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CIA threatens "Press for Truth" producers over release of new documentary

achimspok said:
The interesting part is always who believes whom.

Mineta vs. Cheney:
Was Cheney in the PEOC and updated about the plane location?

Tenet vs. Clark:
Did the CIA withheld vital information?

Paul vs. Rice:
Was Paul sent to the UN with wrong information?

Rumsfeld vs. Rumsfeld:
Did he do his duty?

FBI vs. FBI:
Did the property owner of Abdul Rahman Alomari give the agents the licence number of Mohammed Atta as "authorized" to park infront of the house as sworn by the FBI?

My take: yes, yes, yes, no, no
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Why do you think that you know more than the experts?
 
Oh great; another intel armchair quarterback who thinks the intel community is infallible and immediately, without any context, knows exactly what will happen and when and decides to do nothing about it.

I am so sick of you people thinking you know how the intel community works. Tell you what; get yourself a security clearance and a job working as an intel analyst (and good luck to you on passing the background investigations, considering your rampant demonstrated paranoia), and THEN come and talk to me about the way things should have gone.

I get incredibly pissed off at people who know absolutely NOTHING about how the US Intel Community works spouting off at the mouth about how things SHOULD have gone before 9/11 without ever once taking into account that you know exactly two things about how it works, Jack and ****, and Jack left town, to quote Mr. Bruce Campbell. Do the job first; THEN you might have an inkling of the way things actually were in the government before 9/11, as well as how they are now. Only then will you be able to speak with a modicum of knowledge about what may or may not have gone down prior to 9/11; until then, sit down, shut up, and acknowledge that you know absolutely NOTHING.
 
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Sabrina said:
Do the job first; THEN you might have an inkling of the way things actually were in the government before 9/11, as well as how they are now. Only then will you be able to speak with a modicum of knowledge about what may or may not have gone down prior to 9/11; until then, sit down, shut up, and acknowledge that you know absolutely NOTHING.
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Yeah...........THIS^^^^^^
 
newton3376 said:
Yeah...........THIS^^^^^^
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Authoritarianism at its finest. This is the sort of commentary I would expect some Soviet citizens to make about the KGB during the Cold War.

If this is all hindsight and ignorant Internet posting then it shouldn't be difficult for someone to come forward and explain why it made sense to obstruct al Qaeda investigations. If you want context the initial CIA withholding took place just after the Millennium threat when the intelligence community was on full alert for possible attack. The later withholding took place during a time when "the system was blinking red."

Former Senator Graham mentioned the prospect of Saudi involvement and US corruption. Evidently you would have the public believe there is no possibility of corruption in the US intelligence community.
 
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thatsmystory said:
Authoritarianism at its finest.
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Incorrect.

It's real world experience at it's finest...........Sabrina and I both have experience (somewhat different experiences when it comes to specifics but still the same world) when it comes to working with or for Intel agencies.....so unsurprisingly our views on certain topics are similar.

It's what happens when you have people with some real life experience as to how stuff works in the real world as opposed to fantasy-trutherland.

thatsmystory said:
This is the sort of commentary I would expect some Soviet citizens to make about the KGB during the Cold War.
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Your expectations come from ignorance.........read what we wrote over and over and attempt to get some reality.........

thatsmystory said:
If this is all hindsight and ignorant Internet posting then it shouldn't be difficult for someone to come forward and explain why it made sense to obstruct al Qaeda investigations. If you want context the initial CIA withholding took place just after the Millennium threat when the intelligence community was on full alert for possible attack. The later withholding took place during a time when "the system was blinking red."
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We have already explained various reasons why this occured.........not all of the reasons are reasons people like, but there it is.

If you want the EXACT reasons then I would suggest developing the ability to read minds and travel back in time.......good luck with that ;)

thatsmystory said:
Former Senator Graham mentioned the prospect of Saudi involvement and US corruption. Evidently you would have the public believe there is no possibility of corruption in the US intelligence community.
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There is always possibility of corruption.....just as there is possibility of arrogance, ignorance, pettyness, and incompetence.

The one possibility that I highly doubt is that of truthers making good arguments....so far you aren't disappointing ;)
 
thatsmystory said:
Authoritarianism at its finest. This is the sort of commentary I would expect some Soviet citizens to make about the KGB during the Cold War.

