Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[This is The End]

They will probably have evidence not presented at the bond hearing, but in no way are they allowed to lie about anything in any sworn testimony or statement. The judge - not the witness - is the one that determines if a specific line of testimony is relevant to the particular hearing or procedure. If Det. Gilbreath lied about the presence or absence of evidence under oath, the prosecutor would be required to inform the defense or she would be facing a Brady violation.

Thank you for answering my question. I was wondering if there were any Bill Clinton type tricks that could have been pulled to not reveal evidence that was not yet public.

 

[Dancing David]

I am also curious, though I am even more curious to know why, if they had stronger evidence than they have shown, they would allow Zimmerman to get out on such a low bond (considering the charge) rather than revealing what more they had.

That is not what I would call a low bond, and he seems to be low flight risk. I don't know why they would want a higher bond.

ETA: I think the major factor is that GZ did not flee prior to his arrest , but I am just guessing

 

[Dancing David]

And I can't think of any particular reason why someone would arm himself to take a drive to the store.

Some people carry all the time, my friend does, in Idaho.

 

[LTC8K6]

That is not what I would call a low bond, and he seems to be low flight risk. I don't know why they would want a higher bond.

IIRC, the Martin attorneys were very mad at the low bail as was the prosecution.

I think GZ has family in Peru.

 

[Dancing David]

They will probably have evidence not presented at the bond hearing, but in no way are they allowed to lie about anything in any sworn testimony or statement. The judge - not the witness - is the one that determines if a specific line of testimony is relevant to the particular hearing or procedure. If Det. Gilbreath lied about the presence or absence of evidence under oath, the prosecutor would be required to inform the defense or she would be facing a Brady violation.

This is very true, so I would guess, Det. Gilbreath answered all the question truthfully to the best of his knowledge.

Now what evidence was gathered since the time is question that was specifically discussed, that Gilbreath was not aware of....

 

[WildCat]

Guns are used to kill people. I wonder why Zimmerman can't explain why he decided to bring a gun with him to go to the store?



Do you have another source other than this one?





Awesome. Also from the above article:





And you assume the screwdriver was a burglary tool and the jewelry was stolen, without evidence of either.

Just like I assume Zimmerman armed himself, and chased down and confronted Martin with the same amount of evidence you used for your assumption.



And you know that how?



When did that start? Last time I checked we were assuming Martin's screwdriver was a burglary tool and he had stolen jewelry in his possession. Has new evidence surfaced proving either of those allegations?



Why would I bother?

Right johnny, I bet he just happened to find the jewlery and screwdriver on his way to school and was just about to turn it in so the rightful owner could claim it.

 

[WildCat]

Why is there a RIP Trey Twitter Handle, and the date of Feb. 21st on the same page?

Something doesn't add up there.....

That's his brother's handle, he changed it after he was killed. Just like if you change your handle here all your prior posts bear your new name, not your old one.

 

[sgtbaker]

That is not what I would call a low bond, and he seems to be low flight risk. I don't know why they would want a higher bond.

ETA: I think the major factor is that GZ did not flee prior to his arrest , but I am just guessing

I agree that his behavior leading up to his arrest has more to do with why his bond was so low.

Did the prosecution even have to show the evidence to the judge? From the bond hearing, it was pretty clear that the defense was not given all the evidence, was the judge?

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Did you forget the last time you asked me about that or did I miss where you debunked it?

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...-martin-case-zimmerman-had-run-in-with-police

Hmm. I didn't remember the entire exchange.
It seems like MSNBC wants it both ways. In my link, they claim to have the court documents. So, IDK. He either attended an alcohol or anger class. It was at a bar, but involved pushing, so either makes sense to me.

 

[Dan O.]

This is very true, so I would guess, Det. Gilbreath answered all the question truthfully to the best of his knowledge.

Now what evidence was gathered since the time is question that was specifically discussed, that Gilbreath was not aware of....

Gilbreath appeared to have kept himself out of the loop on a couple of issues. I saw that O'Mara did the same thing when it came to the family financial situation. How difficult would it have been to find out if there was equity in the home or to lookup the contributions George had received from his web site?

 

[TheL8Elvis]

This is very true, so I would guess, Det. Gilbreath answered all the question truthfully to the best of his knowledge.

Now what evidence was gathered since the time is question that was specifically discussed, that Gilbreath was not aware of....

Gilbreath appeared to have kept himself out of the loop on a couple of issues. I saw that O'Mara did the same thing when it came to the family financial situation. How difficult would it have been to find out if there was equity in the home or to lookup the contributions George had received from his web site?

Gilbreath was one of the lead investigator and signed the affidavit of probable cause. How is it it possible the he isn't at least minimally conversant with all the major aspects and evidence of such a high profile case ?

 

[TheL8Elvis]

George Zimmerman bond hearing: 5 new things we learned

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justic...in-Zimmerman-s-story-raised-police-suspicions

But during his turn on the stand, Gilbreath drew attention to Zimmerman's assertion to police that Trayvon was at one point running around Zimmerman's car. Gilbreath questioned why that should make Zimmerman fear for his life. “[Zimmerman] was so scared that he still got out of the car and chased Mr. Martin,” Gilbreath said skeptically.

Someone have a timestamp for the video or see this in the transcript ? (http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.02.html)

I'm curious - we've still not really seen more than snippets of the entire story GZ told police.

I'd like to know if the story Tracy Martin was told - that TM went first to talk to GZ while he was in his car, then GZ followed him, indeed originated with GZ, or was perhaps misunderstood in the re-telling.

I think 2 separate encounters, one at the car, then one on the sidewalk cast a bit of a different light on events.

ETA:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/03/us-usa-florida-shooting-trayvon-idUSBRE8320UK20120403
but here is how Martin recalls what Serino said: "He told me Zimmerman's story was that Zimmerman was of course following him and that Trayvon approached his vehicle, walked up to the car and asked Zimmerman, ‘Why are your following me?' Zimmerman then rolls his car windows down, tells Trayvon ‘I'm not following you.' He rolls his car windows up.
"Trayvon walks off. Zimmerman said he started running between the buildings. Zimmerman gets out of his car. He comes around the building. Trayvon is hiding behind the building, waiting on him. Trayvon approaches him and says, ‘What's your problem, homes?' Zimmerman says ‘I don't have a problem.'
"Zimmerman starts to reach into his pocket to get his cellphone, and at that point Trayvon attacked him. He says Trayvon hits him. He falls on the ground. Trayvon jumps on top of him, takes his left hand and covers Zimmerman's mouth and tells him to shut the F up and continues to pound on him.
"At that point Zimmerman is able to unholster his weapon and fire a shot, striking Trayvon in the chest. Trayvon falls on his back and says, 'You got me.'" The Martin family has been telling their story as part of a campaign to have Zimmerman arrested. He himself has kept quiet.

 

[epepke]

I don't see where it means a lot but why does a teenage boy have a screwdriver at school other than nefarious purposes. Not many reasons I can think of.

Astonishing.

I rode my bicycle to school, and I was never without at least a screwdriver, crescent wrench, and patching kit, and I usually had a Swiss Army knife as well. It was famous enough that it had a name, and I used it to fix things.

Now, I realize that the world has become brave and new and post-racist, and permitting tool use amongst Negroes would probably be considered as heinous as teaching American Standard English or permitting them to reach age 20 without diabetes, but that's no reason to pith oneself.

 

[Dan O.]

Gilbreath was one of the lead investigator and signed the affidavit of probable cause. How is it it possible the he isn't at least minimally conversant with all the major aspects and evidence of such a high profile case ?

He could have choosen not to become aware of some aspects of the case. He's been through this many times and would be well aware of how the procedures work and what would take place in the preliminary hearings. If there were aspects of the case that the prosecution decided that they would want to withhold from the defense for a time, it would be a simple matter of dividing the work load such that one investigator never dealt with that information. That investigator would then be available to answer truthfully in the hearing.

Is there some specific element of Detective Gilbreath's testimony you are concerned with?

 

[WildCat]

Astonishing.

I rode my bicycle to school, and I was never without at least a screwdriver,

Was it a very large flat-ended one, like this one?

Did you also carry jewelry "for a friend"?

 

[TheL8Elvis]

He could have choosen not to become aware of some aspects of the case. He's been through this many times and would be well aware of how the procedures work and what would take place in the preliminary hearings.

The consensus seemed to be that Gilbreath was ill prepared and surprised to be testifying at the hearing at all. At odds with your claim above.

ETA:
O'MARA: Did you bring any supporting documentation with you to the courtroom on his bond motion at all?
GILBREATH: No, I was not planning on testifying.

If there were aspects of the case that the prosecution decided that they would want to withhold from the defense for a time, it would be a simple matter of dividing the work load such that one investigator never dealt with that information. That investigator would then be available to answer truthfully in the hearing.

Since the prosecution has to turn all the evidence over to the defense anyway (as I understand it), him choosing to 'not be aware' of some aspects would be advantageous to the prosecution ... how ?

Is there some specific element of Detective Gilbreath's testimony you are concerned with?

No. I was doubting you and Dancing David claiming Gilbreath would be unaware of certain issues. While not impossible, it struck me as improbable. I can't imagine him saying 'wait, don't talk about this piece of evidence - i need to leave the room so I honestly claim to not know about it.' Or how to look at the big picture of a case when you are deliberately blinding yourself to pieces. Seems ludicrous.

 

[Dan O.]

Astonishing.

I rode my bicycle to school, and I was never without at least a screwdriver, crescent wrench, and patching kit, and I usually had a Swiss Army knife as well. It was famous enough that it had a name, and I used it to fix things.

I found a little multi-tool hammer/screwdriver while walking to school in the third or forth grade and carried that everywhere for many years until I had lost too many of the parts for it to be usefull. In Jr. High I was never without my boy scouts pocket knife later upgraded to Swiss army knife and my current pocket tool of choice the Cybertool. You never know when you will be called upon to repair a laptop in the field so it's best to be prepared.

 

[eeyore1954]

Astonishing.

I rode my bicycle to school, and I was never without at least a screwdriver, crescent wrench, and patching kit, and I usually had a Swiss Army knife as well. It was famous enough that it had a name, and I used it to fix things.

Now, I realize that the world has become brave and new and post-racist, and permitting tool use amongst Negroes would probably be considered as heinous as teaching American Standard English or permitting them to reach age 20 without diabetes, but that's no reason to pith oneself.

Did I say anywhere that it was suspicious because a "negroe" had a screwdriver? And of course I feel that all should have diabetes before reaching the age of majority. What in the world are you talking about?

I doubt if in most schools today a swiss army knife would be allowed in school.

In my life I never knew one kid at school with a screw driver. Of course I went to high school 40 years ago when kids would have been even more likely to ride to school.
I asked my son if anyone rides a bike to his school (7-12th grade) and he said no

 

[kedo1981]

This whole thing will hinge on whether Trayvon was the aggressor.
The state will have to prove GZ was, not TM.
GZ don’t have to prove anything, he doesn’t have prove he was in fear for his life.
The state has the burden of proving the opposite.
Is there any doubt the TM was kicking GZ’s ass?

 

[Dan O.]

When I was in high school, most of the kids I hung out with would have a slide action in a holster hanging from their belt. But the really cool kids carried revolvers!