Could the very high rate of mental illness in Europe be related to religion decline?

[AdMan]

You are not using the link from my OP and you did not present any link.

Bottom line is that almost 2 in 5 Europeans as of 2011 have some sort of mental illness according to the link in post #1. Show me a study that says as of 2011 almost 2 in 5 Americans have a mental illness.

You are being dishonest.

In order to make a fair comparison, the studies would need to use the exact same parameters. The original article you linked to makes this clear.

 

[elipse]

I just went to another website, http://www.nmha.org/go/state-ranking, and found that for rates of chronic depression, state by state, the top ten were:

1. South Dakota
2. Hawaii
3. New Jersey
4. Iowa
5. Maryland
6. Minnesota
7. Louisiana
8. Illinois
9. North Dakota
10. Texas
<snip>
If loss of religion is involved, why isn't irreligious California up there in the number 1 spot?

Orange county and their god-fearing ways keep us on the straight and narrow. Otherwise we'd have been tossed into the sea by a vengeful deity long ago.

It's 'cause god loves both christians and oranges. Fact!

 

[Novest]

Coming from 2 point of views based both on experience, i agree and disagree to the original post.

Agreeing - Everyone is born sane, unless you, your body has a malfunction (same as a computer, machine etc) Believing in Heaven and Hell, Good and Evil, all diagnoses related to mental illness is a simple fact - Demons like to play with brains like doctors do, that one voice you think with, pineal gland(third eye), as do Angels and other spiritual entities. So DOC is right in saying the more mental illness around is a directed relation to a religion decline, hence more Demons around doing their job, unless by mistake the good guys overdone something the user cant handle, much like drugs, results vary on individuals.


Disagreeing - No such thing as Heaven and Hell, therefor no such thing as Demons or Angels, spiritual entities so on; playing, sending a message or visions. Drug related effects, and body malfunction pretty make the primary 2.

 

[joobz]

You are not using the link from my OP and you did not present any link.

Why should he? That link you presented has been evaluated by a number of people already. (in posts you choose to ignore)
An analysis has been made. Your argument is clearly stupid.

Bottom line is that almost 2 in 5 Europeans as of 2011 have some sort of mental illness according to the link in post #1.

Illness including sleep apnea and insomnia.

Show me a study that says as of 2011 almost 2 in 5 Americans have a mental illness.

Here you go.

http://www.nimh.nih.gov/statistics/1ANYDIS_ADULT.shtml

46% of Americans will have had a DSM-IV disorder some time in their life. And this is by a narrower set of conditions than what was listed in your OP report.

 

[Leumas]

Why should he? That link you presented has been evaluated by a number of people already. (in posts you choose to ignore)
An analysis has been made. Your argument is clearly stupid.


Illness including sleep apnea and insomnia.


Here you go.
http://www.nimh.nih.gov/statistics/1ANYDIS_ADULT.shtml 46% of Americans will have had a DSM-IV disorder some time in their life. And this is by a narrower set of conditions than what was listed in your OP report.

I've had that feeling for a long time now that almost all around me are NUTS....now I KNOW they are.....oh well.

 

[Minoosh]

From the study: "A direct comparison of the prevalence of mental illnesses in other parts of the world was not available because different studies adopt varying parameters."

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed personal comment

And I have one of those general-belief-in-God type things.

If you include dementia and alcohol dependency, as this study is doing, and perhaps anxiety, well, yeah - but none of those really meet my bar for "mentally ill." Admittedly I'm defining it fairly narrowly, as psychosis or any compulsive disorder so extreme it rules out a reasonably normal life. I don't count Alzheimer's as "mentally ill," more likely a neurological disorder that becomes more apparent in countries with higher life expectancy. Which is in itself a problem, but doesn't demonstrate any correlation with religious belief.

 

[TimCallahan]

You are not using the link from my OP and you did not present any link.

Bottom line is that almost 2 in 5 Europeans as of 2011 have some sort of mental illness according to the link in post #1. Show me a study that says as of 2011 almost 2 in 5 Americans have a mental illness.

From what I recall of the link you cited in the OP: (1) it didn't compare Europe and America; (2) two of the four most common mental disorders were strokes and various dementias, such as Alzheimer's. Obviously neither of these are related to religion, but are instead physical disorders.

Then, of course, we have this qoute from Joobz post # 163:

Here you go.

http://www.nimh.nih.gov/statistics/1ANYDIS_ADULT.shtml

46% of Americans will have had a DSM-IV disorder some time in their life. And this is by a narrower set of conditions than what was listed in your OP report.

 

[DOC]

F...46% of Americans will have had a DSM-IV disorder some time in their life. And this is by a narrower set of conditions than what was listed in your OP report.

Were not talking about over a lifetime we are talking at any given time, they are very different figures.

50% of Americans might get a broken bone at some point in their lifetime. That is a very different figure than the figure of the number of Americans that have a broken bone at the current time.

 

[dafydd]

Were not talking about over a lifetime we are talking at any given time, they are very different figures.

50% of Americans might get a broken bone at some point in their lifetime. That is a very different figure than the figure of the number of Americans that have a broken bone at the current time.

Irrelevant.

 

[Akhenaten]

Were not talking about over a lifetime we are talking at any given time, they are very different figures.

50% of Americans might get a broken bone at some point in their lifetime. That is a very different figure than the figure of the number of Americans that have a broken bone at the current time.

If mental illness is related to a lack of religiosity then does one have to find religion in order to recover from a mental illness?

Show your working.

 

[Craig B]

If mental illness is related to a lack of religiosity then does one have to find religion in order to recover from a mental illness?

Show your working.

