Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[sgtbaker]

Did the photo being used by the media create a false impression, yes or no?



Perhaps you should read the entire conversation. No aspersions were being cast at the Martins, the poster that was a response to claimed they picked a photo that showed TM as being "well-kempt and good-looking" my inquiry was to determine why they didn't pick a newer one of him that showed him as being "well-kempt and good-looking." I know that when I was 17 my mother had photos of me at 17, and I hated having my photo taken, and we had to do all with film camera, not digital like we have today. I find it strange that they would not have had a more recent image that would have worked just as well. I'm not saying that they did it deliberately to fool people, I'm just curious as to why the older photo was used.

I have no idea how the Martin family takes and maintains their pictures so this is just more speculation. I can say that my mother had way more printed photos of me than I have of my children because most of my kids pictures are digital. It was only about a month ago that I finally bought a cheap photo printer, so until a month ago, the only recent pictures I had on hand were school pictures. The last year my son was in public school, 2010, I lost his school picture envelope. Then he went into a school for children with special needs and they don't have "picture day." The reason I bought a printer was so that I could take a picture of my son, print out an 8x10 and put it up on the wall with my daughters' pictures. Until last month, the most recent printed picture I had of my son was from 2009.

Were the pictures misleading? Absolutely! I remember one of the intial arguments against Zimmerman's claim was that there was no way that skinny little kid could possibly overpower big giant Zimmerman.

 

[PhantomWolf]

Maybe not but scared people certainly do. And just because a cop show says something, doesn't make it true. Not like they don't have an agenda in keeping the public controlled.

Perhaps I'm strange but I'm not sure what is particularly scary about a man in a truck stopped on the side of road talking on a phone, but then I'm strange and see people in concealing non-wet weather clothing walking about in the rain on dark cold nights looking at houses as suspicious when it's obviously the guys in the trucks talking on the phone who are the ones that I should be worried about.

And from another post but still about this case, maybe the picture of TM that media started flashing was the only one they found. It's a simple matter to find a yearbook picture online. Do you have any evidence the Martin's provided that pic instead of a more current one? Isn't it possible the media got it elsewhere?

I have no idea where the media got it, other have said the Martins gave it to the media, when I tried to find out I got jumped on and then told it was irrelevant to why TM died, so...

 

[triforcharity]

<useless drivel snipped>

As is often said in cop shows... innocent people don't run.

Yes, FROM THE POLICE! You're correct, most people whom run from the police, aren't innocent. However, Zimmerman was NOT the police, and didn't identify himself as anything with any kind of authority.

Use your brain Phantom, I know you can.

 

[Natural Born Skeptic]

Until last month, the most recent printed picture I had of my son was from 2009.

You sound very suspicious and manipulative.

 

[Dcdrac]

Perhaps I'm strange but I'm not sure what is particularly scary about a man in a truck stopped on the side of road talking on a phone, but then I'm strange and see people in concealing non-wet weather clothing walking about in the rain on dark cold nights looking at houses as suspicious when it's obviously the guys in the trucks talking on the phone who are the ones that I should be worried about.



I have no idea where the media got it, other have said the Martins gave it to the media, when I tried to find out I got jumped on and then told it was irrelevant to why TM died, so...

How do you know TM was looking at houses suspciously?

and what is a suspcious way of looking at a house?

The only solid fact is GZ did not report any criminal activity on TMs part

 

[KatieG]

The picture was from the family's PR rep. This isn't a disputed issue, they gave the picture to media and didn't tell anyone how old it was was. They also underreported TM's weight and massively over reported GZ's weight. Here's a link:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2012/03/30/national/a124959D75.DTL&tsp=1

You mean the media did these things, not the Martins?

 

[PhantomWolf]

About the NW thing? Funny, Frank Taafe, a friend of GZ's and a resident of that community, claims GZ was a an active member of their NW.

Alas, who to believe? Can't have it both ways.

Well I'm going from the early reports that claimed he wasn't in an offical NW and was a self appointed captain of the community NW. If there is strong evidence he actually was a member of an offical one then that's okay, I'll accept being corrected.

 

[Natural Born Skeptic]

How do you know TM was looking at houses suspciously?

and what is a suspcious way of looking at a house?

I'm also quite suspicious about what he thinks is suspicious! Evidently being in the rain without "proper rain clothing" is one of them.

 

[KatieG]

Perhaps I'm strange but I'm not sure what is particularly scary about a man in a truck stopped on the side of road talking on a phone, but then I'm strange and see people in concealing non-wet weather clothing walking about in the rain on dark cold nights looking at houses as suspicious when it's obviously the guys in the trucks talking on the phone who are the ones that I should be worried about.



I have no idea where the media got it, other have said the Martins gave it to the media, when I tried to find out I got jumped on and then told it was irrelevant to why TM died, so...

If it was that cold, why wouldn't someone be bundled up if they were walking around outside? It wasn't that it was that cold, it was raining. Most people cover their heads when walking in the rain. TM was a visitor there. After having seen the complex, it appears to me it's easy to get lost or lose your bearings if you're unfamiliar with the area. Looking around at houses should not be consider suspicious behaviour in and of itself. To think that way lies madness.

 

[LTC8K6]

You must live in a different part of America than I do. As far as I'm aware it's perfectly legal for people to take walks outside, even in hoodies! They even get to look at houses, or the stars or moon if they like. Now if they walk through peoples yards it might be a different story. Frankly I have not studied the maps like several people in this thread have, but I don' recall GZ's suspicion being because TM was in private yards but I may well be wrong about that, correct me if I am.

