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So Will 2012 Be Just Another Year?

See you all in 2020! I would offer to bet UE that things will be more or less the same by then, but he wouldn't take it.
 
dafydd said:
That is merely your opinion. No evidence, and please do not tell me to watch that biased video again.
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To repeat a point I have made to you again and again, but you apparently can't quite grasp...

Yes, it is merely my opinion, and your opinion is merely yours. I don't know why you think there is such a huge problem with this. What makes you think I give a flying fart whether or not you - some random person on the internet whose opinion I don't happen to be interested in, refuses to believe it on the grounds that I can't provide scientific proof.

In short: if after not bothering to look at the evidence I supplied, you don't believe what I'm telling you, then that's your problem, not mine. I did not come here because I wanted to win the approval of people like you. There are actually other people taking part in this discussion who have something to say that is interesting and worth reading. All you are capable of contributing are the words "prove it" and "no evidence", which is of no interest to anybody but yourself. :(

In fact, your agenda would appear to be to fill this thread up with as much worthless babble as possible, just to make sure nobody else is able to have a decent discussion about the actual topic.
 
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UndercoverElephant said:
To repeat a point I have made to you again and again, but you apparently can't quite grasp...

Yes, it is merely my opinion, and your opinion is merely yours. I don't know why you think there is such a huge problem with this. What makes you think I give a flying fart whether or not you - some random person on the internet whose opinion I don't happen to be interested in, refuses to believe it on the grounds that I can't provide scientific proof.

In short: if you don't believe what I'm telling you then that's your problem, not mine. I did not come here because I wanted to win the approval of people like you. There are actually other people taking part in this discussion who have something to say that is interesting and worth reading. All you are capable of contributing are the words "prove it" and "no evidence", which is of no interest to anybody but yourself. :(
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You are the one making the claim. You seem to find that hard to grasp. You are just a random doom monger on the internet. Nothing new here.
 
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UndercoverElephant said:
There are potentially two different classes of purported "paranormal" phenomena. The first would be those that involve a direct breach of the laws of physics (e.g. a truly "free" energy or perpetual-motion machine). The second would be those that involve a serious breach of probability - something happening which is so improbable that the person it happens to interprets it as paranormal but which does not actually break any of the laws of physics. This second category would be possible under some interpretations of QM, but not possible under some others. The most controversial of them all would be MWI, because if MWI is true then there are guaranteed to be some timelines where whole sequences of unbelievably-improbable events happen, and yet it is still all down to pure randomness and not "paranormal" causality.

What I'm trying to say is this: it is physically possible for some sorts of paranormal phenomena to exist without breaking the laws of physics. However, while these phenomena can "affect the condition of the resources on earth", they can't affect them in ways which would lead to a physically-inconsistent state of reality. And that means that even if they exist they can't "save" us from our energy crisis, because at the end of the day the only thing that could save us would be the truly free energy or the perpetual motion machine, and these are prohibited by the plain old laws of newtonian energy conservation.

So to answer Limbo's question, I don't believe the first category of paranormal phenomena exist. Neither science nor personal experience leads me to believe that there exist any physics-busting paranormal phenomena of the sort required to save industrialised civilisation from a resource crisis. But the non-physics-busting sort of paranormal phenomena could still exist, and they could alter the situation by bringing about a change in people's perception of what is happening and influencing their response to it.

I personally wish that this sort of intervention wasn't necessary. I wish that the human race could get its act together, figure out what is happening, and collectively act to change things. Unfortunately this requires a level of optimism and faith in human nature that I can't quite manage. I suspect that things need to get quite a lot worse before most people will wake up to the reality of the situation modern civilisation finds itself in.
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Utter nonsense.

You should apologize.
 
Paul Gilding: The Earth is full: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZT6YpCsapg&feature=relmfu

Paul Gilding is a scientist. Strangely enough he's saying exactly what Nafeez Ahmed says: we need to look at the whole system, and only then can we comprehend the true scale of what is coming. Talk recorded this year.

Anyone who dismisses this as "woo" is a first class idiot.
 
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UndercoverElephant said:
Paul Gilding: The Earth is full: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZT6YpCsapg&feature=relmfu

Paul Gilding is a scientist. Strangely enough he's saying exactly what Nafeez Ahmed says: we need to look at the whole system, and only then can we comprehend the true scale of what is coming. Talk recorded this year.

