• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Merged General Holocaust denial discussion thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
And I see it took you barely a day to go from "I'm just looking for evidence and documents about the gas chambers" and "Himmler? Who's that? He gave a speech, you say? Was it in English?" to "Revisionists are being attacked and insulted because they dare to question the nonexistent evidence for the Holy Truth of the Holocaust!" and linking to Faurisson's blog.
 
Obvious denier ploy is obvious. And why the nazis would record their crimes on photographies or films is apparently a hard question to answer.
 
Last edited:
the people who operated gas chambers were impossible to find. Nobody had published anything in which it was claimed that he worked in a gassing institution for human beings.
Try again: http://books.google.com/books?id=Ip...wAA#v=onepage&q=we wept without tears&f=false

http://books.google.com/books/about/Eyewitness_Auschwitz.html?id=ENAPlezFF_AC or http://www.archive.org/details/eyewitnessauschw00ml

Your remarks are all very common and ordinary to those of us who are familiar with denial, and so is your strategy. That is why - and of course you know this - your points are greeted as the old gambits they are.
 
Anti-semitic Troll is Anti-Semitic....



To deny the Holocaust is to be as dumb as box of hammers....... Seriously, there are Klansmen who think you are barking up the wrong tree.
 
Wait? The Jewish ghetto have their own police? Bank? Currency? Post office? All supported by the Third Reich?
Yes, Jewish police force, in Lodz called the Ordnungsdienst (OD, or Order Service), which was established in the ghetto on 1 March 1940 at the direction of the city of Lodz's police chief, who operated under the command of the German occupiers. The Jewish police force was unarmed and helped the Germans keep order in the ghetto as well as being used to help in roundups and deportations of the ghetto's inmates - at such times the Order Service operated under Gestapo orders. An order of the Lodz police in April 1940 required that the Jewish police be responsible for the "surveillance of the ghetto's enclosure," with the stipulation that breaches would result in punishment for the "responsible leader of the Jewish Order Service."

The post office in Lodz ghetto was more or less similar - mail service regulated by the German Post Office in Lodz. Service was subject to German control, and it was often totally disrupted. Food parcels sent to ghetto inmates were intercepted beginning in June 1940; mailing of goods from the ghetto was prohibited (except for old clothing). Outgoing mail was censored.

Of course, these matters are well known and not only don't challenge the evidence for German mass extermination actions but are part and parcel of such actions, as the Germans required the Order Service in particular to play a part in these actions.

The best source, IMHO, for Lodz institutions mentioned by this denier is Isaiah Trunk, Lodz Ghetto: A History. Trunk's book reproduces many documents of the Nazis and the ghetto's Jewish Council. Another good secondary book on Lodz is Gordon Horwitz's Gettostadt: Lodz and the Making of a Nazi City. This denier will not read Trunk's work, of course, or Horwitz's, being too busy with recycling dishonest materials he's found on the Web and pretends to be surprised by.
 
Last edited:
So after a vigorous five second search of the internet I locate Himmler's recording and inform SnakeTongue....who unfortunately doesn't know who Himmler is.

Here it is....( It seems you haven't even looked at the internet either)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a_cmbi3iIg

Obscure Nazi leader Heinrich Himmler (http://books.google.com/books?id=GB...onepage&q=longerich "heinrich himmler&f=false)

Here it is....( It seems you haven't even looked at the internet either)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a_cmbi3iIg

No, what I stated was not an assumption but fact. Knowing something about this, like who Himmler was and what language he spoke and what he said at Posen, and knowing what evidence exists, I know that you will not be able to learn what you say you want to learn by the method you say you want to use.

It is that simple.

I read the Speech of Reichsführer-SS Heinrich Himmler at Posen 4 October 1943 and I really enjoyed.

Amazing speech.

Thank you very much by the indication.
 
Last edited:
You may have read many articles, but they were apparently all written by deniers (Faurisson? Really?). You certainly didn't read Pressac. Not in less than 24 hours while also claiming to have read a bunch of other articles.

Uh huh. And what documents and forensic data did you "verify", and how exactly didyou manage to "verify" them?

Since you didn't actually "verify" anything, that must have been easy.

I can't even figure out what you're trying to argue with this.

I personally have found it very easy to ignore things that don't exist. Like "evidence which discredit the existence of a mass extermination", for instance.

You have being polite and providing good resources to me verify.

Now you are doing as the others, assumptions.

Do not discredit yourself.
 
Of course, these matters are well known and not only don't challenge the evidence for German mass extermination actions but are part and parcel of such actions, as the Germans required the Order Service in particular to play a part in these actions.

Part of?

Care to explain how that works? If the Germans wished to exterminate the Jews, why permit than to have they own bank system? Postal office? Workshops?

The Jews were not supposed to starve to death?

