Santorum gone too far

[BenBurch]

i'm sitting here reading about the dot allowing mexican trucks across our borders. I'm reading about unemployment remaining high as the economy improves. I keep reading about homes being foreclosed. I keep reading about some genuinely troubling developments overseas.

And santorum is freaking out over how people get their nut off.

Sad.

amen.

 

[carlitos]

Obama is doing the same.

People they are prosecuting are people I don't care much for, but there should be no prosecutions at all.

I have a friend who served federal time for a gay film he made back in the 80s, so I am sensitive to this issue.

My understanding is that they are not nearly as vigorously prosecuting as Ashcroft did. There were a handful of high profile cases under Ashcroft. If you have stats or evidence of the number of prosecutions under the different administrations, I'd be interested in seeing them.

I have the same impression on the Obama approach to pot law enforcement. Tommy Chong served federal time for selling bongs under Ashcroft. Obviously the right approach would be to fix the laws, and not selectively enforce them, but that's probably too much to wish for.

 

[carlitos]

I'm sitting here reading about the DOT allowing Mexican trucks across our borders. I'm reading about unemployment remaining high as the economy improves. I keep reading about homes being foreclosed. I keep reading about some genuinely troubling developments overseas.

And Santorum is freaking out over how people get their nut off.

Sad.

Issuing a policy statement in January, just like every other Republican candidate ≠ "freaking out."

 

[BenBurch]

My understanding is that they are not nearly as vigorously prosecuting as Ashcroft did. ...

Chong was not prosecuted under the obscenity laws.

I have sent a query to two of my journalist friends to see if there is a breakdown by year or a timeline of prosecutions.

However, the correct total number of such prosecutions SHOULD always be zero.

 

[BenBurch]

As an aside, I find it funny (and sad in a tragic way) that many of the same people accusing Evil Liberals of censorship because they are exercising their first amendment rights are the same people who think that it is OK to jail a man and take all of his assets if he dares to produce images, words, or videos that they find obscene.

 

[Travis]

Well if conservatives were to stop trying to regulate sex lives they'd have to confine themselves to only trying to run government. And we all know they have no clue how to do that.






How's that for being partisan?

 

[Arcade22]

The first problem I have in such discussion is what exactly is the definition of "porn"? Seems to me how that word is defined and the material to be included in the definition is a rather important matter. Some might define the term far more narrowly than others.

Pretty sure professional pornography, amateur porn, suggestive pictures, erotic stories and drawn stuff all have the same corrupting influence on Christian society and the nuclear family...

 

[Ladewig]

Issuing a policy statement in January, just like every other Republican candidate ≠ "freaking out."

Saying that "America is suffering a pandemic of harm from pornography" and " Addiction to pornography is now common for adults and even for some children" strikes me as freaking out.

 

[eeyore1954]

Issuing a policy statement in January, just like every other Republican candidate ≠ "freaking out."

Apparently it does here to some if it is Santorum . I doubt if his platform on pornography is much different than most other politicians in either party except for the claim that President Obama is not prosecuting.

 

[Ladewig]

Apparently it does here to some if it is Santorum . I doubt if his platform on pornography is much different than most other politicians in either party except for the claim that President Obama is not prosecuting.

Yet Mr. Santorum is very notably different from the other candidates: see post #211.

I still maintain that Mr. Santorum's assertions meet the qualification of freaking out.




ETA: rewrote some stuff.

 

[carlitos]

Chong was not prosecuted under the obscenity laws.

Thanks, but ... Hmm. That was a bit of a non sequitur on my part. My understanding is that the Obama admninistration is similarly lax on pot law enforcement as they are on pornography. Sorry for leaving you on the station when my train of thought did its own thing.

I have sent a query to two of my journalist friends to see if there is a breakdown by year or a timeline of prosecutions.

Cool. Please update if you hear anything.

However, the correct total number of such prosecutions SHOULD always be zero.

I agree.

I doubt if his platform on pornography is much different than most other politicians

I posted the other Republican nominees saying essentially the same thing. Whomever started this meme excised Santorum's remarks from a press release by some morality group. It's completely disingenuous and obviously, unlike the online stories, it has nothing to do with online pornography. Gingrich and Romney said the same thing, and I bet if you pressed Obama, he'd hedge to the point where you couldn't tell the difference. But whatever, check your skepticism at the door; it's the politics forum.

 

[Corsair 115]

I'm sitting here reading about the DOT allowing Mexican trucks across our borders.

They already were allowed to do so. But only to drop off goods within a certain distance of the border. They were not allowed to drive all the way to the final destination within the U.S. to drop off the goods.

The right of Mexican trucks to deliver goods directly to the final U.S. destination was something that was a part of NAFTA. But the U.S. dragged its feet on implementing this provision. So much so, in fact, that Mexico lodged a protest with the dispute resolution panel that is a part of NAFTA, a case which it eventually won.

