Could the very high rate of mental illness in Europe be related to religion decline?

[H'ethetheth]

I was surprised to see just how high the figures for mental illness are in Europe.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44394646/#.Tma_hI672_I

I maintain that an increase in secularism and decrease in religiosity could be a major reason.

Somehow this argument reminds me of this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:PiratesVsTemp(en).svg

 

[Agatha]

From the article:
"38 percent of the population suffering each year from a brain disorder such as depression, anxiety, insomnia or dementia"
That is a wide swath of disorders. I went into the report and found that the defined these 38% as anyone who was reported to have any one of the following conditions
Alcohol dependence
Opioid dependence (drug dep)
Cannabis dependence (drug dep)
Psychotic disorders
Major depression
Bipolar disorder
Panic disorder
Agoraphobia
Social phobia
Generalized anxiety dis.
Specific phobias
OCD
PTSD
Somatoform disorders
Anorexia nervosa (eating dis.)
Bulimia nervosa (eating dis.)
Borderline personality dis
Dissocial personality dis
Hyperkinetic dis./ADHD
Pervasive dev. dis./autism
Conduct disorders
Mental retardation
Insomnia
Hypersomnia
Narcolepsy
Sleep apnoea
Dementias

With the current economic climate and based upon the disorders listed, which includes drug abuse, insomnia, and anxiety, I am actually surprised the percentage was only 38%. I would have thought it higher.

Also note DOC, which you are claiming (and yes claiming- I don’t care if you use weasel words), that there is a common cause (reduced religion) for things like mental retardation, dementia(including Alzheimer’s) and sleep apnea. I don't think I need to explain the stupidity of such an assertion.

DOC, you can see from the above that mental illness is being used in a very wide sense, and it may be that the incidence of mental illness from a more religious country would be at least as great as Europe when all the above disorders are considered.

It also may be the case that with our universal healthcare free at the point of delivery, diagnosis rates are higher as there are no financial barriers to accessing healthcare.

 

[iknownothing]

On the up side, though, the figures for demonic possession is at an all time low.

Add to this that many that suffer from anxiety attacks and depression in a religious society might indentify such disorders as normal, church-sanctioned religious guilt and thus never seek the medical aid they need, I think the OP actually has a point:

Good point, although I don't think that's how the OP meant it. But I'm trying and failing to think of a mental illness that a religious person won't interpret as a moral failure and/or test from God. But take away the religious aspect and it will be defined & treated as an illness.

 

[Lothian]

On the positive side the study found that 165 million is 38% of the European population. This means that the population is 434 million. Given 2 years ago the population of Europe was 852 million we all have about twice as much space as we used to.

 

[joobz]

As a continuation to my previous post,
I couldn't find a perfect comparison with the US,
but from this study in 2005, we have a 12 month incidence rate of 26.2%
http://archpsyc.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/62/6/617
In the same year, a similar study was performed and found the 12 month incidence rate to be 27.4%
http://www.ecnp.eu/~/media/Files/ecnp/communication/reports/ECNP EBC Report.ashx

I am not sure if this is a significant difference or not, but I can say that the same subcategory of disorders was identified as having an incidence of rate of 27.1%, which suggests that these disorders could be declining.

 

[Agatha]

On the positive side the study found that 165 million is 38% of the European population. This means that the population is 434 million. Given 2 years ago the population of Europe was 852 million we all have about twice as much space as we used to.

Excellent! I will knock my neighbour's house down to give me a bigger garden.

 

[Darat]

On the positive side the study found that 165 million is 38% of the European population. This means that the population is 434 million. Given 2 years ago the population of Europe was 852 million we all have about twice as much space as we used to.

I expect that's an unintended consequence of decriminalising sacrificing babies.

 

[joobz]

On the positive side the study found that 165 million is 38% of the European population. This means that the population is 434 million. Given 2 years ago the population of Europe was 852 million we all have about twice as much space as we used to.

While funny,
the study says:
"Conducted in an EU-27 country, plus Iceland, Norway and Switzerland (the total number of European countries included was 30)"
which has a population of 515million. It's still off, but not anywhere near as bad.

Note that the study did not consider Russia (Pop ~140million).

 

[Foster Zygote]

Note that the study did not consider Russia (Pop ~140million).

Considering that Russians make vodka from potatoes, beets, whiskey, furniture and grief, that might have skewed the data.

 

[Schrodinger's Cat]

Aside from mental health services being improved, one also needs to take into account how much the stigma of mental illness and seeking help for mental illness has decreased in past decades.

In addition, standard of living has increased as well, as has health care coverage. People are more likely to be able to afford mental health care. And in general, they also have the luxury to care about their mental health. When you're not wholly consumed with worry by the day to day necessities of life, feeding your family, paying the rent, etc you have the time and ability to care about the fact that you are anxious, depressed, etc.

It's a lot easier to get help for your anxiety disorder when you aren't working 12 hour days for chump change and have no insurance coverage for mental health.

I would like to point out that Utah, possibly the most religious state in the nation, has the highest depression rate in the United States.

It's worth noting that the study actually covers "brain disorders" rather than "mental illness" and thus also includes conditions such as age dementia, epilepsy, multiple sclerosis and stroke.

This is an extremely important point. The inclusion of mental disorders due to disease, injury, and old age means that these hightened rates of disorders are impacted by the fact that people who would in the past have just died from such conditions are now surviving them, but with the mental disabilities that come from such disorders.

We've seen the same phenomena in the military. Better equipment keeps soldiers increased chances of living through through head impacts which would have been fatal in the past, but of course this also results in more live soldiers with brain injuries.

 

[CriticalSock]

On the positive side the study found that 165 million is 38% of the European population. This means that the population is 434 million. Given 2 years ago the population of Europe was 852 million we all have about twice as much space as we used to.

Oh NO! The Germans are at it again!

 

[TimCallahan]

Well, according to this....

http://yourlife.usatoday.com/health...ill-suffer-from-mental-health-woes/50250702/1

... the heathen Europeans might be fairing a little better than your "Christian Nation" Doc.

Yes, as not_so_new's site points out, 50% of Americans vs. 38% of Europeans suffering from mental illness severely undercut's DOC's claim. Further, according to DOC's site the four most disabling conditions are depression, Alzheimer's and other dementias, alcoholism and stroke. Of the these four, two - dementias and strokes - are physical disorders associated with aging. These level are going to go up as the population ages, due to better health care. Alcoholism has plagued many northern European countries for centuries, and religion has little effect on it. Likewise, depression, particularly in the form of seasonal affective disorder, is also endemic in those countries.

I notice that DOC, having kicked the ant hill, hasn't responded to any of these objections.

 

[The Norseman]

On the positive side the study found that 165 million is 38% of the European population. This means that the population is 434 million. Given 2 years ago the population of Europe was 852 million we all have about twice as much space as we used to.

So the Rapture started in Europe then?

 

[Roadtoad]

So the Rapture started in Europe then?

Nah. Cleveland. They just haven't caught on.

 

[DOC]

I maintain that an increase in secularism and decrease in religiosity could be a major reason {for the high mental illness rate in Europe}.

Why?

From the article entitled: "Religion”

“Each religion asserts that it is a means by which its adherents may come into closer contact with God, Truth, and Spiritual Power. They all promise to free adherents from spiritual bondage, and bring them into spiritual freedom. It naturally follows that a religion which frees its adherents from deception, sin, and spiritual death will have significant mental health benefits. Abraham Maslow's research after World War II showed that Holocaust survivors tended to be those who held strong religious beliefs (not necessarily temple attendance, etc), suggesting it helped people cope in extreme circumstances.”

http://creationwiki.org/Religion
____

Also it is logical to conclude that the closer you are to universal truth the happier or more fulfilled you will be over the long term. This is not to say there aren’t some happy (or at least temporarily happy) atheists out there, but it is possible that they could be even happier if they were closer to the truth (if atheism was not in reality true).

This could also apply to societies, if a society is in touch with universal laws and truth it would be logical to assume that that society as a whole will be better functioning and its citizens as a whole will have better mental health. If secularism is the closest to truth of all belief systems it would seem Europe should have a lower mental health problem.

 

[Akhenaten]

I maintain that an increase in secularism and decrease in religiosity could be a major reason {for the high mental illness rate in Europe}.

Why?

From the article entitled: "Religion”

<snip someone else's answer>

In other words, your answer to the question is that you read it on some idiotic apologetics website.

How novel.

 

[zooterkin]

From the article entitled: "Religion”

“Each religion asserts that it is a means by which its adherents may come into closer contact with God, Truth, and Spiritual Power. They all promise to free adherents from spiritual bondage, and bring them into spiritual freedom. It naturally follows that a religion which frees its adherents from deception, sin, and spiritual death will have significant mental health benefits. Abraham Maslow's research after World War II showed that Holocaust survivors tended to be those who held strong religious beliefs (not necessarily temple attendance, etc), suggesting it helped people cope in extreme circumstances.”

http://creationwiki.org/Religion
____

Also it is logical to conclude that the closer you are to universal truth the happier or more fulfilled you will be over the long term. This is not to say there aren’t some happy (or at least temporarily happy) atheists out there, but it is possible that they could be even happier if they were closer to the truth (if atheism was not in reality true).

This could also apply to societies, if a society is in touch with universal laws and truth it would be logical to assume that that society as a whole will be better functioning and its citizens as a whole will have better mental health. If secularism is the closest to truth of all belief systems it would seem Europe should have a lower mental health problem.

Sorry, you seem to have skipped the step where you established that religion was true. I also notice Wilbur put in an appearance. Are you now conceding that atheism may be well-founded?

 

[iknownothing]

Also it is logical to conclude that the closer you are to universal truth the happier or more fulfilled you will be over the long term.

Why?

Wouldn't that make it really easy to discover "universal truth"? Whatever makes people happiest for the longest must be true.

 

[joobz]

From the article entitled: "Religion”

“Each religion asserts that it is a means by which its adherents may come into closer contact with God, Truth, and Spiritual Power. They all promise to free adherents from spiritual bondage, and bring them into spiritual freedom. It naturally follows that a religion which frees its adherents from deception, sin, and spiritual death will have significant mental health benefits. Abraham Maslow's research after World War II showed that Holocaust survivors tended to be those who held strong religious beliefs (not necessarily temple attendance, etc), suggesting it helped people cope in extreme circumstances.”

http://creationwiki.org/Religion
____

Given the evidenced presented in posts #43, 50, and 57d, that argument is completely stupid.

Also it is logical to conclude that the closer you are to universal truth the happier or more fulfilled you will be over the long term.

That's even stupider. How can you be closer to the universal truth when you don't even bother to know the truths here?

This could also apply to societies, if a society is in touch with universal laws and truth it would be logical to assume that that society as a whole will be better functioning and its citizens as a whole will have better mental health. If secularism is the closest to truth of all belief systems it would seem Europe should have a lower mental health problem.

and this is the stupidest of all.
To understand why, read post #50 and #57.

 

[iknownothing]

Sorry, you seem to have skipped the step where you established that religion was true.

Well, apparently it's because he thinks it makes people happy and fulfilled.

So if close to 40% of Europeans experience some sort of mental illness (including stroke & dementia!), then those numbers must be higher than in a Christian country like the US. Which must mean that Europeans are unhappy and unfulfilled compared to Americans. Therefore, God.