If this is all hindsight and ignorant Internet posting then it shouldn't be difficult for someone to come forward and explain why it made sense to obstruct al Qaeda investigations. If you want context the initial CIA withholding took place just after the Millennium threat when the intelligence community was on full alert for possible attack. The later withholding took place during a time when "the system was blinking red."

Former Senator Graham mentioned the prospect of Saudi involvement and US corruption. Evidently you would have the public believe there is no possibility of corruption in the US intelligence community.
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Once again, you prove you have no idea what you are talking about.

Do the job yourself, then try to preach to those of us who actually know what we are talking about. Until then, you have absolutely nothing of use to add to the discussion.
 
Sabrina said:
Once again, you prove you have no idea what you are talking about.

Do the job yourself, then try to preach to those of us who actually know what we are talking about. Until then, you have absolutely nothing of use to add to the discussion.
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Nonsense.

Here is an insider's account. He doesn't seem to think the CIA explanation makes any sense:

While they were investigating the attack on the USS Cole in November 2000, Soufan's team learned that an al Qaeda operative had met with other terrorists in Asia and received a large sum of money. Soufan says he made three formal requests through the FBI to the CIA to see if anything was known about what this operative was up to. Each time, he says, the CIA indicated that it did not know anything.

But, Soufan says he later learned the CIA knew - eight months before 9/11 - that this same operative had met in Malaysia with two terrorism suspects who would later hijack the plane that crashed into the Pentagon. And the CIA also knew that those two suspects were heading to the U.S.

"The agency knew that these al Qaeda operatives in Southeast Asia flew to America or they have visas to come to the United States, and somebody decided, 'Let's not share the information,'" Soufan said.

"And if it had been shared with you, what then?" Logan asked.

"I try not to think about that. I try not to think about, about what could have happened. Maybe, maybe thousands of American lives will be spared, maybe," Soufan said.

The Interrogator
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What was the point of the urgent CIA briefing to Rice on 7/10/01 in which Rich Blee, the chief of Alec Station, warned that "they're coming here." They were already here and the CIA knew it.
 
thatsmystory said:
Nonsense.

Here is an insider's account. He doesn't seem to think the CIA explanation makes any sense:



What was the point of the urgent CIA briefing to Rice on 7/10/01 in which Rich Blee, the chief of Alec Station, warned that "they're coming here." They were already here and the CIA knew it.
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You could be agent "googled it". The OP is about nonsense, paranoid nuts, press for truth.
 
It doesn't matter whether or not anyone believes people with actual knowledge when they post here. It doesn't even matter whether anyone who posts here has actual knowledge or not.

What matters is that anyone in a legitimate position to act upon accusations of malfeasance within the intelligence community, of the type made in the OP and during the thread, will either be a person with actual knowledge or will have the sense and ability to consult with people who have actual knowledge.

Which is exactly why these accusations mean nothing, avail nothing, and have already come to nothing long since.

Wishing away expertise, as though it disappears as soon as anyone claims not to believe in it, is a conspiracy theorist hallmark. From the frequent use they make of it, they appear to believe that feckless denial of expertise is a potent weapon against the establishment. And yet, the actual expertise that exists in the world continues to stand between them and everything they claim to want, and has not moved an angstrom from all their noisy efforts.

Respectfully,
Myriad
 
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So where was all this supposed intelligence community "expertise" on 9/11? Taking the day off? Why should anyone believe in a canard like "intelligence community expertise" when that expertise was so utterly impotent in thwarting the 9/11 attacks?

Because you pro-state trolls say so? Ha, ha, ha, fat chance!
 
SpringHallConvert said:
So where was all this supposed intelligence community "expertise" on 9/11? Taking the day off? Why should anyone believe in a canard like "intelligence community expertise" when that expertise was so utterly impotent in thwarting the 9/11 attacks?

Because you pro-state trolls say so? Ha, ha, ha, fat chance!
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The human element, number one cause of airplane disasters, security breaches and lapses in safety. The human element. Yet another thing you have zero knowledge in.
 
SpringHallConvert said:
www.link.com?

www.proof.com?

www.picsoritdidnthappen.com?
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... , no substance to contribute to the failed OP, so we get SPAM. New tactic, how is that working out?

