Merged General Holocaust denial discussion thread

[Saggy]

At which point, the dumb as dishwater troglodyte

Nick, I gotta say those 'how to insult like a real Zionist' classes you're taking are really starting to pay off.

Links to the national statute books and penal codes, or bust, Saggy.

The NYT is good enough for me, Nick, the paper of record, you know. If you don't believe it, that's your problem.

 

[Nick Terry]

If they want to get in touch with their relatives and celebrate that's their business. They can organize their own family reunions.

BTW, you're making the erroneous assumption that the only possible fate for Jews living is Europe during WWII is either 1) surviving the war or 2) being exterminated. That's not true. It's true that Jews either survived the war or they did not survive the war. But there are many different ways to not survive the war besides being exterminated.

I think you need to back up and reflect on how badly your side has failed on finding any survivors full stop.

I'm not talking about family reunions. I'm talking about making a convincing argument showing that the numbers are genuinely wrong and that another set of numbers are right.

Since it's a dead cert that you're only going to reply with drivel like the above post with attempts to obfuscate, move goalposts and play burden of proof table tennis, I should clarify that what I'm talking about is actually fairly simple.

If 'revisionism' was serious and amounted to something more than the antisemitic verbiage that it really is, then it'd be a simple matter to show the world that the numbers were all wrong and lo! here are the millions of Jews, this is what happened to them, some went here, some died, some went there.

That would shut up Saggy's fantasy Zionists, and hit newspaper headlines with the Major Revision to World History you seem to think is your natural birthright.

Tell you what: why don't we dig out a table of prewar population statistics for the Jews of Europe (and even the world), and then you and your buddies tell us, with evidence, what happened to them.

You tell us, the same way that every other historian would tell the story of a population upheaval or mass migration. With evidence.

No obfuscation, no conjectures, no appeals to unknowability, no burden of proof table tennis. It's just you and positive evidence.

That's how history is meant to be revised.

 

[Nick Terry]

The NYT is good enough for me, Nick, the paper of record, you know. If you don't believe it, that's your problem.

You don't understand the NYT article, or the EU law, or the national laws of EU states.

This is the situation as of right now:

The European Union's executive Commission proposed a European Union wide anti-racism xenophobia law in 2001, which included the criminalization of Holocaust denial. On July 15, 1996, the Council of the European Union adopted the Joint action/96/443/JHA concerning action to combat racism and xenophobia.[44][45] During the German presidency there was an attempt to extend this ban.[46] Full implementation was blocked by the United Kingdom and the Nordic countries because of the need to balance the restrictions on voicing racist opinions against the freedom of expression.[47] As a result a compromise has been reached within the EU and while the EU has not prohibited Holocaust denial outright, a maximum term of three years in jail is optionally available to all member nations for "denying or grossly trivialising crimes of genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes."[48][49]
The EU extradition policy regarding Holocaust denial was tested in the United Kingdom(UK) during the 2008 failed extradition case brought against the suspected Holocaust denier Frederick Toben[50] by the German government. As there is no specific crime of Holocaust denial in the UK the German government had applied for Toben's extradition under racial and xenophobic crimes. Toben's extradition was refused by the Westminster Magistrates' Court and the German government withdrew its appeal to the High Court.

I've bolded a few bits that seem to be confusing you.

 

[Nick Terry]

Saggy, tell me, if Holocaust denial is illegal everywhere in the EU, how come Carlo Mattogno isn't in jail in Italy?

Just explain that one, and we'll go from there. In fact, you have to explain that one, since Mattogno is far and way the most active denier author of the past ten years.

 

[MG1962]

The NYT is good enough for me, Nick, the paper of record, you know. If you don't believe it, that's your problem.

No the problem is you have been caught out using the exact document you claimed proved your point. Why? because you had not actually read it had you. I would bet London to brick you only know about this document because someone told you. They told you what it said, what you should think about it and how you are expected to react.

Then later you suggest burning a book

Hitler would be truly proud of his prodigy

 

[Saggy]

Saggy, tell me, if Holocaust denial is illegal everywhere in the EU, how come Carlo Mattogno isn't in jail in Italy?

