Explain Atheism to Justinian2

[TheRedWorm]

Did someone say roasted baby? Yum yum!

They should have named this thread "Circle jerk with the super troll"

4 chan troll is all 4 trolling.

 

[Justinian2]

So then, may we conclude that of the two contradictory statements you were asked about, the false one was, "The most immoral people I have seen encountered on the internet prior to today call themselves Atheists and haven't a clue what morality is"?

I corrected that to bring it into agreement

Given the vitriol that has been leveled at atheists, how often do you suppose atheists announce their atheism in small town America?

OK. However American law also forbids discrimation on the basis of race, color or creed (and other things).

Sadly, no. The OWI was careful to make little to no mention of the plight of Jews in fascist Europe due to the strong antisemitism in the U.S. After the war, the same antisemitism led to the efforts to block European Jews from emigrating to the U.S. (and Britain).

I have seen antisemitic people in the USA. But today most Americans are proud today to have fought against the genocide of the Jewish people by the Nazis.

The women murdered during the Salem Witch Trials were not actually witches. They didn't actually speak in tongues, practice magic, make potions or practice a different religion.

The witch trials found that the people that were hung spoke in tongues, practiced magic, made potions. This is the gist of the re-enactment of the witch trials in Salem.

 

[Complexity]

They should have named this thread "Circle jerk with the super troll"

Ick.

I have standards.

 

[gnome]

The best explanation I have encountered of atheism for a monotheist to understand is this: consider all the Gods from other mythologies that you think are entirely mythical and not real. Maybe it's Odin, Zeus, Ra, and so forth. You are an atheist with respect to those gods.

Most of us just include one more god on that list than you.

 

[Justinian2]

Did someone say roasted baby? Yum yum!

They should have named this thread "Circle jerk with the super troll"

From Wikipedia:

In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[4] The noun troll may refer to the provocative message itself, as in: "That was an excellent troll you posted".

Nuff said.

 

[Foster Zygote]

I corrected that to bring it into agreement

Sure. Whatever you say.

OK. However American law also forbids discrimation on the basis of race, color or creed (and other things).

The fact that such discrimination is illegal does not stop it from happening. People who are atheistic (or African American, or Jewish, or homosexual) still face discrimination.

I have seen antisemitic people in the USA. But today most Americans are proud today to have fought against the genocide of the Jewish people by the Nazis.

And today, most people in the southern U.S. are glad that slavery is illegal...

The witch trials found that the people that were hung spoke in tongues, practiced magic, made potions. This is the gist of the re-enactment of the witch trials in Salem.

And you assume that those accusations were correct? Some of them were also accused of flying and having sex with demons. Do you believe that they actually did that as well?

 

[Psiload]

In the witch trials of the 1600's the people of Salem MA had no respect for the creed of some women. We tried them and hung them as witches. Key to their conviction was that they talked in tongues, had a different religion, made magical potions and did other magic. Most Americans are proud to have evolved into more tolerant people.

"Witch" was NOT the creed of the women convicted of witchcraft in the Salem trials. The accusations were untrue. The Salem witch trials were an example of the intolerance of the religious, not religious intolerance. Think of Scientologists accusing non-Scientologists of being "SP's" and you'll have an idea of what the Salem witch trials were all about.

 

[zooterkin]

From Wikipedia:


Nuff said.

I thought Scientology was meant to give you the ability to understand things better and express yourself clearly?

I don't think what you highlighted says what you think it does.

 

[Justinian2]

"Witch" was NOT the creed of the women convicted of witchcraft in the Salem trials. The accusations were untrue.

The Salem witch trials were an example of the intolerance of the religious, not religious intolerance.

Think of Scientologists accusing non-Scientologists of being "SP's" and you'll have an idea of what the Salem witch trials were all about.

Scientolgists don't hang people. David MisCaviage, the present head of the COS, is not the shining example of a Scientologist that most people would prefer. If there was a vote between Tom Cruise and David MisCaviage for the next leader of Scientology, I believe Tom would get all but one vote. But, unfortunately, David is a dictator and there can be no vote.

Scientolgists don't hang people but they do ban them from auditing because they show "No case gain". And they expell them from the organization because they disrupt Scientology.

If the people of the Church where the 'Green River Serial Killer' was a member had identified and expelled him before he killed 50 women, that would have been great. As it was, members aided and abetted him with their silence and forgiveness. A little branding/suspicion is a good thing at times.

 

[Justinian2]

I thought Scientology was meant to give you the ability to understand things better and express yourself clearly?

I don't think what you highlighted says what you think it does.

By your own words, you're a Nitpicking dilettante

This thread is about Atheists. Do Atheists have tolerance for other creeds? Do Atheists want tolerance for their own creed?

 

[Psiload]

Scientolgists don't hang people. David MisCaviage, the present head of the COS, is not the shining example of a Scientologist that most people would prefer. If there was a vote between Tom Cruise and David MisCaviage for the next leader of Scientology, I believe Tom would get all but one vote. But, unfortunately, David is a dictator and there can be no vote.

