Dragon Family lawsuit against the United Nations

[Anders Lindman]

As you say, only you can know that you're conscious, so your repeated assertions that you are conscious not evidence that you are in fact conscious. They are also exactly what we would expect to see from someone under mind control.

Yes, that I totally agree with. I thought you meant that I'm not capable of telling whether I'm conscious or not. Let me assure you, I am (even though you cannot know that). So you cannot know if I'm really conscious and I can't know if you are really conscious. Ordinary we take for granted that everybody else is conscious just as we ourselves are, but with mind control coming into the picture the situation becomes very tricky. Some people may be acting out some mind control alter programs without being conscious. Just like robots. Yikes.

 

[Mojo]

I thought you meant that I'm not capable of telling whether I'm conscious or not.

You're not. You have been programmed to believe that you have been conscious at all times, even at those times when you weren't. How else could they get away with it?

 

[Anders Lindman]

You can't remember every detail of every day, can you?

No. But let's take an example of a professor who has studied science for decades and gotten the Nobel Prize, and has immense expert knowledge, and memories of discussions with hundreds of colleagues and friends over those years. Do you really believe someone could have programmed all that knowledge and experience and memories into him or her via mind control. Ha ha. Then your conspiracy theories are way more extreme than mine.

Maybe fast-learning? Like in the Matrix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AOpomu9V6Q

 

[Mojo]

No. But let's take an example of a professor who has studied science for decades and gotten the Nobel Prize, and has immense expert knowledge, and memories of discussions with hundreds of colleagues and friends over those years. Do you really believe someone could have programmed all that knowledge and experience and memories into him or her via mind control. Ha ha. Then your conspiracy theories are way more extreme than mine.

He wasn't under mind control.

And in your case, they don't need to program everything - they only need to program enough to cover up the discontinuities so you don't remember them (which you don't).

 

[Anders Lindman]

You're not. You have been programmed to believe that you have been conscious at all times, even at those times when you weren't. How else could they get away with it?

Wait a minute. Now you are starting to pull my leg again right? If you claim that I can't tell whether I'm conscious or not you are out of your mind. YOU cannot know whether I'm conscious or not. I can. And you cannot possibly know if I can or not. You can ONLY know whether you yourself are conscious or not. The rest is speculation.

 

[Anders Lindman]

He wasn't under mind control.

And in your case, they don't need to program everything - they only need to program enough to cover up the discontinuities so you don't remember them (which you don't).

Now you are changing the topic. We were discussing using mind control to program an entire lifetime into a person. That's ridiculous. To cover up discontinuities maybe possible, to program in an entire lifetime of memories, no way.

 

[Craig4]

You mean like brief moments of mind control. Well, check my past posts and see if you can find some secret cabal information.

The cabal thing would have to exist to find its secrets. As you've given no reason to even suspect such a cabal exists looking to find its secrets in your posts would not be useful.

 

[Tomtomkent]

Now you are changing the topic. We were discussing using mind control to program an entire lifetime into a person. That's ridiculous. To cover up discontinuities maybe possible, to program in an entire lifetime of memories, no way.

Is this your expert opinion as a psychologist?

People wouldn't NEED to create an entire lifetime of memory. Just change a few small details which effect how you think about that lifetime. This happens a lot with folks, especially those who are delusional.

 

[Anders Lindman]

Is this your expert opinion as a psychologist?

People wouldn't NEED to create an entire lifetime of memory. Just change a few small details which effect how you think about that lifetime. This happens a lot with folks, especially those who are delusional.

I meant total programming of the whole memory. Imagine for example switching the memories of Barack Obama and Jesse Ventura so that Obama would get all Ventura's memories and vice versa. That would be completely impossible.

 

[Tomtomkent]

I meant total programming of the whole memory. Imagine for example switching the memories of Barack Obama and Jesse Ventura so that Obama would get all Ventura's memories and vice versa. That would be completely impossible.

No, you were not talking about taking the memories of person A and giving them to person B. You were talking about taking the personality of Person A and manipulating them to become a significantly different person A+. This is possible. Delusional people do it to themselves. Entirely fictional childhood memories have been fabricated and "recovered" in anumber of subjects of the Satanic Panic. A life time of altered memories is not a case ofcreating fictional events from scratch it is about altering the way a person views their old memories, and allowing the maliable human mind to create its own fiction.

Now, unless you want to move the goalpost again, you are mistaken.

 

[Mojo]

Now you are changing the topic. We were discussing using mind control to program an entire lifetime into a person. That's ridiculous. To cover up discontinuities maybe possible, to program in an entire lifetime of memories, no way.

No, we were discussing whether you are under the control of the cabal. Your masters are forcing you to try to change the subjects to "using mind control to program an entire lifetime into a person" because we are too near the truth.

You have conceded that it is possible for them to have implanted enough false memories to cover up the discontinuities. That is all they needed to do to get away with making you their puppet.

 

[Anders Lindman]

No, we were discussing whether you are under the control of the cabal. Your masters are forcing you to try to change the subjects to "using mind control to program an entire lifetime into a person" because we are too near the truth.

