't want to air things that might look bad for the Bamster admin.
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Or they realize that to anyone but the immediately affected, gun nuts and the Obama deranged this is just a boring story about an ATF sting that was horribly conducted.
 
Travis said:
Or they realize that to anyone but the immediately affected, gun nuts and the Obama deranged this is just a boring story about an ATF sting that was horribly conducted.
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Well, you've hit on the key part of the problem.

THERE WASN'T A STING!

I mean, you can't make this stuff up. The guns were walked to the cartels by the purchasers with no followup, tracing, etc. They have been turning up in murders and such one by one.

One other thing - you better hope that "gun nuts" go ballistic over this matter because they are the guys that actually know what the particular weapons involved in the hands of the bad guys actually means. And they are, I understand, pretty much equally divided between the political parties...
 
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SezMe said:
OK, let's say it is an important story, at least to a segment of our population. But this gun running operation is not the first of its kind. My understanding is that 3-4 covert gun running operations were carried out by the ATF starting about a decade ago. All efforts were initiated under Bush43.

AIUI, these operations were known to the media but were not a big deal so there was no coverage, especially by fox.

Correct me if I have anything wrong so far.

After Obama became president, only then did it become a prominent story. Why? And why is it blamed on Obama in light of the fact that even Holder did not know about it when he was sworn in as AG. And when he (Holder) did find out about it, an investigation was started, some of those involved were sanctioned (some fired I think) and the program stopped.

What more should he have done? One possibility would have been to appoint a special prosecutor instead of or in addition to the internal investigation; if you suggest that, I would completely agree. Given the history of the program, Ashcroft, Mukasey and Gonzales should have been under subpoena. And, if you want to hold Obama responsible now, Bush43 would have to be added to the list.

Your thoughts?
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You left out an important detail: the program started to gain attention when Brian Terry, a Border Patrol agent, was killed in Arizona in 2010 with weapons that were traced back to Fast and Furious.
 
SezMe said:
OK, let's say it is an important story, at least to a segment of our population. But this gun running operation is not the first of its kind. My understanding is that 3-4 covert gun running operations were carried out by the ATF starting about a decade ago. All efforts were initiated under Bush43.

AIUI, these operations were known to the media but were not a big deal so there was no coverage, especially by fox.

Correct me if I have anything wrong so far.

After Obama became president, only then did it become a prominent story. Why? And why is it blamed on Obama in light of the fact that even Holder did not know about it when he was sworn in as AG. And when he (Holder) did find out about it, an investigation was started, some of those involved were sanctioned (some fired I think) and the program stopped.

What more should he have done? One possibility would have been to appoint a special prosecutor instead of or in addition to the internal investigation; if you suggest that, I would completely agree. Given the history of the program, Ashcroft, Mukasey and Gonzales should have been under subpoena. And, if you want to hold Obama responsible now, Bush43 would have to be added to the list.

Your thoughts?
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The prior operations were focused on traceability and were done in conjunction with the Mexican government. I would not have stopped those and I think most reasonable people would have continued them as successful, well thought out covert operations. That's why you didn't hear about them.

Think about it. It's simply factual that the current operation, called "Fast and Furious", had no followup or traceable elements, and resulted in hundreds dead by way of the assault weapons sold being actually used, and that this occurred under Eric Holder/Obama. Hundreds dead, mostly Mexicans, simply requires an investigation and considerable attention.

The subject of the thread was about liberal media bias, and R Prey noting that F&F got little mainstream media attention. Your post itself asks whether the Obama admin is culpable. What can I tell you, except that this has to be in the spotlight?

As earlier noted, it's a huge story. How would you think it would affect our relations with Mexico?

The really curious part to me is that the mainstream media would largely ignore really huge stories like this one. What in the world do they think their reporters are supposed to be doing all day?
 
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