Moonbat alert: Chomksy condemns Bin Laden kill.

[portlandatheist]

nazis and the kkk are not fighting for the freedom of their families.
the nazis took war to other nations, trying to conquer them.
the palestinians are fighting for their own lives and freedoms.
the analogy fails.

The Nazis were conspiracy theorists that believed the protocols of the learned elders of zion was real and that they needed to liberate the world of this horrible oppression. Many Palestinians are motivated by the same delusional conspiracy theories.

 

[Praktik]

The Nazis were conspiracy theorists that believed the protocols of the learned elders of zion was real and that they needed to liberate the world of this horrible oppression. Many Palestinians are motivated by the same delusional conspiracy theories.

Well said. Permission granted people: run wild with the Nazi talk!

 

[WildCat]

I dunno

You really don't know what you'd think of someone who called the Nazis or the KKK "freedom fighters"?

 

[WildCat]

As illustrated on a previous page, Hamas is a collection of factions some of whom are more "hardcore" than others. Others are pragmatic and less inclined towards violence.

Just like the Nazis and the KKK!

But what do you think of people who call the Nazis and the KKK "freedom fighters"?

 

[WildCat]

Well said. Permission granted people: run wild with the Nazi talk!

Why doesn't the analogy fit Praktik? Do explain it if you can. I don't think you can, and I doubt you'll even try. You'll just pull the Thunderous "Godwin" claim to avoid the discussion.

 

[Praktik]

You really don't know what you'd think of someone who called the Nazis or the KKK "freedom fighters"?

I would think they're very confused to apply that to the Nazis.

I can see how one could apply that to the KKK, if I attempt to put myself in the shoes of white "racialists" threatened by the end of slavery in the Reconstruction era, less so nowadays.

In both cases I might suspect there was a high likelihood the person was racist.

I don't think that carries to people saying the same about Hamas though, since I know plenty of non-racists who have the potential of saying the same thing. Like, there's plenty of "freedom fighters" out there that have committed highly odious acts, so I think some direct appreciation of such acts needs to be in evidence before I can conclude that the person loves terror attacks or hates jews. Besides, on such a polarizing issue, there's enough misinformation on both sides to lead the confused to places that are contradictory (ie, calling Hamas "freedom fighters" while NOT hating jews and NOT loving terror attacks).

All that being said, to indulge these questions is to indulge a rather silly methodology: I do not think that answering questions with the object of discussion being replaced by "Nazi" or "KKK" is all that worthwhile an approach, and rather moreso the mark of the intellectually lazy.

Surely there's other ways to get your point across. Might be a fun exercise.

"How can I respond to this post without mentioning the KKK or Nazis?"

Maybe a good question to ask yourself before every post, see how well you do without your favourite crutch!

 

[Praktik]

Why doesn't the analogy fit Praktik? Do explain it if you can. I don't think you can, and I doubt you'll even try. You'll just pull the Thunderous "Godwin" claim to avoid the discussion.

Yes, of course. I'll just fall back on Godwin and miss all the awesome discussion you guys have about the Nazis, and how we can rephrase other people's arguments with the object replaced with the Nazis.

What a loss for me!

 

[IDB87]

For some members of Hamas I'd agree. But I dont think that applies to all in the organization. As illustrated on a previous page, Hamas is a collection of factions some of whom are more "hardcore" than others. Others are pragmatic and less inclined towards violence.

Nah. The military wing of Hamas is the Al-Qassam Brigades,the big dog 'round Gaza as far as fighting goes. They actually got their name from a terrorist who founded the Black Hand, an anti-Zionist, anti-British paramilitary organization (pretty similar to the Irgun and Stern gangs.)

The other 'hardcore' groups are much smaller and not directly affiliated with Hamas. These groups especially aren't a bother, unless they're launching rockets at Israel during a cease-fire.

The actions of the Majlis al-Shura, or Hamas' political wing, do not negate the crimes committed by the Al-Qassam Brigades.

To say you support Hamas as freedom fighters and helpers of the poor is to support the Al-Qassam Brigades (perhaps indirectly at best).

You cannot take the 'good' done by a group like Hamas without contextualizing the bad.

 

[Praktik]

To say you support Hamas as freedom fighters and helpers of the poor is to support the Al-Qassam Brigades (perhaps indirectly at best).

You cannot take the 'good' done by a group like Hamas without contextualizing the bad.

On this last point we agree, though we may disagree on others..

I for one would not be completely comfortable with the term "freedom fighter", I am just suggesting that calling Hamas "freedom fighters" does not absolutely require that the individual saying that love terror attacks and/or hate jews.

 

[bikerdruid]

But what do you think of people who call the Nazis and the KKK "freedom fighters"?

i would call them deluded.

 

[Ziggurat]

i would call them deluded.

... but not murderous. That's reserved for Israelis.

 

[bikerdruid]

... but not murderous. That's reserved for Israelis.

way to miss the point, entirely.
the nazis were diabloically murderous.

 

[Ziggurat]

way to miss the point, entirely.

It would be a lot easier to get the point if you'd actually answer simple questions about your position.

 

[bikerdruid]

You really don't know what you'd think of someone who called the Nazis or the KKK "freedom fighters"?

i would call them deluded.

It would be a lot easier to get the point if you'd actually answer simple questions about your position.

perhaps if you just followed the thread, you would 'keep up'.

 

[Ziggurat]

perhaps if you just followed the thread, you would 'keep up'.

None of those posts answered my question.

 

[bikerdruid]

None of those posts answered my question.

deal with it.
i considered your question purely rhetorical.

 

[Ziggurat]

deal with it.
i considered your question purely rhetorical.

It's not. It's a very factual question, which directly relates to your stated position. In the absence of a response, I will assume the one which is most consistent with your actions.

In other words, you support terrorists.

 

[bikerdruid]

In other words, you support terrorists.

i support earthfirst!, greenpeace and food not bombs, financially, and the right of palestinians to fight for their freedom, morally.
since the u.s. government has identified earthfirst! as a terrorist organization, your statement is, arguably, true.

 

[Bill Thompson]

I am going to put together a blog.

We stomped on a different culture.

Another place and another time was such that Brigham Young would be to Utah as Osama bin Laden would be to Pakistan.

Brigham Young was the original 9-11 religious tyrant. It was just a different year.

USA and Pakistan are as far apart as two worlds could be. It is as if we have broken the Prime Directive.

On second thought, naw, it was great that we took that guy out of existance. Nevermind.

Still, us flying in on stelth choppers is just like Martians coming down and taking out brigham young after the ridge massacre in utah. Come to think of it, that woud be freaking awesome too.

 

[Ziggurat]

i support earthfirst!, greenpeace and food not bombs, financially, and the right of palestinians to fight for their freedom, morally.

I note this hilighted word. You didn't use it before. So why now? What does this "moral" fighting consist of? How does it relate to the actual fighting that's going on? Is the actual fighting moral? And do you support the actual fighting?