Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[crimresearch]

The police decided determined he was acting in the capacity of the NW.

I'm not sure how.

And you got that from their official statement that 'Mr Zimmerman was on a personal errand at the time'????

 

[crimresearch]

The dispatcher asks GZ which entrance TM is running towards.

One could take that as a need to go and see.

Especially if TM is out of sight at that point.

So every time the authorities ask someone 'which way did they go?', that's a 'need' to run after the subject?


Give me a freaking break.

 

[bookworm]

And therein lies the rub. Of course it's possible that GZ is lying about some element. But unless you've got strong evidence you don't convict someone on "possible". However many here who evidently have psychic powers have no need for evidence, the only evidence they need is thinking that know who GZ is, and being convinced he's a liar.

I'm more than willing to acknowledge it's possible he's lying. Are they willing to acknowledge he could be telling the truth? Because I've seen no such acknowledgment.

I agree. So far, I've seen alot of people reaching for any possible way to make him a guilty liar and no acknowledment that he could be telling the truth.

 

[Natural Born Skeptic]

Somewhere in the early part of this thread, a link was made to a police department liason saying that she told George during NW orientation that he could only observe and report.

None of that comes even close to being training, none of it confers any duty of care, (which wouldn't be any sort of issue in this case anyway), and it is all rendered moot by the simple fact that George was on a personal errand at the time.

The papers initially made a big deal about his non-existent rank of 'Captain', and the non-existent authority of the Neighborhood Watch, but I wouldn't read too much into it.

Isn't it also rendered moot by the fact that in spite of all accusations to the contrary, there is 0 evidence he tried to do anything but "observe and report"?

 

[crimresearch]

And therein lies the rub. Of course it's possible that GZ is lying about some element. But unless you've got strong evidence you don't convict someone on "possible". However many here who evidently have psychic powers have no need for evidence, the only evidence they need is thinking that know who GZ is, and being convinced he's a liar.

I'm more than willing to acknowledge it's possible he's lying. Are they willing to acknowledge he could be telling the truth? Because I've seen no such acknowledgment.

And the irony is, that a lie and the truth in these circumstances, would contain exactly the same things.

Lying George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".


Truthful George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".

Fat gangbanger George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".

Grown up family man who has put his impetuous past behind him George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".

Rightwinger George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".


Leftwinger George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".

KKK George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".

La Raza George: "I was just trying to see where this guy went, so I could point him out to the police, when he came up from behind, asked me what I was doing, started beating me, and grabbed for my own gun".

 

[LTC8K6]

So every time the authorities ask someone 'which way did they go?', that's a 'need' to run after the subject?


Give me a freaking break.

Why do you jump to the extreme?

What's the point of doing that?

 

[crimresearch]

Why do you jump to the extreme?

What's the point of doing that?

Only you can answer that, because only you made that jump, not me.

 

[EdG]

So far, I've seen alot of people reaching for any possible way to make him a guilty liar and no acknowledment that he could be telling the truth.

It is quite possible GZ is telling the truth as he sees it. However, that would contravene the known instances where he has lied. Considering the potential cost associated with killing someone, it is prudent for skeptics to acknowledge that GZ has a strong motivation toward untruthfulness as opposed to truthfulness.

 

[Rare Truth]

It is quite possible GZ is telling the truth as he sees it. However, that would contravene the known instances where he has lied. Considering the potential cost associated with killing someone, it is prudent for skeptics to acknowledge that GZ has a strong motivation toward untruthfulness as opposed to truthfulness.

We've already seen both he and his wife have no problem lying in court proceedings...we know he lied to LE when he told the booking officer that he had never been in a pretrial-diversion program before, and that he was "squeaky clean." We know that has he told other lies.

We know Seriono thought he lied that night.

It is difficult to see any kind of honesty shine through for him - especially when investigators have found his story "is not consistent with the evidence.'"

​

 

[Cylinder]

...we know he lied to LE when he told the booking officer that he had never been in a pretrial-diversion program before...

What? Where do you find evidence for that claim?

 

[Rare Truth]

What? Where do you find evidence for that claim?

"After shooting Trayvon Martin in late February, he told Sanford police he didn't have a criminal history. He did. Several weeks later, he told the Seminole County Sheriff's Office he had never been in a pretrial-diversion program. That's also untrue."

Zimmerman's untrue statements
•The night he shot Trayvon Martin to death, police say Zimmerman told them his record was squeaky-clean. In fact, he had been charged in 2005 with resisting arrest without violence during an altercation with a state alcohol officer. Zimmerman wound up in a pretrial-diversion program, a scaled-down version of probation offered to nonviolent first-time offenders.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...consultant-stand-your-ground-law-jurors-trust

 

[Rare Truth]

One thing you should know about me by now, Cyl, is I can almost always back up my statements with solid sources.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

And you got that from their official statement that 'Mr Zimmerman was on a personal errand at the time'????

No, I got it from their official press release:

http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/TwinLakesTownhomesShootingUpDate.pdf

Police have determined that George Zimmerman was serving in the role of neighborhood watch member, when he and Trayvon Martin had an encounter which resulted in the shooting death of Mr. Martin.

Please do try and keep up with the thread ...

 

[Cylinder]

"After shooting Trayvon Martin in late February, he told Sanford police he didn't have a criminal history. He did. Several weeks later, he told the Seminole County Sheriff's Office he had never been in a pretrial-diversion program. That's also untrue."

I am interested in the claim that he was specifically asked about pre-trial diversion. If Zimmerman stated he had no criminal history, he was correct.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

I am interested in the claim that he was specifically asked about pre-trial diversion. If Zimmerman stated he had no criminal history, he was correct.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...consultant-stand-your-ground-law-jurors-trust

When he was booked into the Seminole County Jail on April 11, he told the booking officer that he never had been in a pretrial-diversion program before, documents show.
...
SOURCES: Sentinel reporting and research

http://cfnews13.com/content/dam/new...ents/george-zimmerman-booking-report-0412.pdf

Not in the booking document... I wonder what document shows it ?

 

[Cylinder]

Not in the booking document... I wonder what document shows it ?

Yea - they're probably not going to rely too much on self-reporting at booking other than classification - if that jail has a classification system. Zimmerman was headed for segragation the minute he walked through the door.

They may have asked him if he'd ever been arrested during his interrogation.

ETA: MY free Sentinel views have expired, so I can't read the article. There is one reporter there who reports as fact whatever his game of whispers turns up. I wish I could recall his name. He was the one reporting the shot in the back and shot twice claims as fact.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Yea - they're probably not going to rely too much on self-reporting at booking other than classification - if that jail has a classification system. Zimmerman was headed for segragation the minute he walked through the door.

They may have asked him if he'd ever been arrested during his interrogation.

ETA: MY free Sentinel views have expired, so I can't read the article. There is one reporter there who reports as fact whatever his game of whispers turns up. I wish I could recall his name. He was the one reporting the shot in the back and shot twice claims as fact.

Just delete your cookies or use 'porno' mode in your browser
(aka incognito, or privacy mode, or something else - depending on which browser.)

BTW, it's Rene Stutzman and Jeff Weiner, if that's who you were thinking of.

 

[Cylinder]

BTW, it's Rene Stutzman and Jeff Weiner, if that's who you were thinking of.

The Sentinel must have some editorial friction going on there. Half of there coverage seems like reasoned news articles. I guess those are the wire articles. The other half reads like a Team Crump press release.

 

[Dancing David]

Can you explain this? How was Zimmerman acting under the auspices of the NW rather than acting on his own behalf as everyone is allowed to do?

Does joining an informal neighborhood watch program somehow decrease your rights as a citizen?

No but it does possibly change the standard of care.

 

[Dancing David]

Somewhere in the early part of this thread, a link was made to a police department liason saying that she told George during NW orientation that he could only observe and report.

None of that comes even close to being training, none of it confers any duty of care, (which wouldn't be any sort of issue in this case anyway), and it is all rendered moot by the simple fact that George was on a personal errand at the time.

The papers initially made a big deal about his non-existent rank of 'Captain', and the non-existent authority of the Neighborhood Watch, but I wouldn't read too much into it.

Fair enough, but does it make getting out of the truck reasonable?