Which religion works best and why? I'm not sure if St Francis Xavier's Catholic missionary work helped to alleviate mental stress in Japan in 1552:

One of the things that most pains and torments these Japanese is that we teach them that the prison of hell is irrevocably shut. For they grieve over the fate of their departed children, of their parents and relatives; and they often show their grief by their tears. So they ask us if there is any hope….and I am obliged to answer that there is absolutely none. The grief at this affects and torments them wonderfully; they almost pine away with sorrow…

On this sort of religiosity, which was the dominant one until recently, Baron d'Holbach observed, not that it cured mental illness, but

People have suffered and become insane for centuries by the thought of eternal punishment after death. Wouldn't it be better to depend on blind matter (...) than a god who puts out traps for people, invites them to sin, and allows them to sin and commit crimes he could prevent. Only to finally get the barbarian pleasure to punish them in an excessive way, of no use for himself, without them changing their ways and without their example preventing others from committing crimes.

 

[nvidiot]

Were not talking about over a lifetime we are talking at any given time, they are very different figures.

50% of Americans might get a broken bone at some point in their lifetime. That is a very different figure than the figure of the number of Americans that have a broken bone at the current time.

Does the original link you posted make such a distinction in identification of mental illness?

Can you show evidence that the rates of mental illness by either set of criteria is higher in Europe than the US?

 

[Novest]

If mental illness is related to a lack of religiosity then does one have to find religion in order to recover from a mental illness?

Show your working.

No offense Akhenaten but that is quite a crude asking.. Religion isnt air, you don't complain when your not getting enough, its more a tree that supplies the air to keep us loving, hating, insane, sane you name it. So by asking for research or evidence in whether a tree would help someone who cant breathe pretty much supplies its own working. If you don't like the metaphor or parable so to speak, then well doesn't a family help eachother?

And need i remind you, all atheist out there, the court officially made you guys a religion, step up your family and help them if they have a mental illness and do better then any other religion you frown upon.

 

[pakeha]

^^^

And need i remind you, all atheist out there, the court officially made you guys a religion, step up your family and help them if they have a mental illness and do better then any other religion you frown upon.

Could you source that court decision, please?
And what does you mean by that suggestion?
That atheists don't look after their families?

 

[Frank Merton]

No one seems to address the obvious possibility that societies where religion is less pervasive are more honest about the occurrence of things like mental illness and suicide.

 

[Akhenaten]

No offense Akhenaten but that is quite a crude asking.. Religion isnt air, you don't complain when your not getting enough, its more a tree that supplies the air to keep us loving, hating, insane, sane you name it. So by asking for research or evidence in whether a tree would help someone who cant breathe pretty much supplies its own working. If you don't like the metaphor or parable so to speak, then well doesn't a family help eachother?

The good news is that I couldn't possibly be offended.

The less-good news is that it's because I don't have the foggiest what you're saying.

And need i remind you, all atheist out there, the court officially made you guys a religion, step up your family and help them if they have a mental illness and do better then any other religion you frown upon.

Umm . . .

I see pakeha has already asked you for details about this alleged court decision, so I'll content myself with asking on what basis you're implying that atheists aren't at least as caring of family members afflicted by mental illness as the religious are.

 

[joobz]

Were not talking about over a lifetime we are talking at any given time, they are very different figures.

50% of Americans might get a broken bone at some point in their lifetime. That is a very different figure than the figure of the number of Americans that have a broken bone at the current time.

So you DO recognize the importance of comparing statistics fairly.
Thank you for this. You just proved how dishonest and deceitful you really are.

So when you compared the OP report numbers with other American mental illness figures, you were knowingly and willfully being dishonest.


Congrats DOC, your argument has been nothing but a stupid dishonest lie.

 

[Mojo]

You are not using the link from my OP and you did not present any link.

Bottom line is that almost 2 in 5 Europeans as of 2011 have some sort of mental illness according to the link in post #1. Show me a study that says as of 2011 almost 2 in 5 Americans have a mental illness.

DOC, the study you linked to found relatively high levels because it used a very broad definition of mental illness.

Others have linked to figures arrived at by using the same criteria for the US and European countries that show that the US has higer levels of diagnosed mental illness.

You lose.

 

[joobz]

No offense Akhenaten but that is quite a crude asking.. Religion isnt air, you don't complain when your not getting enough, its more a tree that supplies the air to keep us loving, hating, insane, sane you name it. So by asking for research or evidence in whether a tree would help someone who cant breathe pretty much supplies its own working. If you don't like the metaphor or parable so to speak, then well doesn't a family help eachother?

Using this weak definition, you make is seem that religion is easily replaced by any other thing that can provide support. In this way, I agree with you. Religion, as a support network, is very helpful. But so is the chess club, warhammer 40K groups, dance class, book clubs....

And need i remind you, all atheist out there, the court officially made you guys a religion, step up your family and help them if they have a mental illness and do better then any other religion you frown upon.

If you are happy with calling a lack of belief in god and a specific belief in god both religion, you are welcome to it.

I generally don't call not-swimming a sport, but to each their own.

 

[Novest]

^^^

Could you source that court decision, please?
And what does you mean by that suggestion?
That atheists don't look after their families?

I saw an active article on it a few weeks ago which the headline read something like Supreme court rules Atheism a religion. Cant find it but here it a something else which dates back to 2005 on similar ground, sorry i cant provide the recent article i saw.

world.wide.web.wnd.com/?pageId=31895

I was only suggesting something you guys are already suggesting about everyone elses religion..

The good news is that I couldn't possibly be offended.

The less-good news is that it's because I don't have the foggiest what you're saying.

I see pakeha has already asked you for details about this alleged court decision, so I'll content myself with asking on what basis you're implying that atheists aren't at least as caring of family members afflicted by mental illness as the religious are.

Seriously? you don't understand the concept? Religion = Tree, Free Choice = Air, we need both. But like i said, iam only suggesting something you guys are also.