Anyone who dismisses this as "woo" is a first class idiot.
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Not woo, doom mongering. This is pointless. See you in 2020. Goodbye and enjoy wallowing in your pit of despair. I'll just get on with doing the best I can for me and mine. I won't be telling my grandson that we are heading down the toilet.
 
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UndercoverElephant said:
Paul Gilding: The Earth is full: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZT6YpCsapg&feature=relmfu

Paul Gilding is a scientist. Strangely enough he's saying exactly what Nafeez Ahmed says: we need to look at the whole system, and only then can we comprehend the true scale of what is coming. Talk recorded this year.

Anyone who dismisses this as "woo" is a first class idiot.
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Blablabha, I love how the scientist and economics you chooses re the ones correct. Not very biased are we?


Anywho good luck with the doom and gloom buddy.
 
Johny2x4 said:
Blablabha, I love how the scientist and economics you chooses re the ones correct.
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Is this supposed to be an example of critical thinking?
Is it supposed to be an example of examining the scientific evidence before making your mind up?

Or is it an example or stubbornly refusing either to think critically or gather evidence so you don't have to bother changing your mind about anything?

As I said, anybody who dismisses this (and you didn't call it "woo", but you did dismiss it out of hand - you already "knew" it wasn't worth watching without watching it) is a first class idiot. They are an idiot because (a) this is based on science, not politics or religion and (b) it is, as explained in the video, likely to mean that most of what you currently believe about the future is wrong.

You are behaving exactly like the archetypal ostrich (with added nastiness), and yet you pride yourself on your capacity to think freely and make your decisions based on evidence! :D
 
dafydd said:
Not woo, doom mongering.
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No dafydd, it's.............*********SCIENCE*********.

This is pointless.
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YOU are pointless.

See you in 2020. Goodbye and enjoy wallowing in your pit of despair. I'll just get on with doing the best I can for me and mine. I won't be telling my grandson that we are heading down the toilet.
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Thank God for small mercies. Bye then.
 
UndercoverElephant said:
Is this supposed to be an example of critical thinking?
Is it supposed to be an example of examining the scientific evidence before making your mind up?

Or is it an example or stubbornly refusing either to think critically or gather evidence so you don't have to bother changing your mind about anything?

As I said, anybody who dismisses this (and you didn't call it "woo", but you did dismiss it out of hand - you already "knew" it wasn't worth watching without watching it) is a first class idiot. They are an idiot because (a) this is based on science, not politics or religion and (b) it is, as explained in the video, likely to mean that most of what you currently believe about the future is wrong.

You are behaving exactly like the archetypal ostrich (with added nastiness), and yet you pride yourself on your capacity to think freely and make your decisions based on evidence! :D
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Irony, thy name is UE.
 
Johny2x4 said:
Irony, thy name is UE.
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Do you think you can post a witty one liner and fool all the people reading this that you actually "won" this exchange?

Dafydd and yourself have demanded over and over again that I "prove" what I'm saying.

So I post a short video where a scientist explains, using science, why what I'm saying is true.

The response from the pair of you has been:

(a) not watching it and (b) dismissing it because the scientist in question happened to agree with me.

I mean....the level stupidity being displayed here is mind-boggling. You've demanded evidence, I provided scientific evidence, and you've dismissed it on the grounds that since it backs up my claims, it must be wrong!

Then, to top it all off, you accuse ME of "irony".

Meanwhile, the rest of the people on this board are either ignoring this thread completely, or for some reason don't feel compelled to intervene and explain to you how stupid your behaviour is, which doesn't say much for them either.
 
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Do you really want to know why people ignore this thread? Cause you´re plum loco. And a youtube video is not evidence of ANYTHING.

It´s on the same level as "Alex Jones" evidence. Listen cupcake, bing independent is not a automatically "is right" card as much as you want to believe it.

I love how you are so quick to rush to insults. Methinks you are not really that sure of your beliefs ;)
 
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Johny2x4 said:
Do you really want to know why people ignore this thread? Cause you´re plum loco.

And your evidence is on the same level as "Alex Jones" evidence. Listen cupcake, bing independent is not a automatically "is right" card as much as you want to believe it.

I love how you are so quick to rush to insults. Methinks you are not really that sure oif your beliefs ;)
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http://bloggingblue.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Ostrich-man-head-in-sand.gif
do not hotlink images
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: kmortis
 
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UE - We mean different things by 'science', you are wrong, and your delusions do not concern me.

If everything is about to collapse, that is ok.

I only hope that cats outlast people.
 
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