Dancing David
Penultimate Amazing
Eisenhower's experience certainly counts, especially the part where he didn't kill Montgomery...
Herman Cain leads by 20 points!
- Thread starter JudeBrando
- Start date
Eisenhower's experience certainly counts, especially the part where he didn't kill Montgomery...
Foolmewunz
Grammar Resistance Leader, TLA Dictator
Nor DeGaulle. Nor Patton.
Can you imagine a staff meeting with Monty, CDG, and Patton? You'd have to hold it on a football pitch to fit all their egos.
Cleon
King of the Pod People
The Taliban wing of the GOP is simply running down the list of people they can turn to instead of Romney.
In the beginning, they turned to Bachmann. At first, it was difficult to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron. As she got more press coverage, it became impossible to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron.
So they turned to Perry. He managed to lose the "old, cranky, & white" vote in a masterful 1-2 punch of calling Social Security a "Ponzi Scheme" and only supporting mildly draconian policies with regard to undocumented immigrants.
With Palin, Huckabee, and Christie (again) out of the race, they're turning to Cain. Once the lunatic fringe clues into the fact that Cain makes Bachmann seem almost electable, they'll run to Santorum. At that point I think they'll figure out that it's all over.
In the beginning, they turned to Bachmann. At first, it was difficult to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron. As she got more press coverage, it became impossible to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron.
So they turned to Perry. He managed to lose the "old, cranky, & white" vote in a masterful 1-2 punch of calling Social Security a "Ponzi Scheme" and only supporting mildly draconian policies with regard to undocumented immigrants.
With Palin, Huckabee, and Christie (again) out of the race, they're turning to Cain. Once the lunatic fringe clues into the fact that Cain makes Bachmann seem almost electable, they'll run to Santorum. At that point I think they'll figure out that it's all over.
But of course, after you've been proven wrong, just shift the goalposts! Now the important criteria for being the president is having "insight on how people feel". What every happened to leading people and understanding economics, both which Cain has and BO doesn't?
bikerdruid
Philosopher
there are issues other than economics that a president must be aware of.
the fact that cain believes that being poor or queer are choices, and the fact that he is willing to tax food and clothing, show his stupidity.
TimCallahan
Philosopher
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The passive wording of your post reminds me of the title of the book Mistakes Were Made (but not by me) by Carol Tavris and Elliot Aronson. The book is about the evasion of responsibility vs. accepting responsibility for one's errors. The authors note that it is common for government agencies, when admitting they blew it, to say, "Mistakes were made . . . ," rather than "We made a mistake," or, "We really screwed up." Saying, "Mistakes were made," implies that those admitting to the error didn't actually commit it. The error just sort of happened by itself.
When you say, "It has been alleged . . . ," you make the allegation into an abstract source, without attributing the allegation to a given party whose credentials we can examine. So, "it has been alleged," by whom? The American Nazi Party? A respected historian? The FBI?
As far as I know, the criminals who abducted and murdered the Lindburgh baby were simply that - criminals. What evidence do you have that Jews were involved or that Jews even commit the ritual murder of infants? This sounds like propagandistic libel similar to The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.
Of course there are, but let's first get clear on the these two that were used. Cain trounces BO on both. Agree or disagree?
If I were a Republican, I would not be proud of Herman Cain leading any poll by 20 points, in fact, I wouldn't be proud of any of the candidates the GOP has in the race right now.
Perhaps that's why they keep wanting the new and improved GOP candidate to join in?
Perhaps that's why they keep wanting the new and improved GOP candidate to join in?
bikerdruid
Philosopher
one politician is much like the other.
the fact that cain is stupid in matters of human identity and crisis makes him the less desirable.
once in the oval office, either will do as commanded by their corporate masters.
Disagree. His 999 plan is economically insane. As for being a leader of a nation, his understand of people leaves much to be desired. Being homosexual is a choice? Being poor is a choice? Please.
First you say there are issues other than economics that a president must be aware of to be qualified to be the president, then say all politicians are pretty much the same.
So since Romney doesn't have those "human identity" issues, and one politician is much like the other, it really doesn't make any difference if Romney is president or BO?
How so?Drachasor said:
He has a proven track record of leadership. BO had none. BO now has a proven failed track record of leadership.
bikerdruid
Philosopher
obama never had a chance.
your republican whackos blocked every attempt at change....every single one.
you folks really have no idea what is going on in your own country, or are purposefully obtuse.
it is rather funny, actually.
republican=good
democratic=evil
......is all you are able to process.
So what programs do you think shouldn't be cut? Do you think Social Security, Medicare, the military, etc, etc, etc all need to be cut down tremendously?
The 999 plan will simply not generate enough revenue. It would hurt low income people, as sales tax is extremely regressive. It is really just giving a whole bunch of tax breaks to the rich and then taxing the middle and lower classes tremendously (and no, those classes don't have the money to make up the difference).