You have conceded that it is possible for them to have implanted enough false memories to cover up the discontinuities. That is all they needed to do to get away with making you their puppet.

But then anyone could be a mind controlled puppet! And since it takes enormous resources to mind control a person individually it would be quite a hubris to believe that they would waste that kind of time, money and resources on me. And to cover up memories and things like that only makes the situation even more complicated. It's quite a conspiracy theory you have there!

 

[Anders Lindman]

No, you were not talking about taking the memories of person A and giving them to person B. You were talking about taking the personality of Person A and manipulating them to become a significantly different person A+. This is possible. Delusional people do it to themselves. Entirely fictional childhood memories have been fabricated and "recovered" in anumber of subjects of the Satanic Panic. A life time of altered memories is not a case ofcreating fictional events from scratch it is about altering the way a person views their old memories, and allowing the maliable human mind to create its own fiction.

Now, unless you want to move the goalpost again, you are mistaken.

That's not what I meant. I meant the total programming of a lifetime memory into a person. Very much like the Replicants in the Bladerunner movie. I haven't moved any goal post. I have stated that from the beginning. It's you who are trying to move the goal post into a lesser form of memory implants. And why do you believe in such extreme conspiracy theory in the first place? Do you have any actual evidence that mind control of such extreme kind even exists?

lol. Some of you have turned into more extreme conspiracy theorists than me! Maybe I have brainwashed you. Just kidding!

 

[Anders Lindman]

The cabal thing would have to exist to find its secrets. As you've given no reason to even suspect such a cabal exists looking to find its secrets in your posts would not be useful.

Well, David Sale talked about a 'committee of 300' in one of the later interviews. That sounds very much like a group of leaders for such a cabal. Sure, it's speculation until evidence is presented but the idea of a secret cabal is something many if not most conspiracy researchers talk about (and even other people, like David Sale who are not conspiracy theorists). So the idea of a secret cabal ruling the world is not that far fetched imo.

 

[Mojo]

Wait a minute. Now you are starting to pull my leg again right? If you claim that I can't tell whether I'm conscious or not you are out of your mind. YOU cannot know whether I'm conscious or not. I can. And you cannot possibly know if I can or not.

But your memories are not reliable, because (as you admitted here) it is possible that the cabal has implanted enough false memories to cover up the fact that you were not conscious while under their control. And, of course, you could be under their control right now, and it is the very mind control you deny that is forcing you to make untrue statements about whether you are conscious.

Look, we have five possibilities here:

1. You have never been under the control of the cabal.
2. You are always under the control of the cabal.
3. You have been under the control of the cabal in the past, but the mind control has implanted false memories so that you are unaware of this.
4. You have been under the control of the cabal in the past and are aware of this, but their mind control has implanted a post-control suggestion that makes it impossible for you to admit this.
5. You have been under the control of the cabal in the past and are aware of this, but are lying about it because of some other agenda of your own.

As you can see, in only one of these possibilities are you not under the cabal's control. Because you don't consider the evidence when deciding whether a possibility is plausible, these must all be considered equally plausible, and the odds are therefore 4:1 that you are under the cabal's control.

The rest is speculation.

Everything that you have posted about the "cabal" is speculation. Why should we take it any more seriously than you take the claim that you are under the control of the cabal?

 

[Mojo]

But then anyone could be a mind controlled puppet! And since it takes enormous resources to mind control a person individually...

Prove that "it takes enormous resources to mind control a person individually", or withdraw this claim.

 

[Anders Lindman]

I agree that mind control may be possible, even the more advanced kind of mind control of individuals that creates different personality alters. I have seen much information about that, and some of it even official, such as the exposure of MK Ultra. But to use mind control for altering memories is only something that can be done to a minor extent, such as false memory implants for brief events or for covering up small events, not something that can change large parts of a person's memory.

Different alters in the same person will have different memories, yet those are real memories, not false memories except perhaps small portions of false memory implants. It would for example be very difficult to change the memory of a person's personal relationships with other people, because the memory must be consistent also with those other people's memories. Take a man who has lived with his wife for many decades, and with their children for many years. How to change the entire lifetime memory of that man? Completely impossible, unless the people around him (even at his work) were also mind controlled or a part of a secret cabal or something.

 

[Mojo]

And why do you believe in such extreme conspiracy theory in the first place? Do you have any actual evidence that mind control of such extreme kind even exists?

Do you have any actual evidence to back up your extreme conspiracy theories?

 

[Anders Lindman]

But then anyone could be a mind controlled puppet! And since it takes enormous resources to mind control a person individually...[/url]


Prove that "it takes enormous resources to mind control a person individually", or withdraw this claim.

That's my impression after researching mind control a bit. For example, to create an alter personality in a person, massive amounts of trauma-based programming is needed, even with the enhancement of drugs and electroshocks and things like that. So it's not the kind of passive mind control through television or electromagnetic radiation we are talking about. It's a really heavy kind of mind control of individuals that is needed.

 

[kevsta]

serious question, 20+ pages of biting on this blatant trolling? what gives?

Hat Tip Anders, although I don't know where you get the time.