How to best troubleshoot "ghost" activity

What it is with ghosts and trivial acts of mischief ? Why are they so taken with shoving dinnerware around, you'd think they'd have better things to do.

At the risk of derailing the thread, and i will make a (sensible if possible) on topic contribution in a second, the parapsychological orthodoxy says ghosts don;t push things around. Physical phenomena are generally regarded as related to poltergeist cases, which are explained in a different way to apparitional and haunting cases, and therefore the two are regarded as distinct. I don't think the evidence supports this - neither does Alan Gauld, or Stephen Braude, or Becky Smith. I challenge it in my fairly light hearted blog piece here -- http://jerome23.wordpress.com/2011/...think-we-know-about-ghosts-is-probably-wrong/

cj x
 
I hope someone can help me to find a legitimate, honest organization to investigate unusual events at my friends’ house. They are thinking “paranormal”, I’m thinking “just haven’t found a rational explanation yet.” Either way, I’d like to have a reputable group check it out before my friend calls Ghostbusters® (or whatever scam artists are ghost hunting today).

The Chicago Skeptics sound like a good call. If you want an academic parapsychological opinion, I guess you could write to Annalisa Ventola at http://www.parapsych.org/ and ask if there is anyone at the Chicago universities in the field. Say CJ mentioned the PA and though they might be able to refer you to an academic parapsychologist. I'd ask both along at the same time; however my gut instinct is just investigate yourselves. You can probably work out whats going on, you seem intelligent and sensible.

My serious advice is to advise the family not to discuss their experiences with neighbours, any one but close friends or especially the media. The last thing you want is a crowd of people outside the house shouting "woo ghosties" or whatever.

Some basic thoughts: everyone has already taken the right approach, in that you have to analyse each event, looking for the logical cause. Once an event causes people to start thinking spooks, then the context is set and everything else is interpreted in that way. So take each phenomena one at a time.

Nothing harmful is happening, the family sound well adjusted. It's just annoying and mysterious, but if you work on establishing a rational cause for every event the issue may disappear. Sure get the electrics checked out, but it sounds more like vibration if anything, though I don't know enough to speculate meaningfully.

Still make a joke of it, take it lightly, and don't stress or let it get dramatic. I hope it all works out for you, but record all the events (we have no idea of time scale or who was present at each event from your account) and let us know how it goes. :)

cj x
 
I'll paraphrase my old man's advice from years ago:

"There's no such thing as *********** ghosts, now go back to *********** sleep!"

I've never run across any anecdote that contravenes that advice.
 
At the risk of derailing the thread, and i will make a (sensible if possible) on topic contribution in a second, the parapsychological orthodoxy says ghosts don;t push things around.


This is quite funny. What exactly does it mean?
 
This is quite funny. What exactly does it mean?


The majority in this case. The three main hypotheses are those arguing for naturalistic causes, those arguing for some kind of discarnate entity, and what seems to be the "mainstream" in the peer reviewed literature, discussion of some version of RSPK based on the psi hypothesis, which is arguably the dominant paradigm in parapsychology. See my article I linked for more explanation.

cj x
 
The majority in this case. The three main hypotheses are those arguing for naturalistic causes, those arguing for some kind of discarnate entity, and what seems to be the "mainstream" in the peer reviewed literature, discussion of some version of RSPK based on the psi hypothesis, which is arguably the dominant paradigm in parapsychology. See my article I linked for more explanation.

cj x

Seems that you're overlooking the attention whore hypothesis.
 
Seems that you're overlooking the attention whore hypothesis.


I've been involved with researching a number of these cases over the years, and as in the OP case the people concerned usually do not seek publicity themselves - these case often come to public attention via third parties. I see your point; if cases come to media attention you might think that; but an analysis of the cases i culled from the news in 2010/2011 on my Polterwotsit blog seems to suggest that three weeks have usually passed before the story goes public, and often a rather amusing array of priests, "experts", psychics and police have been involved by then. The primary motivation usually appears to be to get help, though Dave Woods, chair of ASSAP, is currently doing a solid piece of research on cases in social housing to see if a desire for rehousing is a commonality in those cases. However there does not appear to be a majority of cases in such an environment based on a cursory overview of the data I have to hand for 1990-2010.

cj x
 
I've been involved with researching a number of these cases over the years, and as in the OP case the people concerned usually do not seek publicity themselves - these case often come to public attention via third parties. I see your point; if cases come to media attention you might think that; but an analysis of the cases i culled from the news in 2010/2011 on my Polterwotsit blog seems to suggest that three weeks have usually passed before the story goes public, and often a rather amusing array of priests, "experts", psychics and police have been involved by then. The primary motivation usually appears to be to get help, though Dave Woods, chair of ASSAP, is currently doing a solid piece of research on cases in social housing to see if a desire for rehousing is a commonality in those cases. However there does not appear to be a majority of cases in such an environment based on a cursory overview of the data I have to hand for 1990-2010.

cj x

I think if you overlook hypotheses such as the one I suggested, you're pretty much overlooking the root causes of such things.

I've never seen a "haunting" that didn't have a naturalistic cause. And while I'm not a chair of some organization with a lot of vowels in its title, I have looked into a haunting or two.

I've never seen a haunted house; haunted people are another story.
 
I think if you overlook hypotheses such as the one I suggested, you're pretty much overlooking the root causes of such things.