How can you possibly say such a plan is remotely responsible?
Leading a business is different than leading a country. A business can fire people it doesn't like. A country has to still take care of people the leader doesn't like. One requires a heck of a lot more understanding and compassion than the other. That's not to say a business leader can't have those qualities, but Cain has demonstrated that he personally does not.
How about focusing on the previous questions, or are you more comfortable with the troofers method of discussion: "Well what about this, what about that..."
republican=evil
democratic=good
......is all you are able to process.
I'm not running for president. What has Cain said needs to be cut tremendously?
So low income people shouldn't have to pay for the government services that they use disproportionately more of?
Because it's fair and has the potential of working quite well. http://axdwhiteman.info/index.php/component/content/article/102-can-herman-cains-999-plan-work
You don't get the results in business that Cain has by just firing everybody you don't like.
I'm much more comfortable with someone with proven business experience over a failed president and former community organizer.
mhaze
Banned
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- 15,718
Well you don't get perfect.
Not that the country's going to elect your personal idea of perfect, anyway.
And I guess all the European countries, with their VAT, and all the states, with their sales taxes, as well as the tax of Canada, are examples of the stupidity that you would attribute to Cain?
Choices?
We could choose to have a proven leader skilled in economics and practical business lead, among others, the poor and the queers.
That's a choice the country could make.
Not that it'd matter to you, like lots of those on this forum, you don't live in the USA.
TimCallahan
Philosopher
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Looking up Cain's 9-9-9 plan, I see that it is a flat 9% personal income tax, a 9% flat corporate tax and a 9% national sales tax; in all of these, no exceptions, no deductions.
Right off the bat, I can see some problems. For example, there's the problem of the really poor. If someone makes only $10,000.00 per year, can they afford to pay a $900.00 federal income tax? Probably not. So, there would have to be exemptions for those at the poverty level.
Has anyone actually done the math on this plan? It shouldn't be that hard to figure out if it can or cannot support our government.
bikerdruid
Philosopher
when the beaver sleeps beside the elephant, every movement of the elephant is important.
That's kind of the point. He proposes a tax system that won't raise enough revenue and then doesn't talk about what has to be cut.
Fundamentally, they can't afford to pay for it. Do you think they should go hungry and eliminate food stamps? Do you think the disabled should not have Medicaid? Do you think the elderly shouldn't have a place to live or medical care? Etc, etc, etc?
The rich CAN afford to pay more. They can easily afford to do it. The richer you are, the more you can afford to pay with essentially no noticeable loss.
Regressive taxation is fundamentally NOT fair. People who are poorer will pay a higher percentage of their income in taxes, since more of their income is used to buy things.
Wow, a talk show analysis? Really?
It assumes a significant sales tax won't decrease sales? Btw, sales tax also hurts the economy. Personally I think it should be done away with to encourage people to purchase more and have more money flowing.
Oh, and he magically assumes the plan will result in a lot of growth? Rather like record profits for corporations has resulted in a great deal of growth lately? Oh wait, it hasn't. Hilarious.
Got any links that don't depend on magic and government costs remaining constant? Heck, going by their magic, our current system will be fine in just a year or two longer.
And it has such funny comments like:
"let's just make numbers up!" Of course, it ignores the fact that Capital Gains taxes would go down under the 999 plan. No particular reason to shift things out of it. Overall revenue from business would go down NOT up.
Not everyone, but you can do your best to avoid hiring people with disabilities. You don't have to care about gay rights. Etc, etc. You can run a very successful business and be a complete moron on these matters. Certainly it doesn't seem like Cain is very knowledgeable here, and in fact preaches things that are flat-out false. He doesn't have an interest in learning what is right as he has commented on believing something without the facts to back it up.
And here's the attribution error. It's the SYSTEM that is failing, not any one person in it. It's the entire election and government that needs reform, and not in the tax code, but in how they bend over backwards for corporations and other sources of big money and financing.
Could Obama be better? Sure. He could be loads and loads better. He's a significant step up from the last guy though. Seems like Cain would be a significant step back.
Considering the math down to support it uses magic numbers to make it even with what we get today, yeah, it is pretty clear it wouldn't fly.
Note, the poor having to pay sales tax would be a net increase in the taxes they pay. It will also make people buy less (basic economics).
You have to remember that current tax rates are much higher than this. Income tax would revenue would go down tremendously. Businesses could still shift profits overseas. Capital Gains tax would go down from 15%. Sales tax would be new, but would badly hit the people that don't need to be hit and hurt economic growth and prosperity.
I stand by saying that the plan is insane.
Appeal to emotion noted. They buy stuff, they have to pay the tax. They have income, they have to pay the tax.
So says the communists and liberals. It's totally fair. Those that consume more and earn more, pay more. Everyone pays the same percentage.
True but it's up to the president to fix the system. He's failed.