Canadian trucks have been allowed to deliver into the U.S., with American trucks having the reciprocal right to deliver into Canada, since the early 1980s, if I recall correctly. (What is prohibited is cabotage, which is when a foreign truck picks up goods at one domestic location and delivers it to another domestic location.)

 

[Caper]

What was the point of that entire little molestation tangent? Even if it was true it has nothing to do with the industry.

Sure it does. That was my point. I watch porn. I watched a lot of Jenna Jameson. Jenna Jameson was gang raped when she was 16.... I think it may have had something to do with her getting into porn. I am sure a lot of porn actresses came to the business in a similar manner. I didn't say it should be banned. My own point is I often wonder if I'm helping to exploit alot of women that are doing this. This was an article in my local paper this past weekend. I don't care if it has a religious angle to it, I think there is a point.

 

[BobTheDonkey]

Sure it does. That was my point. I watch porn. I watched a lot of Jenna Jameson. Jenna Jameson was gang raped when she was 16.... I think it may have had something to do with her getting into porn. I am sure a lot of porn actresses came to the business in a similar manner. I didn't say it should be banned. My own point is I often wonder if I'm helping to exploit alot of women that are doing this. This was an article in my local paper this past weekend. I don't care if it has a religious angle to it, I think there is a point.

Based on one data point? I know there's a fallacy for this..what was it again? Anecdotal evidence? Or maybe Confirmation Bias? Whichever it is...the point is that plenty of people have been gang-raped at 16 and they didn't become porn stars. Plenty of porn stars were never gang-raped at 16 (or any other age). Sorry, but your "data" doesn't even exist...let alone fly.

 

[cwalner]

Sure it does. That was my point. I watch porn. I watched a lot of Jenna Jameson. Jenna Jameson was gang raped when she was 16.... I think it may have had something to do with her getting into porn. I am sure a lot of porn actresses came to the business in a similar manner. I didn't say it should be banned. My own point is I often wonder if I'm helping to exploit alot of women that are doing this. This was an article in my local paper this past weekend. I don't care if it has a religious angle to it, I think there is a point.

Actually, the article you listed says exactly the opposite of your original point. The subject of that article recruited at malls because that is where normal everyday young girls hang out. The issues they had that he talked about came about after they did porn as a result of our schizophrenic attitudes regarding porn and sex*, not from exploitation of the performers.

* We want to consume it but have archaic moralistic attitudes towards the providers.

 

[Caper]

Based on one data point? I know there's a fallacy for this..what was it again? Anecdotal evidence? Or maybe Confirmation Bias? Whichever it is...the point is that plenty of people have been gang-raped at 16 and they didn't become porn stars. Plenty of porn stars were never gang-raped at 16 (or any other age). Sorry, but your "data" doesn't even exist...let alone fly.

Did I really make that claim? Did I really claim anywhere in my comment that every girl gang rapped at 16 is destined to become a porn star? Did I really say that... I don't think I did... But I will argue that if girl A went to Harvard and girl B went into Porn and one of them was gang raped while the other grew up in a loving supporting family.... I am guessing the girl that was gang raped never ended up in Harvard.

 

[Caper]

Actually, the article you listed says exactly the opposite of your original point. The subject of that article recruited at malls because that is where normal everyday young girls hang out. The issues they had that he talked about came about after they did porn as a result of our schizophrenic attitudes regarding porn and sex*, not from exploitation of the performers.

* We want to consume it but have archaic moralistic attitudes towards the providers.

No it didn't. Because I never made the point that all females were molested or raped before they went into porn. Not once did I say that. Of course.....this being a skeptics site... I would expect that I wouldn't have to spell that out for you. But apparently I do.

 

[BobTheDonkey]

Did I really make that claim? Did I really claim anywhere in my comment that every girl gang rapped at 16 is destined to become a porn star? Did I really say that... I don't think I did... But I will argue that if girl A went to Harvard and girl B went into Porn and one of them was gang raped while the other grew up in a loving supporting family.... I am guessing the girl that was gang raped never ended up in Harvard.

*sigh*

Do you have any data, at all, to support your position (which is what my previous post was pointing out, btw. Nowhere did I accuse you of assuming that all 16yo girls who were gang-raped are in porn. I merely stated that your single anecdotal point doesn't come close to a solid piece of data one way or the other)?

 

[IDB87]

The unapologetic social conservative, currently in second place behind Mitt Romney for the GOP nomination, has promised to crack down on the distribution of pornography if elected.

Anyone else envisioning an underground porn railroad?

 

[cwalner]

No it didn't. Because I never made the point that all females were molested or raped before they went into porn. Not once did I say that. Of course.....this being a skeptics site... I would expect that I wouldn't have to spell that out for you. But apparently I do.

Nobody ever claimed that you said all, but you did claim a pattern that you have yet to provide evidence for (beyond a single anecdote, which is not evidence).

Jenna Jameson was gang raped when she was 16.... I think it may have had something to do with her getting into porn. I am sure a lot of porn actresses came to the business in a similar manner.