Just explain that one, and we'll go from there. In fact, you have to explain that one, since Mattogno is far and way the most active denier author of the past ten years.

It was explained in the article, as anyone interested enough to read it knows.

 

[MG1962]

It was explained in the article, as anyone interested enough to read it knows.

That you openly lied about the article?

 

[LemmyCaution]

The upper limit of Revisionism in the US, where the law doesn't come into play, is set by the shoddy work and dishonest posturing of deniers who, as Nick says, come across as allergic to libraries, Amazon, even online repositories--and, rather than working with the sources and readily available scholarship, they recycle discredited one-liners about Wiesel or Churchill, whine about how their ideas aren't taken seriously, trash Zionism and Jews, and refuse to state their case. Thinking of the last point, has Saggy seen fit to take on Nick's 200+ witnesses yet, or Strawzcynski . . . has any intrepid revisionist summarized the evidence, from witnesses to documents to demographics, for the witless resettlement thesis or explained, with evidence, how the supposed hoax was hoaxed?

 

[MG1962]

Thinking of the last point, has Saggy seen fit to take on Nick's 200+ witnesses yet, or Strawzcynski . . . has any intrepid revisionist summarized the evidence, from witnesses to documents to demographics, for the witless resettlement thesis or explained, with evidence, how the supposed hoax was hoaxed?

Short answer NO

Long answer HELL NO

 

[TSR]

It was explained in the article, as anyone interested enough to read it knows.

.
Quite right.

It was explained in the article that Italy has no such law, and that the laws of the various member states of the EU take precedence.

It was also explained that this draft law was not in force (that's what a "draft law" means) back in 2007 when the article was written. It was also explained that even getting this far required years of negotiation, and that this draft law was considered toothless.

So it directly contradicts your dishonest post claiming that Italy did have such laws, and that the "draft law" (in the States, it would be called proposed legislation or possibly a bill) is considered primary. It also puts the lie to your claim that Jews control everything.

What is the *current* status of this proposal, Sags? What is its exact wording? And if the Jews are in control, what's taking them so long to have Mattogno arrested?
.

 

[Wroclaw]

The upper limit of Revisionism in the US, where the law doesn't come into play, is set by the shoddy work and dishonest posturing of deniers who, as Nick says, come across as allergic to libraries, Amazon, even online repositories--and, rather than working with the sources and readily available scholarship, they recycle discredited one-liners about Wiesel or Churchill, whine about how their ideas aren't taken seriously, trash Zionism and Jews, and refuse to state their case. Thinking of the last point, has Saggy seen fit to take on Nick's 200+ witnesses yet, or Strawzcynski . . . has any intrepid revisionist summarized the evidence, from witnesses to documents to demographics, for the witless resettlement thesis or explained, with evidence, how the supposed hoax was hoaxed?

An excellent point. In Europe, where, presumably, were Saggy correct, a man like Carlo Mattogno would surely be sitting in jail, Mattogno at least tries to give the appearance of scholarly work, even if he fails miserably. In the U.S., where there are literally no restraints, the level of scholarship is at rock bottom. Creationists do a better job of trying to appear scholarly.

 

[Robrob]

The K-3 manual is for softening them up, getting them ready for the explicit hoax programming to begin in grade 4. It is truly a degenerate book, sick ... here is a sample question .... "What does prejudice smell like?". This book should be burned.

Opinion presented as fact. Since you lied about Florida K-3 students being taught the Holocaust, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?

What is so "degenerate, sick" about the rhetorical question, "What does prejudice smell like?"

The phony goal is to teach the students 'tolerance'.

Which is a bad thing, because...?

The absurdity of having the Zionists, for 3000 years the most intolerant people on the planet, hating everyone and being hated in return, teach children 'tolerance' is truly sickening.

I thought it was the schools teaching about history, now it's the "Zionists" doing the teaching? And of course, they aren't "Jews" because that would be...?

What's most telling about your posts is your overt racism and/or antisemitism. You try and cloak it with the code word "Anti-Zionism" but it's simple racism. It's laughable and obvious.

 

[Clayton Moore]

Opinion presented as fact. Since you lied about Florida K-3 students being taught the Holocaust, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?