Why have you fail to get a security clearance? How many reasons? How many intelligence briefings have you sat through? How many intelligence officers have you known?

If she is not an expert, she has the knowledge and superior research compared to your failed efforts, zero evidence in support of the nonsense you present. Where is your evidence, and claims? You have zero experience with the CIA, or any intel agencies, and it shows, or you would not be spreading lies from 911 truth.

She is an expert. You lost this one, but next time try reality based research. Liked the SPAM, next time try some evidence for you claims.
 
@ SpringHallConvert
Nice to see you back. Care to actually discuss the below or are you going to trot off for another week and then come back into the thread and seagullify it with your deposits of wisdom.
You speak in platitudes and cliches. Sloganeering for Truth.

Foolmewunz said:
Feeding off of Mudcat's comment, if you remove the bias in your question and word it the way I've edited it, I think you'd find a number of members here would possibly concur - to varying degrees. As mentioned above, just because we don't believe in particle beam weapons, hush-a-boom explosives, thermite/thermate/thermute, missiles masquerading as pigeons or angels masquerading as pterodactyls does not mean that we automatically believe every utterance of every government official.

I'm sure this is very inconvenient for you because in Truther World if you find one inconsistency you are required to believe the whole fable, but that's just not the way it works.

Personally, I have no difficulty believing that the events leading up to 9/11 represent a massive failing of US intelligence gathering (and/or "intelligence responding to"). Nor do I have any difficulty believing that various folk - from the Executive level on down, have obfuscated to make sure that that particular cluster-fornication is not completely and openly discussed.

Does that mean Dick Cheney personally handed money to a guy at the Abu Nidhal bakery in Sheboygan? Or that Dubya plotted with the Saudi royal family to let their citizens attack our country and kill our people so his buddies could get more oil exploration deals. No, not unless proved.



Well, as Edmund Gwenn commented in Miracle on 34th Street (when he was asked in court for his residence), "That's what we're here to determine." I'm all for investigative journalism and dot connecting. Much of the material is very tenuous but there are little nuggets of truth that come out and other and more competent researchers may be able to put them altogether to finally get the whole story. History is like that. We were still putting together the accurate details of Operation Overlord fifty years after it happened, and it was incredibly well documented and amongst the allies, fairly "open".



Your need to pigeonhole people into Us versus Them is noted. It is misguided and inappropriate, but many people think like that - the world's a Marvel cartoon and the bad guys are on one side with the good guys on another. Unfortunately, the real world doesn't work like that.
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Foolmewunz said:
SpringHallConvert, I note that you responded to Mudcat, but not to me. Why? Are you unable to have a nuanced discussion? This is all too common in Truther-Folk. They just want to be able to label and pigeonhole. If someone tries to bring any shades of gray into the discussion or burst their little bias bubble, they ignore it and go looking for someone else they can squeeze into a preconceived mold.

As I said, it doesn't work like that in the real world. We had an era here (up to the 2008 election) when every truther who came along wasted post after post attacking Bush and Cheney, totally unaware that the majority of the "debunking community" had no love for those two gentlemen and did not support them or their policies. (I can recall one regular who absolutely stunned them when it turned out he had more street cred and protester notches on his gunbelt than the whole bunch of them. Gee, whatever happened to that guy. Lived somewhere in Asia, I believe. Real attractive, too.)

It is possible to be against war, racism, poverty and injustice yet still not see ghosts under the bed. If someone brings me proof of the ghosts under the bed? Well, I'm your boy... but don't let the beams cross! But absent that proof or any actual evidence that someone in the government sat in and planned the events of that day I'm still in the LIHTI (Let It Happen Through Incompetence) camp.
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thatsmystory said:
Nonsense.

Here is an insider's account. He doesn't seem to think the CIA explanation makes any sense:
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You are talking to at least two people with inside experience.

What was the point of the urgent CIA briefing to Rice on 7/10/01 in which Rich Blee, the chief of Alec Station, warned that "they're coming here." They were already here and the CIA knew it.
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Unsupported assertion. In fact, one that directly contradicts your own evidence, unless Rich Blee is somehow separate from "the CIA".
 
SHC missed the obvious implication: Low level employees know the basics how things work. Nothing more is required. He in contrast does not.
 
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