The best source, IMHO, for Lodz institutions mentioned by this denier is Isaiah Trunk, Lodz Ghetto: A History. Trunk's book reproduces many documents of the Nazis and the ghetto's Jewish Council. Another good secondary book on Lodz is Gordon Horwitz's Gettostadt: Lodz and the Making of a Nazi City. This denier will not read Trunk's work, of course, or Horwitz's, being too busy with recycling dishonest materials he's found on the Web and pretends to be surprised by.

Are you speaking with a mirror?
 
Because, it started off as an eliminating them from society. Segregation if you will. They still held that the jews held some value as forced labor for their war industry. Then a bit later, the final solution to the Jewish question was planned and off they went in a very germanic ,efficient manner.
 
You have being polite and providing good resources to me verify.

So do me the return courtesy and actually read them. Because you haven't. You especially haven't read Pressac.

And stop with this "verify" nonsense, because you aren't doing that, either.

Now you are doing as the others, assumptions.

I don't have to assume anything. Your own posts make your intentions more than clear.

Care to explain how that works? If the Germans wished to exterminate the Jews, why permit than to have they own bank system? Postal office? Workshops?

http://hdot.org/en/trial/defense/pl2

Are you speaking with a mirror?

All you have to do to prove him wrong is read the works he cited.
 
No, you do not have to prove anything. You just did not provided a footage of a gas chamber being used to kill people.



I did not claimed anything. You are doing imaginary assumptions.



I think you are stupid as much as you create assumptions about a person you do not really know.



Oh... Ironic.



Yes, I do.



So, where is a footage of a real homicidal gas chamber? I do not want one which you think is "about to being filled with the fumes of two cars". I want one showing the whole operation of a homicidal gas chamber.

You want snuff films?
 
Apparently he wants to watch films of people dieing.

In the light of his finding Himmler's first Posen speech "amazing" and that he "really enjoyed" it, his insistence on being shown film of actual gas chamber murders is seriously creepy, isn't it?
 
Part of. The Order Service, as stated in the post you quote from, was ordered to help in the roundups of Jews taken to Chelmno and later to Auschwitz. Yes, part of.

Care to explain how that works? If the Germans wished to exterminate the Jews, why permit than to have they own bank system? Postal office? Workshops?
Lodz was exceptional in being the longest-lasting ghetto and for its extensive workshops supplying the German military and industry; it was not, for example, part of the General Gouvernement where Aktion Reinhard was organized and carried out - but even in the GG some Jews were kept alive for forced labor, as you would be aware had you checked this thread as you were advised to do. Lodz itself was maintained as a working ghetto until its final liquidation. Still, approximately 70,000 Jews were deported from Lodz to Chelmno for execution in gas vans at the death camp in Kolo County during 1942; these were mostly ghetto inmates deemed by the occupying German authorities not to be capable of work and thus not worth keeping alive.

The Jews were not supposed to starve to death?
This question doesn't make any sense. I can say that in Lodz ghetto starvation and diseases related to malnutrition were rampant, and thus mortality was significantly higher than normal. However, at the same time, the authorities there wanted to keep Jews alive and productive. On occasion, observing that Jewish inmates would pass out at work in extreme cases or were lethargic and unproductive from malnourishment, Biebow's Ghettoverwaltung increased rations - minimally, for the purpose of maintaining labor productivity. A memo written by Rolf-Heinz Hoppner to Eichmann on 16 July 1941 expressed the situation thus: "There is an impression that District President Ubelhor does not wish to see the ghetto in Lodz disappear since he seems to profit quite well from it."

This shouldn't be hard to understand - Greiser's policy in the Warthegau was to clear out and murder much of the outlying population, to concentrate a Jewish workforce in Lodz ghetto held there by force and kept in poverty to produce economically useful goods, and finally to murder Lodz Jews judged incapable of work. In fact, Ubelhor's September 1939 confidential memo on the "Establishment of a Ghetto in the City of Lodz" explained the plan for the Lodz ghetto at the outset, "It is obvious that the establishment of the ghetto is only a transitional measure. I reserve for myself the decision as to when and how the city of Lodz will be cleansed of Jews. In any case, the final aim must be to burn out entirely this pestilent abscess." At that time, in 1939, the mass murder of Lodz's Jews was not being planned. Eventually, however, in 1942 those not able to render productive service to the occupying Germans were murdered en masse and finally, in 1944, all the remaining Lodz Jews were "burnt out" - as nearly all Lodz Jews left in the ghetto in summer 1944 were shipped for death to either Chelmno or Birkenau at that time - about 55,000 being sent to death camps and only 1400 kept alive for various labor assignments.

Are you speaking with a mirror?
I see you are neither knowledgeable nor clever; you compensate for this by being repetitive. It is a poor tradeoff, IMHO.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by LemmyCaution View Post
Obscure Nazi leader Heinrich Himmler (http://books.google.com/books?id=GBQ...immler&f=false)

Here it is....( It seems you haven't even looked at the internet either)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a_cmbi3iIg
You combined this post from Matthew Ellard http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8117982&postcount=10027 and this one from me http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8119610&postcount=10051 to create a fictitious post which you claim I wrote. Please don't do this again.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom