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Continuation Part 3 - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

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Rolfe said:
I do feel so sorry for the Kercher family. If Amanda and Rafealle are acquitted, as seems likely, will they ever come to accept that Rude Guede alone (or just possibly with unidentified others though I have to ask, if so where is their DNA?) killed their daughter? Or are they going to be eaten up forever by the conviction that the killers "got away with it"?

Rolfe.
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The truth is equally available to them as it is to us.

I sympathize with them for their lost daughter. But persecuting an innocent person--whether or not they believe they are in the right--is a different issue. The fact that they are so emotionally invested in guilt is a prime example of why victims' families should not be active litigants in the guilt stage of a criminal trial.
 
Diocletus said:
The truth is equally available to them as it is to us.

I sympathize with them for their lost daughter. But persecuting an innocent person--whether or not they believe they are in the right--is a different issue. The fact that they are so emotionally invested in guilt is a prime example of why victims' families should not be active litigants in the guilt stage of a criminal trial.
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Yes, I know. But their daughter was murdered in horrific circumstances. That is not conducive to a calm and rational appraisal of the evidence. I've seen the same thing with Lockerbie relatives. Their grief is so raw that they simply cannot look at the evidence that the guy who was convicted actually had nothing to do with the atrocity. It's not a rational situation, and it's absolutely horrible for them.

I agree that it is a prime reason why the victim or the family of the victim should not be involved in the criminal process though.

Rolfe.
 
komponisto said:
How interesting.
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I see that La Barbie has learned a thing or two from Nancy Grace. (Whenever, really good news is being announced for the defense on a case where Grace has shilled for a guilty verdict she (Grace) is a no show on her TV show).
 
Sometimes guilters seem to forget the new evidence. The DNA evidence discussed today has been around and known for years. The guilters always seem to forget about it.

A test for Alzheimer’s disease includes showing a series of simple pictures to an individual and then seeing how many he can recall. Someone with final stage Alzheimer’s would not only forget where he left the car, but what the car keys are for.

I can’t understand how guilters would feel such grief over the loss of the validity of the DNA evidence that they would be in denial over it.

Is there a proper name for the guilter syndrome?

Do they just want to be antagonists for the sake of discussion?

Are they new to the discussions?
 
Rolfe said:
Yes, I know. But their daughter was murdered in horrific circumstances. That is not conducive to a calm and rational appraisal of the evidence. I've seen the same thing with Lockerbie relatives. Their grief is so raw that they simply cannot look at the evidence that the guy who was convicted actually had nothing to do with the atrocity. It's not a rational situation, and it's absolutely horrible for them.

I agree that it is a prime reason why the victim or the family of the victim should not be involved in the criminal process though.

Rolfe.
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The Kercher family have not been involved in the criminal process; they gave evidence in the original trial and as far as I am aware have not returned.

You are probably right though I doubt Ron Goldman or Nicole Brown’s family will ever accept OJ Simpson’s verdict and I am sure there are people who will never accept Casey Anthony’s.
 
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Maresca comments

http://www.tgcom.mediaset.it/cronaca/articoli/articolo1016636.shtml :

14:35 - La famiglia di Meredith Kercher, la studentessa inglese uccisa a Perugia, sta vivendo "in modo molto preoccupato" gli ultimi sviluppi del processo d'appello a Raffaele Sollecito e ad Amanda Knox, condannati in primo grado a 26 e 25 anni di reclusione. Lo rivela il loro avvocato Francesco Maresca. I Kercher sontono "questa leggera atmosfera secondo la quale sembra che finora si sia giocato". Ma "le contestazioni sono le solite" aggiunge il legale.

2:35 pm - The family of Meredith Kercher, the English student killed in Perugia, is watching the latest developments in the appeal trial of Raffaele Sollecito and Amanda Knox, sentenced at the first level to 26 and 25 years in prison, "with a great deal of concern", according to their attorney, Francesco Maresca. The Kerchers feel [the effects of] "this light atmosphere according to which everything up to now has apparently been a game". But "the objections are the usual ones", he added.
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CoulsdonUK said:
The Kercher family have not been involved in the criminal process; they gave evidence in the original trial and as far as I am aware have not returned.
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They do have legal representation in the present proceedings though, I believe. A representative who seems very invested in maintaining the guilt of Knox and Sollecito, more than simply discovering the truth, it would seem.

CoulsdonUK said:
You are probably right though I doubt Ron Goldman or Nicole Brown’s family will ever accept OJ Simpson’s verdict and I am sure there are people who will never accept Casey Anthony’s.
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I can imagine it might be very difficult to look at the Simpson evidence and see that the guy had nothing to do with the atrocity though. Similarly, there are many aspects of the Casey Anthony case which suggest culpability, if not for the charges brought, for negligence.

If you're saying this case is comparable, I have to disagree with you.

Rolfe.
 
HumanityBlues said:
So is anyone here still going to try to say the independent report is *neutral at best*?
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not me.
it was the independent results, not the defense.

matter of fact i wish they would move on to the "other proof", like the bathmat and have a neutral party make a final decision on that too.

we already know what the prosecution and Stefanoni are going to say because they're agitated and got served. It will be a predictable waste of time to hear them yelp about the recent knife and clasp findings.

the "other proof" needs to be addressed now. I'm thinking the bathmat.
Mainly because I think anything from the bathroom Meredith and Amanda shared is inconclusive, leaving the bathmat more serious.
 
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Doug Bremner tweeted:

Italian papers reporting: Independent experts show video of evidence collection and point out all the mistakes, people laughing. Amanda Knox
 
Has anyone heard if they addressed RS's DNA on the bra clasp, and Stefanoni's interpretations that were discussd in the C&V report? Also the possible DNA of other male individuals?
 
Had to step out for a few hours, looks like it wrapped up quickly today and a great day for the defense. I never did see a comment if Stefi was there, did anyone else? Thanks to HB for the updates. Next hearing for cross examination on the 30th. The laughter is a pretty telling statement, in my opinion.
 
RoseMontague said:
Had to step out for a few hours, looks like it wrapped up quickly today and a great day for the defense. I never did see a comment if Stefi was there, did anyone else? Thanks to HB for the updates. Next hearing for cross examination on the 30th. The laughter is a pretty telling statement, in my opinion.
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I agree. Although it has to be remembered that today's proceedings were essentially given over to a presentation by Conti and Vecchiotti explaining their findings. So one would expect the news coming out from the courtroom today to be a reiteration of the conclusions from their DNA report. And that's indeed what we got, plus the added bonus of a detailed critique of the "crack" forensics team at work - courtesy of the crime scene video.

As far as I can tell, this was supposed to have been an uninterrupted presentation - all the cross-examination is supposed to be taking place on Saturday. But the AP report of today's proceedings (presumably AP had a reporter present) makes an interesting observation:

The hearing Monday was a tense one, with the parties frequently challenging the experts. The typically calm Claudio Pratillo Hellmann, the presiding judge, at one point slammed his hand on his desk and shouted, "Quiet!"
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http://www.thestar.com/news/world/a...na-errors-made-in-amanda-knox-case-court-told

Now, I can't imagine that the defence teams were springing up to interrupt Conti/Vecchiotti, so the reasonable inference to draw from this report is that "the parties" being referred to are the prosecutors and Maresca. And it sounds like Hellmann is already losing patience with them :)
 
the parents of the victims

CoulsdonUK said:
You are probably right though I doubt Ron Goldman or Nicole Brown’s family will ever accept OJ Simpson’s verdict and I am sure there are people who will never accept Casey Anthony’s.
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CoulsdonUK,

The parents of the murder victim (Michelle Moore-Bosko) in the Norfolk Four case do not accept that the four men had nothing to do with the crime. Nor did the mother of the murder victim (Doris Jimenez) accept that Eric Volz had nothing to do with her murder, despite an unimpeachable alibi. That is most unfortunate for all concerned. Have you had time to digest the independent DNA report?
EDT
Joseph Dick, one of the Norfolk Four, was probably on his ship in the harbor at the time of the crime. This seems to be the belief of his highly respected commanding officer. Sadly the duty rosters were destroyed before someone made the effort to check them.
 
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