What is so "degenerate, sick" about the rhetorical question, "What does prejudice smell like?"


Which is a bad thing, because...?


I thought it was the schools teaching about history, now it's the "Zionists" doing the teaching? And of course, they aren't "Jews" because that would be...?

What's most telling about your posts is your overt racism and/or antisemitism. You try and cloak it with the code word "Anti-Zionism" but it's simple racism. It's laughable and obvious.

Zionists are haters, elitists, supremacists who hide beneath the skirts and behind the wealth of Judaism.

 

[TSR]

Zionists are haters, elitists, supremacists who hide beneath the skirts and behind the wealth of Judaism.

.
Since you posted dishonesty about THHP and then ran away, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?

Since you posted dishonesty about Krege and then ran away, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?

Since you posted dishonesty about Jewish control of the media and then ran away, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?
.

 

[Nick Terry]

It was explained in the article, as anyone interested enough to read it knows.

No it's not. The article didn't mention Carlo Mattogno. Carlo Mattogno has not been arrested and charged with Holocaust denial in his home country of Italy.

 

[Clayton Moore]

.
Since you posted dishonesty about THHP and then ran away, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?

Since you posted dishonesty about Krege and then ran away, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?

Since you posted dishonesty about Jewish control of the media and then ran away, why should anyone accept your unfounded personal opinion about anything?
.

All self serving lies. Remember at your own risk.

 

[Multivac]

The idea that Belsen differed because it was a 'holding camp' is more pure idiocy, and easily refuted, for example, by this picture taken when Dachau was liberated ....

http://www.humanitas-international.org/archive/dachau-liberation/inmates-lib640.jpg

These are pictures you'll never see in the media because there are prima facie evidence that the holohoax is a gigantic lie. The fact that they are never shown has only one explanation, that is that the Zionists control the media.

Thanks for posting the photo. Perhaps you might also like to look at these photos from the site you linked to.

These quotes are from the holocaust timeline on the site you linked to. The URL is below the quotes.

"1942 July 17 A transport of Dutch Jews arrives at Auschwitz, and Himmler witnesses the execution of 449 persons in Bunker 2, his first such experience. That evening, Himmler attends a dinner party at Gauleiter Fritz Bracht's luxurious villa in a forest near Kattowitz. "

"1942 July 22 The Germans begin their most ambitious project to date: the deporting of more than half a million Jews from the Warsaw ghetto. The death camp prepared for them is Treblinka, little more than 40 miles away.

(In just one month, 66,701 Jews are transported to Treblinka and gassed on arrival.) "

"1942 July 23 The death camp at Treblinka goes into operation. (total victims: 800,000; survivors: under 40)

(Note: A few days later, SS Major Christian Wirth is named inspector of the death camps at Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka.) (See December 8, 1941)"

"1942 July 29 Eduard Schulte, general manager of the Giesche mining operation near Auschwitz, departs Breslau by train for Switzerland, where he plans to disclose the German plan for the "final solution of the Jewish question," which he apparently had learned of not long after Himmler's visit to Auschwitz on July 17. He soon gave his information to several Jewish organizations, and through them, anonymously, to the rest of the world. Schulte's warning seems to have been the first report to reach the West of an overall Nazi plan, authorized at the highest levels, to eliminate the Jewish people entirely. "

http://www.humanitas-international.org/homepage-news.htm

 

[Multivac]

This thread is about the HolohoaxHolocaust and the liars who instigateddeny it.

Corrected that for you.

 

[Clayton Moore]

Corrected that for you.

Good idea to laud by supporting the Zionist scum who infer the Jewish people of the Holohoax were docile sheep and murderers. What do you think their opinion is of non Jewish people?

 

[Multivac]

Good idea to laud by supporting the Zionist scum who infer the Jewish people of the Holohoax were docile sheep and murderers. What do you think their opinion is of non Jewish people?

I do not know anyone who thinks that the Jewish people caught up in the Holocaust were sheep, docile or murderers.

The photo you posted implied that the holocaust was a lie and that people in Dachau were well treated. The photos I posted, from the site you linked to, show hundreds of obviously malnourished corpses.

The Holocaust happened.