I've never seen a "haunting" that didn't have a naturalistic cause. And while I'm not a chair of some organization with a lot of vowels in its title, I have looked into a haunting or two.

I've never seen a haunted house; haunted people are another story.

Sure, plenty of people have psychological reasons to develop ghost stories. However is there any sign of this in the OP case? I think they sound perfectly sensible, just puzzled by minor issues. The Demand Characteristics and Context now mean the "haunting" can grow, as minor things we all experience get associated with the "spook"; though actually that would work well in terms of Batcheldor's psi impedance theory and RSPK, loathe as I am to accept RSPK.

However chances are it is all explicable in perfectly normal terms, and only been noticed for the psychological reasons noted -- Houran and Lange have done a lot on this, good article in Perceptual and Motor Skills in te late 90's but I don't have it to hand; but not having spoken directly to the witnesses or examined the place i can't say really

cj x
 
Sure, plenty of people have psychological reasons to develop ghost stories. However is there any sign of this in the OP case? I think they sound perfectly sensible, just puzzled by minor issues. The Demand Characteristics and Context now mean the "haunting" can grow, as minor things we all experience get associated with the "spook"; though actually that would work well in terms of Batcheldor's psi impedance theory and RSPK, loathe as I am to accept RSPK.

However chances are it is all explicable in perfectly normal terms, and only been noticed for the psychological reasons noted -- Houran and Lange have done a lot on this, good article in Perceptual and Motor Skills in te late 90's but I don't have it to hand; but not having spoken directly to the witnesses or examined the place i can't say really

cj x

I think we've sparred before and as I recall it was always perfectly reasonable, even though I don't find the idea of "ghosts" reasonable at all. I'm a show me the phenomena kind of guy, and so far, no one has.

As far as such ideas as rspk, well I too am loathe to accept; I am not pleased when someone uses one unevidenced phenomenon to explain another equally unevidenced phenomenon
 
As far as such ideas as rspk, well I too am loathe to accept; I am not pleased when someone uses one unevidenced phenomenon to explain another equally unevidenced phenomenon


Yep, totally. And furthermore, what does Recurrent Spontaneous Psychokinesis actually mean? It's a theory laden term, in that all it is does is describe the hypothesis without any proposed mechanism, so I prefer to avoid it as gobbledigook, I think IGMT is just as meaningful (Invisible Gnome Mediated Telekinesis) - and IGMT is again explaining one marvel by another, so just as (un)acceptable. Yep, think we are agree on this one :)

cj x
 
Ah found the article I mentioned on PUBMED

Percept Mot Skills. 1996 Jun;82(3 Pt 1):755-62.
Contextual mediation of perceptions in hauntings and poltergeist-like experiences.

Lange R, Houran J, Harte TM, Havens RA.
Source

University of Illinois at Springfield 62794-9823, USA. lange@uis.edu

Abstract

The content of perceived apparitions, e.g., bereavement hallucinations, cannot be explained entirely in terms of electromagnetically induced neurochemical processes. It was shown that contextual variables influential in hallucinatory and hypnotic states also structured reported haunting experiences. As predicted, high congruency was found between the experiential content and the nature of the contextual variables. Further, the number of contextual variables involved in an experience was related to the type of experience and the state or arousal preceding the experience. Based on these findings we argue that a more complete explanation of haunting experiences should take into account both electromagnetically induced neurochemical processes and factors related to contextual mediation.


There is a replication online here - http://www.mesaproject.com/index.ph...-like-experiences-a-replication-and-extension

Hope of interest

cj x
 
What it is with ghosts and trivial acts of mischief ? Why are they so taken with shoving dinnerware around, you'd think they'd have better things to do.

It must be what happens to spoon-benders like Uri Geller when they die. Unable to perform trivial acts of bending cutlery, they perform trivial acts of shoving dinnerware around. It's a bit sad.
 
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When quoting someone you generally select the relevant part of what someone has said, reproduce it verbatim and place quotes around it - it's less useful to reword the thrust of what someone has said (which can often be misleading), fortunately the magic of cut and paste means people only need misquote if their intention is to misquote.

Oh, sorry. That was just text between quotation marks, I did not intend that to be an actual quote. But you are right, I should have put it like they-sure-have-better-things-to-do, or something like that.
 
Yep, totally. And furthermore, what does Recurrent Spontaneous Psychokinesis actually mean? It's a theory laden term, in that all it is does is describe the hypothesis without any proposed mechanism, so I prefer to avoid it as gobbledigook, I think IGMT is just as meaningful (Invisible Gnome Mediated Telekinesis) - and IGMT is again explaining one marvel by another, so just as (un)acceptable. Yep, think we are agree on this one :)

cj x

Cj, I would like to ask you if you know if there ever was a haunting case that could not be explained by anything normal or mundane? Do you know of such case?
 
Yes, there are many many such cases. I'm sure plenty of sceptical investigators have encountered them. And doctors encounter diseases they can't diagnose. That does not mean the causes are paranormal, just no one could explain them at time, which given how complex the potential range of causes are this is no surprise. One "poltergeist" was I believe ultimately explained, when the ticking associated with a non-functioning clock was shown to belong to a very rare beetle. Cases such as Enfield have elements which can be explained, but many that are still not really explicable byy simple fraud or simple misperception. When recordings exist like the Andover Poltergeist it gets even harder. I'll think of a good example if you like and link to the case documentation if it would be of interest?

cj x
 

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