Worst voting record in the house, this is heinous

[Cain]

I think Bob raises a legitimate point. What's she doing? Didn't her husband quit his job to help take care of her? She should have resigned.

However... unlike Bob, I don't want to take away her health-care.

 

[varwoche]

Uh, no. Loughner didn't ascribe to any mainstream political belief, didn't watch tv or listen to talk radio, and started hating Giffords immediately after he met her in 2007.

His hate for Giffords was born out of a weird personal vendetta after she dismissed his crazy little idea that government must be meaningless because the words used to create government are also meaningless.

I don't see how this can be dismissed so glibly. For all we know, it's the rhetoric that caused him to direct his hate into action. For instance, illegal immigration is one of the things that set him off, which was a core issue for gun nuts like Jesse Kelly.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Will you quit your Job when you have an accident and cannot work for a while?

To the extent I could not fulfill my fiduciary responsibility, yes.

It is unethical to continue when you are unable to fulfill your fiduciary duty.

The question is if voting is a fiduciary duty of representatives. Further, does Giffords transcend that responsibility?

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

I don't see how this can be dismissed so glibly. For all we know, it's the rhetoric that caused him to direct his hate into action. For instance, illegal immigration is one of the things that set him off, which was a core issue for gun nuts like Jesse Kelly.

I side with Newton's Bit on this one.

We don't hold Jodie Foster culpable for Hinkley's shooting of Reagan and Brady.

The motivation in both shootings was delusional thinking.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Further, does Giffords transcend that responsibility?

Again, I don't believe Giffords is getting any special treatment in being allowed to keep her job in Congress.

Members of Congress also sometimes take off to campaign for other offices.

 

[Bri]

Didn't her husband quit his job to help take care of her?

No. He flew a space shuttle mission.

ETA: Giffords also flew to Washington to vote to extend the debt ceiling since the shooting.

-Bri

 

[varwoche]

I side with Newton's Bit on this one.

We don't hold Jodie Foster culpable for Hinkley's shooting of Reagan and Brady.

The motivation in both shootings was delusional thinking.

Hinkley was set off by a fictional character, which is an awfully weak analogy.

 

[TimCallahan]

It sounds like everyone here feels that it is possible for a member of the house to transcend the expectation of voting and still serve his or her constituents.

I do not.

I am a firm believer that a good representative in her position should have resigned.

Apparently, you missed post #5. Either that or you're being deliberately obtuse in service to your sick joke. Shame on you.

In any case, had the voters in her district wanted her out they could have recalled her at any time. They haven't. It's not your concern. End of story.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Hinkley was set off by a fictional character, which is an awfully weak analogy.

Psychopathic delusion is a psychopathic delusion. I see no more reason to believe anything Loughner says about his motivations than we did Hinkley.

I really dislike crap like "2nd Amendment solution" and such, but to a reasonable mind this was just political rhetoric and not an actual incitement to attempt murder. (Just as a reasonable mind can understand the difference between an actress and a role.)

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

ETA: Giffords also flew to Washington to vote to extend the debt ceiling since the shooting.

Ah--thank you. AS I suspected, her case is very similar to that of Sen. Ted Kennedy's (with the exception that we expect her to recover and get back to being a full-time legislator at some point).

As I've been saying, Giffords isn't receiving any special treatment. There is precedent for this sort of thing.

 

[varwoche]

Psychopathic delusion is a psychopathic delusion. I see no more reason to believe anything Loughner says about his motivations than we did Hinkley.

Anything can set off someone as disturbed as Loughner. For all we know it was a cartoon. I should mention though, I don't claim to know his motivations (or lack thereof), unlike Newtons Bit and apparently you.

We do know however that (1) Loughner hated Giffords (2) he was upset by people who don't speak English (3) illegal immigration was a cornerstone of Jesse Kelly's campaign (4) Jesse Kelly used incendiary rhetoric.

I really dislike crap like "2nd Amendment solution" and such, but to a reasonable mind this was just political rhetoric and not an actual incitement to attempt murder. (Just as a reasonable mind can understand the difference between an actress and a role.)

Yes, a reasonable mind can discern. However one possible consequence of incendiary rhetoric is the impact on someone who doesn't have a reasonable mind.

 

[jj]

However one possible consequence of incendiary rhetoric is the impact on someone who doesn't have a reasonable mind.

This is especially the case when dealing with inflamatory rhetoric of most any sort.

 

[Apathia]

A classic troll thread, but sadly made by someone who isn't trolling.

 

[Newtons Bit]

Anything can set off someone as disturbed as Loughner. For all we know it was a cartoon. I should mention though, I don't claim to know his motivations (or lack thereof), unlike Newtons Bit and apparently you.

Yea, because I've actually read his statements, the evidence found in his room, interviews by people who knew him and said he wasn't defined by mainstream politics, interviews by people who knew him and said he didn't watch TV or listen to talk radio, the reactions of the judge who found Loughner unfit to stand trial, court reports of a psychologist who found Loughner to be shizophrenic.

But, by all means, speculate away!

We do know however that (1) Loughner hated Giffords (2) he was upset by people who don't speak English (3) illegal immigration was a cornerstone of Jesse Kelly's campaign (4) Jesse Kelly used incendiary rhetoric.

Great, you've outlined a scenario that, barring all the other evidence we have about Loughner, shows that it isn't impossible that Loughner was influenced by a mainstream politician.

Now perhaps you'd like to formulate an opinion based on what we do already know about the schizophrenic instead of using blind pointless speculation.

 

[DC]

To the extent I could not fulfill my fiduciary responsibility, yes.

It is unethical to continue when you are unable to fulfill your fiduciary duty.

The question is if voting is a fiduciary duty of representatives. Further, does Giffords transcend that responsibility?

in the civilized world someone would take over your duties for the time you are not avaible if that is needed, but you would not just quit your job or loose your job.

 

[Newtons Bit]

in the civilized world someone would take over your duties for the time you are not avaible if that is needed, but you would not just quit your job or loose your job.

True, however I don't think there's a system in place for Congresscritters to have replacements without actually losing their job.

 

[BobTheCoward]

in the civilized world someone would take over your duties for the time you are not avaible if that is needed, but you would not just quit your job or loose your job.

But in the US house, you cannot have someone cast votes in your place.

 

[DC]

But in the US house, you cannot have someone cast votes in your place.

well you can hardly blame her for a failure of the system then.

 

[geni]

But in the US house, you cannot have someone cast votes in your place.

Well in many countries this would be delt with via the paring system. Surely there must be some republicans who need a day off to talk with constituents visit a doctor or accept campain contributions. So you pair them with Giffords and they mutaly agree not to vote.

 

[AlBell]

What is heinous:

"Get on Target for Victory in November : Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office : Shoot a fully automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly
Teaparty Candidate Jesse Kelly Campaign Promo"

note: stolen signature.