Michael Mozina
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Pure baloney. He uses a double layer paper as a part of the 'circuit'.
http://adsabs.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/n...T&data_type=HTML&format=&high=42ca922c9c02197
Merged Electric Sun Theory (Split from: CME's, active regions and high energy flares)
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Pure baloney. He uses a double layer paper as a part of the 'circuit'.
http://adsabs.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/n...T&data_type=HTML&format=&high=42ca922c9c02197
Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
How inane (insane?) of you. We know this. The equations are standard EM equations. They include permeability (usually a constant for air or vacuum, a tensor for other materials).
And: permeability is not inductance (if you cannot understand anything else then understand that they have separate Wikipedia articles!).
Michael Mozina
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Not really, no. In terms of pure kinetic energy, I have no idea what it is that you believe actually heats plasmas to millions of degrees, generates gamma rays, produces neutron capture signatures, etc, at a zero point in two magnetic fields. Until I grok what you think produces that extreme amount of kinetic energy, I have no idea how to answer your question.
Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
Pure baloney. We know he uses a double layer as a part of the circuit model.
Michael Mozina
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Ya, I know. In fact that quote I keep citing about permeability being a measurement of inductance per distance unit actually has a hot link to the inductance article. How blind can you be?
Michael Mozina
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The double layer is the "release mechanism" of EM energy in Alfven's world of 'circuits' RC, not "magnetic reconnection".
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Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
I know that the double layer is the "release mechanism" of EM energy in Alfven's world of 'circuits' MM, not "magnetic reconnection".You are also continue to be wrong about his paper: There are no 'circuits'. Alfvén has a single circuit model for solar flares.
I think that he has another paper on the magnetosphere that has another circuit model in it. So Alfven's world seems to be 2 circuit models!
Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
Ya, I know that there is a link to the inductance article.
That has nothing to do with the point that permeability is not inductance (if you cannot understand anything else then understand that they have separate Wikipedia articles!).
How unable to count to 2 can you be?
Michael Mozina
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You are also continue to be wrong about his paper: There are no 'circuits'. Alfvén has a single circuit model for solar flares.
I think that he has another paper on the magnetosphere that has another circuit model in it. So Alfven's world seems to be 2 circuit models!
So what? Alfven explains how a SINGLE loop/circuit can release energy. You can't even do that with 'reconnection'! Mann and Onel use a multiple circuit approach and adds the appropriate resistors, etc. Circuit theory allows for "electrical discharges" to occur in plasmas RC because the "circuit" is the storage mechanism and the "double layer" provides the "switch" to release the energy.
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Michael Mozina
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I've been EXTREMELY careful to use the term "inductance per distance unit" or something denoting the distance aspect RC. Your argument is a strawman. I never confused the two. You did that.
W.D.Clinger
Philosopher
MM sums it up
Snipping irrelevant excuses, evasions, and attempts to change the subject...
Snipping irrelevant excuses, evasions, and attempts to change the subject...
Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
That is stupid, MM. Your question has nothing to do sol's post which is about electromagnetic theory not solar flares.
There is no "extreme amount of kinetic energy" involved, just magnetic fields.
If you want a physical situation to compare it with than it is not magnetic reconnection in solar flares. It is W.D. Clinger's simple experiment that you remain incapable of understanding.
Michael Mozina
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Oh, I know how to answer your bogus claim because you *FINALLY* put your math and your claims on the table and explained a bit about your so called 'experiment'.
I'm asking sol some important questions that I need to hear him answer before I can answer HIS question. Your experiment demonstrated inductance and nothing more. I'm not clear yet on the idea sol is trying to convey. I like and trust sol and I'll give him every benefit of the doubt that I can, but I have to understand what he's claiming is the KINETIC ENERGY source. So far that's not clear to me from his few comments.
Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
So you are just stating the obvious
- one of the equations contains the permeability constant (or tensor),
- three of the equations contain the permeability of free space constant.
- permeability can be measured in units of henry per meter
- the henry is the SI unit of inductance
Michael Mozina
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Yep, keep reading. Inductance already has a proper name and it isn't "magnetic reconnection".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permeability_(electromagnetism)
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Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
No such thing as a "loop/circuit".
Alfvén explains how a SINGLE circuit model of a solar flare can release energy.
That is really ignorant. The reasons that magnetic reconnection was originally proposed to explain solar flares included that it could produce the energy required (the main reason was the observations the supported the existence of a magnetic neutral point in solar flares)
Oh dear - more ignorance!
Mann and Onel use a single circuit model approach (Figure 3a) and remove the appropriate resistors, etc, to produce a simpler circuit model (Figure 3b).
Wrong: Alfvén's circuit model has no "electrical discharges" for the simple reason that electrical discharges are impossible in plasma. Not even Alfvén states this.
Found this preprint: Energy Release and Particle Acceleration in Flares: Summary and Future Prospects, Lin, 9 Oct 2011.
Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
Yep. Inductance is inductance. Magnetic reconnection is magnetic reconnection.
Duh
!There is only one person ignorant enough in this thread who might claim that they are the same (hint: It is not me)
W.D.Clinger
Philosopher
MM explains his confusion, part 1
Had I used cgs units, as in Purcell's Electricity and Magnetism, you might have been less confused:
You must have missed this part:
So you think Ampère's law is about inductance?
Had I used cgs units, as in Purcell's Electricity and Magnetism, you might have been less confused:
[latex]
\[
\nabla \times \hbox{{\bf B}} =
\frac{1}{c} \left( 4 \pi \hbox{{\bf J}}
+ \frac{\partial \hbox{{\bf E}}}{\partial t} \right)
\]
[/latex]
\[
\nabla \times \hbox{{\bf B}} =
\frac{1}{c} \left( 4 \pi \hbox{{\bf J}}
+ \frac{\partial \hbox{{\bf E}}}{\partial t} \right)
\]
[/latex]
You must have missed this part:
Michael Mozina
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Yes, and he did it *WITHOUT* reconnection theory. MR theory is UNNECESSARY and redundant.
Michael Mozina
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How are they physically different RC?
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