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There are truly no atheists in foxholes

fuelair said:
(I hope you don't think he is saying anything supportive of the one the US mostly gets all hot and bothered about).
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Which gods are fake? And I know he's not talking about Christianity (I'm not a Christian).
 
Garrette said:
Any of them.
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I don't have any offhand.

Garrette said:
Both literally and metaphorically. Greer uses it merely as a metaphor, so you can't legitimately complain that I do so, too. I'm atheist. I've been in combat. I didn't pray or even begin to be tempted to believe in a deity. There are many others in the same vein here.
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He didn't say that atheists are never in the military. Just that atheism is VERY rare during trouble times, like societal collapse. It's better if we invest into spirituality because atheism offers us nothing.

Garrette said:
Put your goalposts back, please. Greer wasn't referencing peak US production.
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Uhm, global oil production peaked in 2005, but regardless if it peaks in the future, once it does, industrial civilization is over.
 
He didn't say that atheists are never in the military. Just that atheism is VERY rare during trouble times, like societal collapse. It's better if we invest into spirituality because atheism offers us nothing.
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I want to see EVIDENCE of this.

When was the last time a whole society collapsed, and in that society atheist suddenly "turned" to spiritualism or gods, and fall on their knee praying, which *IS* the definition of "no atheist in foxhole".

Alsmost certainly this is not what happens during a collapse, what happens is that atheist would disappear by attrition with the woo taking over as education drop in favor of get-your-next-meal survival.

And that is a big difference, and adds NOTHING to the validity of theism orn invalidity of atheism, as it only show that when rationality disappear, theism and other woo tend to take over the vaccuum left.
 
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The idiot Archdruid proves his idiocy yet again. If there was a Noble Prize for being wrong on a monumental level, Greer would win easily.
 
lionking said:
The idiot Archdruid proves his idiocy yet again. If there was a Noble Prize for being wrong on a monumental level, Greer would win easily.
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Explain? What do you think he's wrong about here? Religious inclination skyrockets during societal collapse.
 
TFian said:
Explain? What do you think he's wrong about here? Religious inclination skyrockets during societal collapse.
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So, at best, when faced with dire situations people are more likely to believe in false hopes? Could be an interesting psychological study, I guess, but what point are you trying to make? Cause I'm getting Atheists = Happy, Religious = Unhappy.
 
TFian said:
Explain? What do you think he's wrong about here? Religious inclination skyrockets during societal collapse.
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Good to hear. "No religion" was the highest response in the last Australian census. Monumental fail Greer.
 
I actually read a study some years back that referenced how soldiers dying in the battlefield often call out for their mother. It's as if the stress of war and dying is so great that the mind will sometimes regress and long for the protection of the person who provided safety during the years when he needed it most.

I tend to think, on some level, that's the exact same role that god plays for most people who follow a religion like Christianity. That's where this need probably comes from. The more extreme groups like Christian or Muslim fundamentalists even act children; everything in their world tends to be "all good" or "all bad," they're often fearful of the big scary boogeyman world and believe everyone else is out to persecute them, etc.

I think another poster mentioned that institutionalized religion has always led to intolerance, violence, widespread ignorance, etc., and I agree. I'm still not clear on what the OP meant on returning to "spirituality" either. Could you maybe clarify for me?
 
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TFian said:
Given he's an authority in his field, yes.
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And I suppose we have to accept that because he says so too.

But even real authorities never expect us to take their word.

They present things like studies, research, evidence.

You know ... real facts.
 
abaddon said:
Followed by...



Care to explain this 30+ year span for peak oil?
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Domestic peaks of oil are different than global peaks of oil. It's well accepted the US hit peak oil in the 70s, which is why we've had to import oil since then.
 
TFian said:
Given this piece of reality
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He just stated it. Do you have any evidence that he is correct ? Otherwise your premise is false, and whatever conclusion you reach from it is far from certain.

Which gods are fake?
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No supernatural thing exists.

Just that atheism is VERY rare during trouble times, like societal collapse. It's better if we invest into spirituality because atheism offers us nothing.
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And those statements are entirely false.

Religious inclination skyrockets during societal collapse.
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Ah, so your claim is that religion prays on the weak and the desperate ? How is that a good thing ?
 
TFian said:
Explain? What do you think he's wrong about here? Religious inclination skyrockets during societal collapse.
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And his evidence for tbis is ...?

Even if it were true, how would it lead to the conclusion that we should embrace "spirituality" whatever that might mean?
 
I like the multiple non sequiturs

We go from atheists, foxholes, and druids to peak oil and societal collapse being a boom time for religions, even though religions have typically provided a form of societal order and structure.

TFian, you are all over the map on this one.
 
TFian said:
Uhm, global oil production peaked in 2005, but regardless if it peaks in the future, once it does, industrial civilization is over.
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Because we all know there's no source of power or raw materials other than oil.

They used to say the same thing about wood, back in the 19th century when trains and steamboats ran on wood, houses and bridges were built with wood, homes were heated with wood, agricultural fences were built with wood, and people cooked with wood. Trees couldn't grow fast enough and the U.S. in particular was expanding into the prairies and plains where there were already less trees per person.

Yet somehow we managed to survive peak wood without industrial civilization collapsing.
 
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