Continuation: Discussion of the George Zimmerman case

[Unabogie]

But this speculation is old, from before we got his own words to match against the NEN call. We can tell that the circling didn't happen the way he says because the timing doesn't match. Serious keeps asking him "where are you here?" because he wants to tie him down. I'll read this link but my contention is that even without DD his story doesn't hold up.

Ok, read it. Yeah, they have George's story all wrong. That site is not accurate. Now that we have his actual story, we can look back and discount the early speculation.

 

[johnny karate]

Personal attacks are all you have?

Pretty much. From this point forward, some people are going to offer nothing more than bile and bare assertions. Along the way, they'll whine about the thread being uninteresting and rack up yellow cards because of their inability to have a grown-up discussion.

I have repeatedly stated that I would form my opinion based on the facts, and if those facts pointed to Zimmerman being innocent, then so be it. But as the tide is turning against Zimmerman, it's enjoyable to watch how many people are committed to him being exonerated regardless of the truth.

 

[Unabogie]

Pretty much. From this point forward, some people are going to offer nothing more than bile and bare assertions. Along the way, they'll whine about the thread being uninteresting and rack up yellow cards because of their inability to have a grown-up discussion.

I have repeatedly stated that I would form my opinion based on the facts, and if those facts pointed to Zimmerman being innocent, then so be it. But as the tide is turning against Zimmerman, it's enjoyable to watch how many people are committed to him being exonerated regardless of the truth.

Yeah, he really talked a lot. It's interesting to me to see a case where so much info is public. Getting his story and hearing his interrogation removes a huge layer of mystery. People should spend their time listening to each of those interviews. I'm not surprised at all that he was charged and the folks accusing Corey of some sort of malfeasance look pretty foolish right now.

 

[Mumbles]

George never says he is near the clubhouse, it's Martin near the clubhouse when my timeline places him there

19:11:16 Zimmerman: Hey we've had some break-ins in my neighborhood, and there's a real suspicious guy, ~~~~ the best address I can give you is 111 Retreat View Circle.

19:12:00 Dispatcher: Okay—you said it's 1111 Retreat View? Or 111?Zimmerman: That's the clubhouse…
Dispatcher: That's the clubhouse, do you know what the—he's near the clubhouse right now?
Zimmerman: Yeah, now he's coming towards me.

19:12:33 Zimmerman: Ayup, he's coming to check me out.
That's at GZ's position
19:13:03 Zimmerman: Actually. You would go past the clubhouse.

Also, although you can hear his door open, the "you're doing something wrong" car jingle turn on, and then him close his door, we never hear his engine accelerate in his recording. My guess is that Zimmerman was driving up Twin Trees, spotted Martin, and pulled over on the east-west portion of the street. Although he thinks Martin is coming to "check [him] out", Martin was really just walking home. And when Martin runs, Zimmerman has to turn around to get a flashlight, get his keys, open his door, and so forth, and this is why he has no idea where Martin went once he finally gets out of his car.

I mean, if he's facing his car at the dog path, and sees Trayvon slip between the houses, come back, and then run off again, how on earth did he lose sight of him? His headlights should let him see exactly whic direction Martn goes.

And about the dispatcher asking for an address, that only happens after Zimmerman got out of his car.

 

[Mumbles]

Seriously, have you ever watched Randi's videos proving how bad our memory is when talking to a pscychic? There was one where he had a woman get a psychic reading. She was supposed to tell the psychic every time she got something wrong. Then he listens to the recording and counts how many times they psychic got something wrong. The woman's answer was in the low tens. James Randi said he counted something in the 40's guesses the psychic got wrong. We do not have perfect memories. Our brains don't always remember things in the correct order.

The problem is, virtually everything he misremembered just somehow makes him look like an innocent guy.

Oh, he was concerned because Martin was on someone's lawn. Oh, he was parked at the clubhouse. Oh, he only moved his car because the operator told him to. Oh, he was more worried because Martin reappeared and circled his car and then ran off again. Oh, he only got out to look for an address, because the operator insisted on having one. Zimmerman was just an innocent guy who was attacked by a crazed, vicious teenager because he got bad instructions from dispatch.

Yeah right. He was never parked at the clubhouse, so he never saw Martin just standing on a lawn. He didn't move his car, and the operator never asked him to. Martin never re-emerged to circle his car and then run back. And really, if Martin were crazy and violent, he would have started beating on Zimmerman's window and pulling on his door handle window, not do some stupid stalker dance and run off again. And the operator only asked him what address he was parked at after Zimmerman started running after Martin.

But we're supposed to believe that Martin waited in a shadow or behind some knee-high bushes, waited until after seeing Zimmerman pass by twice, and suddenly went into a violent, movie dialogue spouting rampage? And this despite the fact that the girl Martin was on the phone heard something totally different, and that another witness heard "talking, then shouting, and then fighting"?

 

[This is The End]

I'm glad you're taking the time to post because it's posts like this that are the only thing left making this thread remotely interesting.

So you agree that changing 2 locations to 1 can happen just in a normal memory lapse??

 

[Amazer]

So you agree that changing 2 locations to 1 can happen just in a normal memory lapse??

Sure it can.... if you are mindlessly committed to GZ being innocent no matter what.

 

[crimresearch]

refused to identify himself as Captain of the Watch,

 

[crimresearch]

Sure it can.... if you are mindlessly committed to GZ being innocent no matter what.

So when you make bizarre assertions that bear no resemblance to reality, and run away when asked to explain, that isn't 'mindless'?

 

[Dcdrac]

All those molehills of inconsistencies, compounded, turn into a mountain of lies.

After to listening to those tapes its clear to me that GZ is acting like a child caught stealing swees and trying to get off the hook.


I stand by the mpressin I formed at the begining not murder but manslaughter casuded by GZ's reckless behaviour.

His amply proven lying and convulations are not helping him at all if anything they are making him look a right dodgy geezer.

 

[This is The End]

So when you make bizarre assertions that bear no resemblance to reality, and run away when asked to explain, that isn't 'mindless'?

I'm curious crimresearch, did you listen to the new tapes??

 

[Noztradamus]

Also, although you can hear his door open, the "you're doing something wrong" car jingle turn on, and then him close his door, we never hear his engine accelerate in his recording. My guess is that Zimmerman was driving up Twin Trees, spotted Martin, and pulled over on the east-west portion of the street. Although he thinks Martin is coming to "check [him] out", Martin was really just walking home. And when Martin runs, Zimmerman has to turn around to get a flashlight, get his keys, open his door, and so forth, and this is why he has no idea where Martin went once he finally gets out of his car.

I mean, if he's facing his car at the dog path, and sees Trayvon slip between the houses, come back, and then run off again, how on earth did he lose sight of him? His headlights should let him see exactly whic direction Martn goes.

And about the dispatcher asking for an address, that only happens after Zimmerman got out of his car.

I don't think George was on Twin Trees before following Martin
1. Twin Trees is not on the way to anywhere
2. George is not familair with it
3. He claims his suspicions were raises seeing Martin by Frank Taffe's house, That's on RVC. I don't think George is stupid enough to lie about being on RVC if he wasn't.

But as George gets out of his car on Twin Trees only 2 minutes after calling the NEN, it couldn't have started where he said, "parked a few feet away" hrom Frank Taffe's house. (Apart from the absence of "car starting vroom vroom" noises on the NEN tape)

But I agree, he headlights could not have been pointing towards the walkway T. he must have turned his truck around

 

[quadraginta]

I don't think George was on Twin Trees before following Martin
1. Twin Trees is not on the way to anywhere
2. George is not familair with it
3. He claims his suspicions were raises seeing Martin by Frank Taffe's house, That's on RVC. I don't think George is stupid enough to lie about being on RVC if he wasn't.

But as George gets out of his car on Twin Trees only 2 minutes after calling the NEN, it couldn't have started where he said, "parked a few feet away" hrom Frank Taffe's house. (Apart from the absence of "car starting vroom vroom" noises on the NEN tape)

But I agree, he headlights could not have been pointing towards the walkway T. he must have turned his truck around

I have a problem with item #2 on your list.

How could George not be familiar with Twin Trees? Aside from the perimeter road there are only two streets in the apartment complex. No "dead ends", no cul de sacs, no little internal loop roads. The average mall these days is more complicated.

And this is a dude who wants to run the Neighborhood Watch.

Now, I think that most of us can agree that Z isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, but to be unfamiliar with either of the only two little, bitty streets inside the loop in that development isn't much of a challenge. Both of them together barely offer 600 yds. of street to be familiar with.

 

[Dcdrac]

I have a problem with item #2 on your list.

How could George not be familiar with Twin Trees? Aside from the perimeter road there are only two streets in the apartment complex. No "dead ends", no cul de sacs, no little internal loop roads. The average mall these days is more complicated.

And this is a dude who wants to run the Neighborhood Watch.

Now, I think that most of us can agree that Z isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, but to be unfamiliar with either of the only two little, bitty streets inside the loop in that development isn't much of a challenge. Both of them together barely offer 600 yds. of street to be familiar with.

At best the man was a bumbling well intentioned wannabe police officer amatuer the worst case scenario for a Neighbourhood Watch operative.

At worst he was a self appointed bumbling wannabe Dirty Harry

Either way his actions certainly led to a tragedy.

In this thread i beleive it has been forgotten who the victim is here

Traynor Martin

 

[Dancing David]

Hmmm ham bush!

Bush whack

 

[Dancing David]

Sure it can.... if you are mindlessly committed to GZ being innocent no matter what.

So you agree that changing 2 locations to 1 can happen just in a normal memory lapse??

My memory is quite faulty.

 

[KatieG]

At best the man was a bumbling well intentioned wannabe police officer amatuer the worst case scenario for a Neighbourhood Watch operative.

At worst he was a self appointed bumbling wannabe Dirty Harry

Either way his actions certainly led to a tragedy.

In this thread i beleive it has been forgotten who the victim is here

Traynor Martin

Errr.....Trayvon Martin.

 

[quadraginta]

Errr.....Trayvon Martin.

Ouch!

 

[Unabogie]

I have a problem with item #2 on your list.

How could George not be familiar with Twin Trees? Aside from the perimeter road there are only two streets in the apartment complex. No "dead ends", no cul de sacs, no little internal loop roads. The average mall these days is more complicated.

And this is a dude who wants to run the Neighborhood Watch.

Now, I think that most of us can agree that Z isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, but to be unfamiliar with either of the only two little, bitty streets inside the loop in that development isn't much of a challenge. Both of them together barely offer 600 yds. of street to be familiar with.

George also says he walks his dog there, so that's evidence he knows that street.

 

[bynmdsue]

Yeah, that's what happened. The kid without a violent history decided to wait in ambush and murder Zimmerman... for some reason.

That's much more plausible than a proven liar telling lies to cover his ass.

Go back and reread Noztradamus' post in #110

Now that doesn't change either your or my reconstruction timing of what happened during Martin's journey from 1440 RVC to the walkway tee, just places it 1'40" earlier.

This allows George time after the NEN call to return to his truck, Martin to retrurn and "circle the truck"

7:14:30 Zimmerman gets back to his SUV and is waiting for the police to arrive. Suddenly, there’s a knock at the window, it’s Trayvon.

“Why are you following me?”

“I’m not.”

Trayvon starts to walk away, then runs, between buildings

Zimmerman decides he wants to keep Martin in sight.

Martin leaps out of bushes, fight, "BANG" as before

GZ has returned to his vehicle and is waiting for the police when TM approaches, knocks on the window and runs off and lays in wait for GZ to follow. That's an ambush.