Scientolgists don't hang people but they do ban them from auditing because they show "No case gain". And they expell them from the organization because they disrupt Scientology.

The CoS is an awful organization run by terrible people. We already knew that. You're preaching to the choir, kid.

If the people of the Church where the 'Green River Serial Killer' was a member had identified and expelled him before he killed 50 women, that would have been great. As it was, members aided and abetted him with their silence and forgiveness. A little branding/suspicion is a good thing at times.

As long as the branding/suspicion is based in rationality and reality, it can be good thing. If it's based upon superstitious ignorance and intolerance, such as accusations of witchcraft and suppressive persons, then it is not a good thing.

 

[zooterkin]

By your own words, you're a Nitpicking dilettante

And?

This thread is about Atheists. Do Atheists have tolerance for other creeds?

Some do, some don't. The only thing all atheists (no capital required) have in common is that they do not believe in the existence of any deities.

Do Atheists want tolerance for their own creed?

Atheism is not a creed. Quite the opposite, in fact.

 

[Dave Rogers]

Do Atheists have tolerance for other creeds? Do Atheists want tolerance for their own creed?

Atheism isn't a creed. It's the absence of a creed. As such, atheists, as a group, cannot be said to possess any particular quality other than the absence of a belief in gods. The fact that you ask these questions demonstrates that you continue to misunderstand the meaning of the word "atheist".

Dave

 

[dafydd]

Atheism isn't a creed. It's the absence of a creed. As such, atheists, as a group, cannot be said to possess any particular quality other than the absence of a belief in gods. The fact that you ask these questions demonstrates that you continue to misunderstand the meaning of the word "atheist".

Dave

Deliberately misunderstand, in my view.

 

[Foster Zygote]

David MisCaviage, the present head of the COS, is not the shining example of a Scientologist that most people would prefer.

And what OT level is he?

If the people of the Church where the 'Green River Serial Killer' was a member had identified and expelled him before he killed 50 women, that would have been great. As it was, members aided and abetted him with their silence and forgiveness. A little branding/suspicion is a good thing at times.

What evidence is there that they knowingly aided him?

 

[MRC_Hans]

MmmmmOkay. Taking Justinian2's word for is position (benefit of doubt, and all that..), I'll answer the OP request:

To me, 'atheist' is a label that is used to give a general impression on my position of religion. I'm one of those people who are not theists.

I have earlier used the therm 'agnostic' to indicate that I don't pretend to know that god does not exist, however, I have learned that agnostic has a special meaning.

I would really prefer the term 'non-religious', but for most practical purposes, 'atheist' will do.

I live my life as most other people. I am nice to my neighbours, faithful to my wife, I obey the laws, pay my dues, including taxes.

I live in a culture that was originally built on Christianity, and I participate in the cultural aspects of holidays like Christmas. After all, this and many other holidays are really heathen in their roots, so ......

I give a fixed annual amount to Medicins sans Frontieres and smaller donations to various charities.

In my country, it is not normal to disclose publicly what you vote.

Hans

 

[MRC_Hans]

This thread is about Atheists. Do Atheists have tolerance for other creeds? Do Atheists want tolerance for their own creed?

Try to learn, if only by heart: Atheism is not a creed.

Most atheists are tolerant of other people's creeds, as long as they don't foist them on others.

Hans

 

[Justinian2]

Atheism isn't a creed. It's the absence of a creed. As such, atheists, as a group, cannot be said to possess any particular quality other than the absence of a belief in gods. The fact that you ask these questions demonstrates that you continue to misunderstand the meaning of the word "atheist".

Dave

From Wikipedia:

Although in Western culture atheists are usually irreligious, some are spiritual.[14][15] Moreover, atheism also figures in certain religious and spiritual belief systems, such as Jainism, Buddhism, Hinduism, and Neopagan movements[16] such as Wicca.[17] Jainism and some forms of Buddhism do not advocate belief in gods,[18] whereas Hinduism holds atheism to be valid, but difficult to follow spiritually.[19]

Since conceptions of atheism vary, determining how many atheists exist in the world today is no easy task.[20] According to one estimate, about 2.3% of the world's population are atheists, while a further 11.9% are nonreligious.[21] According to another, rates of self-reported atheism are among the highest in Western nations, again to varying degrees: United States (4%), Italy (7%), Spain (11%), Great Britain (17%), Germany (20%), and France (32%).[22]

Wikipedia makes a distiction, which I can't see, beteen atheists and the nonreligious. I'm not sure what that means. The implication is that atheists are spiritual but don't believe in a deity whereas people that are nonreligious don't believe in religion. It seems like atheism should be the larger set/group of which nonreligion is a subset.

Atheists are a group just as conservatives are a group. Atheists get lumped into the same bin with all other atheists. So, whether you think it's a creed or not, people still categorize you by your belief.

 

[Complexity]

This thread is about Atheists. Do Atheists have tolerance for other creeds? Do Atheists want tolerance for their own creed?

Atheists do not have a creed.

 

[dafydd]

Atheists do not have a creed.

What is the point of all this? Justinian is being deliberately stroppy. He knows very well that atheism is not a creed.