Am I remembering incorrectly? I thought Martin did not initially have his hood up? He pulled it up after he noticed Zimmerman watching him. I think the girlfriend says this.

Walking around in the rain without your hood up, then putting it up after Zimmerman begins to watch him.

Not that it makes a whole lot of difference, but that might be something that Zimmerman would think was odd.

He said this man was watching him, so he put his hoodie on.

 

[triforcharity]

Which part? Walking at night, walking when it's raining, wearing a hoodie - which of these is unusual?

Zimmerman was allegedly in the middle of a store run too, when he spotted Martin. Of course, Z had a car; Martin didn't and had to walk - so what's "not normal" about that?

It's obvious to me that Phantom has never lived in Florida.

That is almost a common occurrence in some parts of my city.

And WRT: cold day. I am showing that on Feb. 26th, the high was....69 deg. and the low was 53, and at about 7pm, is was about 62-63 deg. So, not much change, and a very light drizzle.

So, the fact that he only had on a hoodie as protection, is not surprising.

http://www.wunderground.com/history...tml?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

Cheers!

 

[commandlinegamer]

I'm also quite suspicious about what he thinks is suspicious! Evidently being in the rain without "proper rain clothing" is one of them.

Indeed. It's a modern tradition in the UK to go out (particularly in the wintertime) wearing as little as possible. Pictures of young women (and men) clubbers in skimpy dresses face down in the snow are not uncommon (Google is your friend here). But suspicious? I don't think so.

 

[triforcharity]

I don't think that less than one call a month from someone out specifically looking for possible crime boils down to "a whack job or is simply hyper sensitive seeing suspicion all over the place" do you?

Have you seen some of the things he called the police about?

A pot hole is one. (You don't call the cops here, you call the city public works)

Oh, and just out of curiosity, how many times have you called the police in the past year? Just the last year.

I've called them......1 time.

 

[Dcdrac]

I want to practice looking at hosues suspciosuly can anyone let me know the best ways of looking at houses suspciously?

 

[Natural Born Skeptic]

Am I remembering incorrectly? I thought Martin did not initially have his hood up? He pulled it up after he noticed Zimmerman watching him. I think the girlfriend says this.

Walking around in the rain without your hood up, then putting it up after Zimmerman begins to watch him.

Not that it makes a whole lot of difference, but that might be something that Zimmerman would think was odd.

I find PhantomWolf a little bit over the top on this so I'm just tweaking him a bit. It's entirely possible that TM was acting in some way that a person might have found it suspicious. But:
1. It's pure supposition.
2. I don't trust a guy who calls 911 an average of 7 times a year to be a very good judge about this.

 

[triforcharity]

I think instead of fiinding reasons to give a killer of an innocent an excuse we should be focusing on the issues it raises, a bad law and what type of people should be allowed to operate Neighbourhood watches.

ANd yes Zimmeran is a killer based on nothing but the suspcions he created for himself.

There is a whole thread on the SYG laws. It's in this section. I know there is alot of good information there.

Cheers!

 

[LTC8K6]

The girlfriend apparently says that Martin put his hoodie on after he noticed Zimmerman watching him.

That would mean Martin was walking around in the rain without the hood up, then put it up during the encounter.

I have read a few sources on this, and they all seem to agree that the girlfriend said this before telling Martin he should run.

I think we have all been wondering exactly why Zimmerman might have found Martin suspicious, and that could be a piece of that puzzle.

 

[PhantomWolf]

That is like saying we had better imprison them now just in case they will commit a crime at some point

Not at all. If someone is acting in a manner that makes you believe they might be considering a crime, ringing the police is perfectly legitimate. TM appears to have been acting in that manner, certainly from the contitions of the night, how he was dressed, and what GZ reported him doing in the 911 call I'd have seriously considered the same action.

After that I can certainly understand his actions, when TM ran I can fully understand GZ getting out and following to keep an eye on him. I think it was stupid, because he'd already noted to the Dispatcher that TM was carrying an unknown item and had been fiddling in his waistband. Had it be Jimmy Jones the notorious armed burgler rather than TM the story might just as easily have been "NW Captain shot dead after following suspected burgler."

What I don't accept is that claims that he chased TM, or hunted him down. There is no evidence for that, and the 911 call indicates that GZ lost sight of TM very quickly after TM ran and had no idea were he went, that is not consistant with him chasing him or hunting him down.

To me, the while case hinges on who put hands on the other first, If it was GZ, even if he grabbed TM out of frustration causing TM to attack him, he's guilty of Manslaughter. If TM attacked GZ first, even if he was scared or angry at being followed, then based on the witness statements, it was most likely self defence. The problem is that at this point in time we don't know who started it.

 

[triforcharity]

Although PhantomWolf does seem to think that someone walking in the rain with a hoodie on is very suspicious . I happen to love walking in the rain on occasion and also taking walks in the dark so I must be really suspicious and dangerous in his eyes.

Lol. The suspicious are EVERYWHERE in NYC, Chicago, LA, Orlando, Washington DC, Phoenix, omg EVERY major city on ANY rainy night.....

 

[sgtbaker]

You sound very suspicious and manipulative.

The sad thing is, it's more likely that my son would have actually been up to no good.